So, I'm still having issues with getting past that little part of my mind that insists that stabbing myself in the leg with a metal spike is a bad idea.  I'm going to be talking to my doctor on Monday, so in the mean time I would like to get some info from all you wonderful people about my other options.  Specifically I would like to know:

• How much does it cost for Sub-Q T? (With or without insurance?)
• How much does it cost you per month for gel/cream? (With or without insurance?)
• If you are doing the gel or cream, how many times a day do you have to apply it? (Yes, I know YMMV.)
• How quickly do the gels and creams dry?
• Do you find that they leave any unpleasant residue on your clothes/binder?

My endo went with gel, because I had my hysto a month after starting T, so I don't have estrogen to overcome.

I apply the gel once daily after showering.  Supposed to stay on 6 hrs before swimming or washing it off; hasn't been an issue.  I keep it covered with t-shirts so as not to expose my  kids, and wash my hands after applying.

It does take a few minutes to dry, so I usually turn on a fan, which helps (it's alcohol based).  When I travel I have to remember to add a few more minutes to getting ready as there usually isn't a fan available, though I suppose the hair dryer on low would work.

Residue?  No.  I can occasionally see a thin white film on my skin where I applied it, but it doesn't seem to rub off on dark colored clothing.  It's non-greasy and once dry is dry.

I pay a $20 copay but i believe it would be >$200 without insurance a month.


Jay

Sub-Q T is the same stuff as IM, it's all in how you do the injection  (IM = in your muscle, Sub-Q = just under the skin).

Gel can cost up to $300 w/o insurance.

Cream can be cheaper, if you get it compounded.  I once got a 3 month supply for $90.

Gel & Cream are both typically applied once per day.  I found they were both completely dry within about a half hour.  There's no residue left on your clothes if you let it dry.

Quote from: Mister on June 11, 2009, 10:29:32 AM
Sub-Q T is the same stuff as IM, it's all in how you do the injection  (IM = in your muscle, Sub-Q = just under the skin).

So then, why do most people go with IM instead of Sub-Q?  What's the advantage?

Quote from: Jamie-o on June 11, 2009, 05:32:46 PM
So then, why do most people go with IM instead of Sub-Q?  What's the advantage?

I hear there's some magical advantage to sub-q (less testosterone gets metabolized so it is therefore 'more effective'), but looking at it logically it doesn't make any sense.  Why, if testosterone is more successfully administered one way than the other, are the dose the same?  Why don't people on sub-q have more dramatic/faster results? 

Doing a sub-q injection is more of a pain in the ass, honestly.  I don't know why someone would opt for it.

I have no experience with the gel or cream but I'm doing subcutaneous injections. It's the same stuff as intramuscular, and was free for me. I personally would rather be doing IM, but sub-q works the same and is a good option if you don't like the idea of stabbing yourself with a long needle

Has anyone compared the effects of both IM and gels?  I've been doing hormone therapy for approximately the last nine years.  I'm 27 years old and still cannot grow sideburns or a suitable beard! I used IM for the first few months on hormone therapy, but have since been on gels.  Though every time I get my blood tested, my testosterone is in the normal levels, I'm wondering if the gel is not as effective as IM might be.  Anyone have any ideas?

gel is considered to be not as effective for people who have not yet had hysterectomies. 

Chameleon - Why would you rather be doing IM?  It seems to me that the much smaller needle would be less intimidating, but I've never done sub-q shots, so I don't really know what the difference is in the process.  (Obviously IM goes in the muscle and Sub-Q under the skin, but I mean apart from that.)  Where on the body do you inject it?  How is the pain level?  If it's the same stuff as the IM T, how do you get such a thick substance into the syringe?  Am I remembering correctly that you were using 1/2" 28 gauge?

I was on andriol Oral T (the only safe Oral Testosterone available, the others place too much strain on the liver) before I switched to fortnightly shots.  Its prohibitively expensive and I found it to be slower to produce results plus the amount of T your body recieves on a daily basis varies because of the intake system.  that and the fact that you have to remember to take the damm pills every 4 hours or so make this option a no go really in my opinion.  Only reason they even tried it with me is because I was hesitant about the shots but I am so glad I made the switch.  My partner does it for me now every two weeks and I've yet to have any difficulties with them.
My advice, if you can go with the shots.

Quote from: Jamie-o on June 12, 2009, 02:49:31 AM
Chameleon - Why would you rather be doing IM?  It seems to me that the much smaller needle would be less intimidating, but I've never done sub-q shots, so I don't really know what the difference is in the process.  (Obviously IM goes in the muscle and Sub-Q under the skin, but I mean apart from that.)  Where on the body do you inject it?  How is the pain level?  If it's the same stuff as the IM T, how do you get such a thick substance into the syringe?  Am I remembering correctly that you were using 1/2" 28 gauge?

I would rather be doing IM just because sub-q is annoying to inject. You ask about bringing the substance into the syringe. I have to get 2 sets of needles/syringes, both with removable needles. I use the larger needle to pull the substance out then have to switch to the smaller needle to inject it. I inject into my thigh and it's not very painful. On a couple shots I've gotten sore the day after but I would think that would happen with both IM and sub-q

I may have to switch to something else in the future. Or get someone to inject me. Having some mental blocks with it.

Quote from: Nero on June 12, 2009, 03:41:39 PM
I may have to switch to something else in the future. Or get someone to inject me. Having some mental blocks with it.

That's pretty common early on.  After a while, it becomes just another routine task.  Once a week i trim my beard and do my shot.

One of the guys in my area is a nurse and has set up a free shot clinic, which I broke down and made use of this week.  Unfortunately, it's on the other side of Minneapolis, which is a bit of a drive.  It's kind of a nice set-up, though, and has become something of a trans hang-out for a couple hours on Friday afternoons. He has also offered to meet me somewhere in between and shoot me up in the car. I understand he used to meet up with another guy and give him his shot in the men's room of a local restaurant.  Lord knows what the employees thought was going on there!   

Anyway, he also says that it is common for people to develop mental blocks against injecting, sometimes even after years of doing it on their own.  I'm glad I have this resource, but I really need to either get over it, or find me a boyfriend who can do the deed for me.    This business of having to drive for 45 minutes once a week to get my shot is a real pain in the butt. (No pun intended  )

god i am glad i have someone to do it for me..i would do it for myself if i had to tho but i'd much rather have someone else stick me....

I had a complete hysterectomy about 9 years ago also.  There is no female hormones pumping through my body anymore, only the T gel I apply every morning.  Yet still all I can grow is a goatee and a chin beard. 

then it's probably your genetics.  sorry, dude.

I couldn't inject myself, my friend and ex used to do it for me once every two weeks. Leading up to once every week. However I am on the gel now since august last year and it is so much better I put it on every other day as my Dr said that I had to much T in my system that it might start turning to E.

I am fine with the gel

Jay

Quote from: Jay on June 17, 2009, 08:00:58 AM
I couldn't inject myself, my friend and ex used to do it for me once every two weeks. Leading up to once every week. However I am on the gel now since august last year and it is so much better I put it on every other day as my Dr said that I had to much T in my system that it might start turning to E.

I am fine with the gel

Jay

Was that with the gel that you were getting too much T in your system, initially, or only with the injections?

Hiya.
I just had a doctor appt. yesterday in the new town I moved to.  She hasn't had ftm patient before, but has a lot of her patients on various hormones, it's kind of a specialty.  When I first met her last month, she was very kind and welcoming and open to handling labwork for hormones.  I had been waiting to switch to a gel or cream, and so she did labs last month, and yesterday gave me the Androgel prescription.  It's for the packets. 

I did do one dose of it just now, as shot day was usually yesterday.

For the record, I am on disability / Medicare, and it was just a copay of three dollars.  That's way better than me buying the IM supplies myself.  I found the shots a bit stressful, and because of the many meds going on for me, want something that is, ideally, daily, and keeps everything more even.

My T levels, just last month, were showing okay, so it's been staying pretty steadily there.  Having mild panic that this will totally throw me off, and how would I know?  She wants me to wait 2 months til I come in for another level check.

okay, so taking the levels of dose out of here, but I am a bit confused switching from the im to the gel, is my point. 

Glad to be back here, thanks for the hellos, guys.  Been sort of a rough winter.
Joseph