Hi everyone,

I haven't been on here in a while because I've been so sick, but I think i'm on the mend.  I've gone out dancing for the last 3 weekends and really had a blast.  There's a new gblt club that's opened in this very conservative city, and the people there are just lovely.  And dancing my bum off until 3 a.m. seems to have helped in myriad ways.

I've been going out presenting as a female for about 10 years, off and on, and always very seriously, making every effort to pass.  I'm not here to brag, but I've put myself in all kinds of situations (teenage girls, bathrooms, even a frat party once) where I was not read.  Which is what I want...like everyone...to feel as normal as possible.

I feel safe at the gblt club; and I don't really feel safe at any other bars.  The crowd is very mixed, lots of lovely gay boys, lesbians, a few crossdressers and queens (from the weekly show) and plenty of straight girls there that just seem to want to dance and have fun w/o getting hit on.  The lesbians tend to read me after a good long look...and just go on about their business.  That's fine, although I like lesbians a lot as friends and hope they warm up.  The gay guys never read me.  The straight girls either don't read me or utterly pretend that they don't -- i've had some lovely woman to woman interaction, long talks, going to the bathroom together; just good mellow times with GGs who take me for the girl I am.  Most of the TGs read me, but that's just something we're great at.

My question - I've NEVER dated before, except for a few dismal experiences as a guy - and I am just about totally boy crazy at this point.  Don't want to date women, no matter what.  Dream every night of being in a man's arms.  But so far zilch has happened.  It's a weird situation, I guess.  Maybe I just don't know how to flirt, or dance, or give off the right signal; but with all the people there (400 on a busy night) I'd really think a girl like me could get some attention. 

I dress nice; I'm a little overweight but have been told I'm strikingly beautiful.  I wear a size 20 dress, and I think I dress pretty well.  I guess, like most girls, I don't want to make the first move at all...even when I'm on the dancefloor with a guy.  And maybe most of these sweet gay guys don't, either.  After all, they want a man, too.  But these places do attract admirers (especially for the drag shows).

Okay, any advice?  Please be nice, I'm still really learning how to be a girl.

Kelli  

Hi Kellianna (pretty name)

Maybe you've answered your own question? If the gay guys don't read you then you might not be fishing with the right kind of bait, if you know what I mean. You've ruled out girls, so all that's left is the straight guys/admirers. In a crowd of 400 I'm not sure what the percentage of those would be in a primarily gay club in a very conservative city.

I understand about the safety thing, I also feel more comfortable in gay clubs, but I never go out by myself at night in any case, I'm always with at least one other person. Maybe you and a group of your girlfriends could plan a night out sometime and go somewhere there are likely to be a lot of straight, single guys? At least it would give you a chance to flirt up a few of them 

My advice would be to fly by the seat of your pants and live for the moment. Sometimes, you can over-think things and become paralyzed with too much analyzing.

Quote from: Kara on July 20, 2009, 08:33:09 PM
My advice would be to fly by the seat of your pants and live for the moment. Sometimes, you can over-think things and become paralyzed with too much analyzing.

Or you just save yourself from a dangerous mistake.

Quote from: lisagurl on July 20, 2009, 08:38:12 PM
Or you just save yourself from a dangerous mistake.

I suppose there are two ways to look at it...but I think my way is a lot more fun. 

Quote from: Kellianna on July 20, 2009, 07:47:25 PM
[...]
My question - I've NEVER dated before, except for a few dismal experiences as a guy - and I am just about totally boy crazy at this point.  Don't want to date women, no matter what.  Dream every night of being in a man's arms.  But so far zilch has happened.  It's a weird situation, I guess.  Maybe I just don't know how to flirt, or dance, or give off the right signal; but with all the people there (400 on a busy night) I'd really think a girl like me could get some attention. 
[...]

Well, it sounds like your hoping for a straight date in a gay bar, which is unlikely to happen.

I can completely understand that you feel safer in there, as others have said too. I personally don't have much experience of clubs as I don't enjoy them but the few I have strayed into in my youth were just "meat markets" for casual hookups (unless you were just there to dance of course).

Meeting people via the internet can be difficult and frustrating, as that's largely just another virtual "meat market" with an even higher ratio of losers to nice people. The only advantage is that you can try and weed out the losers without making physical contact.

If you're strikingly beautiful, then you'll have no problem getting attention from guys...although you may have the quandry of when to disclose, depending on where you are in your transition etc..  This can be a problem because if you say up front that you're a transitioning girl, you'll get a lot of the wrong type of attention. On the other hand, if you do meet someone and don't tell them, you risk a "Crying Game" moment.  My advice is to disclose early (unless you're post-op and don't want/need to).

Depending on what you're looking for, you may want to consider a trans man. They're guys who should have a better understanding of your situation with no hangups with your transition.

Good luck!

What about asking if any of your glbt friends know of a nice straight guy to set you up with for a blind date?  OR for a nice barbecue or gathering at one of their homes?  I know, proportionally they won't likely know as many straight people, perhaps, as the average "joe", but it might be a way to filter out the more close minded straight guys anyways.  Even if they can't read you, and are totally into you, you may want someone who is generally kind and accepting of variations on the gender and orientation spectrums, since you say you like that bar that is glbt.

straights do socialize with glbts, lol.
some of them, at least.

I wish you all the best.  I must agree, sounds like that bar won't be the most likely place to meet someone.  My other thought is pursuing a hobby / interest.  For example, I like to meditate, so spend time in those groups now, and am not read, and did have one person (guy) interested in dating, which was nice.  We didn't date in the end, but he is a friend.  Now, another guy from that group seems to have interest (I am so not great at reading gay men's signals, but I think he likes me, and I have disclosed my transness, which he was all honoring and appreciative and kind of reverent of.  He has continued to gently flirt via email, and we will get together soon again.....so, seems promising, and we have a LOT in common, value and interest and activity and community wise).

I wish you all the very very best.
Hope you can meet that special someone soon.
Sincerely,
Joseph

Thanks to everyone for their input.  I suppose I left a few things out -- not intentionally but because I have so little time at the computer.  I do seem to pass quite well but am still very insecure about my voice; it's just a matter of consistent practise, I know.   Sometimes it seems good, other times it is just awful....  I really don't think I'm ready to date a straight guy.  I'm not even fully into transition yet -- I've just passed a big hurdle of admitting that I am not gonna give up pursuing my dream.  I never thought I could pass because I was fat -- now I'm dropping weight (I'm a size 22, which is down a LOT) and sex appeal, flirting, is totally alien to me.

Also, I'm VERY shy and have ZERO girlfriends, which I would love to remedy.  The times hanging out with the straight girls at the club (going to the bathroom together, talking about men, makeup, whatever) have been priceless.  I need to work on that one.  Female friendships are what I've been massively lacking, and it's a huge letdown for me to meet a nice girl and have her make all kinds of assumptions about me because she thinks I'm a guy.  Ugh.

I'll just keep at it...the girlfriends part.  Socializing as Kellianna as much as I'm able.  It seems when I'm out and just being myself, meeting people is no problem. 

I'm going to a lesbian dance club this weekend.  The right lesbian might be nice.  I forget to smile a lot, and that's so important. 

Being held by a man...being kissed...I can't help but dream of it every night and for hours on end.  I think this is (probably) some typical teen girl behaviour?  Even though I'm not a teen, of course.

Thanks for listening to my rambles.
K.