Post removed per request.

Maybe it is better to just ignore the old GID nut for the moment and you will see that you answered your own question - you re a person with a gender identity best classified as "girl", "woman", "feminine" etc, and are not curently contemplating surgery or anything and you are more concerned with your actual physical body than the clothes you put on it. No single word can sum that up can it, and does it need to?

GID is a diagnoses given by a mental health professional, assuming you even believe in it. e.g. I don't consider myself to have a GID but I would be classified as such by others.

How do you see yourself? Do you see your soul as best represented in a female body or a male body?

QuoteI feel that my gender identity can best be classified as "girl", "woman", "feminine" etc.

What's wrong with those?


Janet

It's important to separate the identity and the expression.  You might not find a label that fits, but that's 100% ok.  If the labels are tripping you up, just forget about them.  Is a label going to actually change what you are feeling?  It's not really anyone else's business to tell you what you are or are not, the only opinion about that that matters is yours.
Whether you decide you need to take action on those feelings is another story entirely.

Quote from: Anima on July 19, 2009, 08:09:22 PM
Yeah, I do have some problems with the word "disorder". Exactly what is it that has to be disordered about it? Makes me puzzled.

I heard some helpful things a couple years back in a Townhouse Talk or something like that, with someone in town assisting in research and change for GID definitions.

What about the idea that it isn't YOU that has the disorder, it's our culture that has it?  The culture we live in can't easily process that some of us feel we are different from our biological gender. 

I have come to believe it isn't ME that is disordered on the topic of gender, but I do find I need support dealing with what it takes to be in this culture, with my internal experience of gender (I identify as a man with a transgender medical history, now that I have had some surgeries and Testosterone for more than 2.5 yrs).

You write things that sound like what I used to think -- I thought things had to be WORSE than they were for me to claim being transsexual.  I honestly went to four psychiatrists /psychologists, all with gender specialties (planned it ahead) within one week, to try to get help understanding what I am, and all of them said it sounded like Gender Identity Dysphoria (one wanted to run MMPI and other tests, which I had recently done anyways, others diagnosed me with it in one session, fwiw).  It helped me to talk with them, and get the differing ways of approaching it they had.  and then, having the four diagnoses (basically), it helped me to accept that I could be included.  Not sure if that is similar for you, but seems relevant to the discussion.  You don't have to be in more pain to say you are transsexual / transgendered, friend.  I say, the sooner you can let go of suffering, the better.  It only hurts.
Joseph

There's nothing wrong with the word "disorder" in the literal, clinical sense.  Ignorance and prejudice in society may overload that term to make folks feel that it's used to alienate, rather than simply describe.  That doesn't invalidate it's use in "gender identity disorder", although I personally prefer dysphoria.

Quote from: Anima on July 20, 2009, 09:38:17 AM
A label could maybe validate my problems as something actual. I am kind of feeling like I am not suffering enough to complain about it.

Oh good, you need to suffer more...

I think I understand what you are saying.  I went to a gender clinic years ago, but because I was successful in life pretending to be a man - not on drugs or drink or in jail or living on the street - they wondered why I was even there.   (Evidently I wasn't suffereing enough. )

Don't let the "disorder" word trip you up.  It's a clinical term that is losing favor, I think.  One of the things that helped me was when I read the Wikipedea definition of genderqueer.  I thought: Wow, there's a word for what I am!

A lot of us on this site are some version of what you are, Anima.  Good luck discovering just what that is.

- Kate

Have you ever had powerful maternal instincts, or the inexplicable desire to bear children and nurture them and defend their lives violently?

If not, it's unlikely you're a woman.

Quote from: Blair on July 23, 2009, 03:54:08 AM
Have you ever had powerful maternal instincts, or the inexplicable desire to bear children and nurture them and defend their lives violently?

If not, it's unlikely you're a woman.

Um, that's a bit dogmatic.
I think that many natal women would not qualify under your rules.

Quote from: Blair on July 23, 2009, 03:54:08 AM
Have you ever had powerful maternal instincts, or the inexplicable desire to bear children and nurture them and defend their lives violently?

If not, it's unlikely you're a woman.

I had a powerful instinct to have a child, which I did.  I have a very explicable desire to nurture her, which I do.  I am very willing to defend her life with mine, which fortunately I have not had to do yet.  I thought that just made me her father.

I didn't have a strong desire to have the baby grow within me, but I usually can repress my feelings to fit the possible.  I am not a genetic woman, but judging by how I feel and act since starting hormones and starting to live full time I'm certainly more woman than man.

We don't all fit into neat categories.  One reason most of us go through so much confusion as we try to discover our true selves is that there is no definitive "if this .... that" test.

- Kate

Quote from: Renate on July 23, 2009, 05:48:46 AM
Um, that's a bit dogmatic.
I think that many natal women would not qualify under your rules.

Maternal instincts are pretty much the most powerful, deeply ingrained instincts a woman can have.  They are also very subconscious.  I think they are a good divining rod for seeing whether or not someone is actually a female in these circumstances.  Not an end-all, be-all diagnosis, but definitely a very good indicator, since the standards of care are rather rigorous, and require us to take a long, hard look at our subconscious thoughts, beginning as early as possible.

I'm sorry to hear that Anima.  I hope you get your situation sorted out into something a little less precarious, so you can get into a position where you can at least be comfortable with yourself day to day. 

That nurse was an idiot who probably hates her marriage and neglects her children.  Take heart.

If there is a god in heaven pictures are as close as either of you will ever get to real kids.  They are not romantic notions, they are living beings and need to be treated as such.

Quote from: tekla on July 23, 2009, 12:25:08 PM
If there is a god in heaven pictures are as close as either of you will ever get to real kids.  They are not romantic notions, they are living beings and need to be treated as such.

That's a pretty messed up thing to say.  I've been good with children, and trusted with their care many times throughout my life.  I probably won't adopt any time soon, because I want to bring a child into a world that is very ready and stable and prepared to focus much time, energy and love upon it.  I feel very strongly about proper child-care, and I've seen so many people screwed up by bad parents.

You say something so absolutely harsh because someone has maternal instincts and laments (quietly, not so much that it CRIPPLES their ability to function) their inability to fully satisfy them. 

I don't get it.

Quote from: Anima on July 23, 2009, 12:46:19 PM
If you're going to be rude, at least you should have a reason for it.

I think, based upon a handful of posts on a nearly anonymous forum devoid of tone and actual human contact which would allow for a more clear interpretation of exactly who someone is, Tekla has written you off as a drug-addled nutcase who would probably let her child starve to death, and myself as a bitter, miserable misanthrope who will smother it and shelter it and screw it up psychologically.

I see things differently.  I lived with someone who had a foray into madness and paranoid schizophrenia that was induced by a volatile combination of meth and the wrong anti-depressants.  I saw them and helped them crawl from rock bottom into being a very happy, functional, charming person (like they were in high school, when I knew them.)  I have hope for just about anyone... issues CAN be overcome, I've seen it happen.  Sometimes all people need is a little love and understanding, so that's what I try to give.

As for myself, well... people who have been around me my whole life don't fully understand or know me, but they do know my potential.  I'm going to go out on a limb and say that a person reading my posts on a forum (which are, again, toneless and predisposed to coming off as harsh and negative) doesn't know me, OR my potential.  It's more likely they just enjoy sniping.

I do.  I've actually raised a couple of kids to honorable adulthood and I know its not romantic, not cuddly, but hard demanding work that far from being fulfilling will try and test you to limits that you can't even imagine exist.

Yeah, you get moments.  Watching my two graduate college was pretty cool.  But the decades of constant work required to get them there, that often wasn't so cool.

Quote from: tekla on July 23, 2009, 12:56:57 PM
I do.  I've actually raised a couple of kids to honorable adulthood and I know its not romantic, not cuddly, but hard demanding work that far from being fulfilling will try and test you to limits that you can't even imagine exist.

Yeah, you get moments.  Watching my two graduate college was pretty cool.  But the decades of constant work required to get them there, that often wasn't so cool.

I take it pretty seriously.  That's probably why I have no plans to adopt or raise kids, because I don't trust myself to put them before my career.

My mother put my sister and I on the backburner in favor of her career after the divorce, and I think I'll always subconsciously resent her for it.  I don't want to make the same mistake.

I'm glad your kids turned out well!  I think parenthood brings out the best in people (or it SHOULD), and it's a trial too few really succeed at enduring properly.

Quote from: tekla on July 23, 2009, 12:56:57 PM
I do.  I've actually raised a couple of kids to honorable adulthood and I know its not romantic, not cuddly, but hard demanding work that far from being fulfilling will try and test you to limits that you can't even imagine exist.

Yeah, you get moments.  Watching my two graduate college was pretty cool.  But the decades of constant work required to get them there, that often wasn't so cool.

I'd imagine.  I'll stick with the dog.

I was very lucky in that both of my careers were pretty kid/family friendly.  Once they were 8 or so they had laminates, knew everybody, (knew what they could or could not do) could hang at the club or the show, even be put to work (child labor laws do not apply in show biz, we love child labor).  And in academia kids were always around, mine were library slaves for years, could run a xerox machine before they could ride a bike, and by the time they were like 8 or so again, could find any book I wanted in a library of over 2 million titles. They also learned how to be so cute that sorority girls would do it for them.  That was fine by me, its a valuable life skill.

I didn't tie being maternal to gender, which I don't think it is.