Hello everyone,

I am in need of a binder, as every day I become more and more uncomfortable without one.  My chest affects how I simply move.  I'm always hunched over, conscious of my chest, and trying to hide it.  I am a B-cup, not too large.  I could get exact measurements, but I have no idea where a measuring tape is around the house.  Firstly, I don't care about money.  Secondly, I just want what's best, and makes my chest as flat as possible while not being overly uncomfortable.  What is the difference between T-Kingdom and Underworks binders, and of all the individual binders available from both manufacturers, which do you feel is the best?

All opinions are welcomed and I would be interested in hearing stories.

I have two binders from Underworks, the Double Front Compression Shirt and the Extreme Chest Concealer FTM Chest Binder- all sleeveless. I like both of them and they both have a different feel to them. FYI I'm a B cup too. It's said you should get a size smaller than you need from Underworks, but that didn't work out for me. Originally I got a small but couldn't even get it past my shoulders, so I traded for a medium and I'm pleased with it.

The Double Front Compression Shirt goes all the way down your torso so that you can tuck it in your underwear. It will have a tendency to roll up on you if you don't. I find it very comfortable and the fabric is actually a bit cooling. The whole binder compresses so it compresses your sides and stomach too. Some guys don't like that but I find it comfortable.

The Extreme Chest Concealer FTM Chest Binder goes down your torso too but the compression is just in the chest. The rest going down your torso is just like any shirt. Because of this I get hotter in it than the Double Front Compression Shirt. Both binders compress about the same and do a good job. I did get the Cotton Concealer Compression Muscle shirt but returned it. Even though it was very comfortable it didn't bind well.

I also would like to hear opinions on T-Kingdom's binders since they're made for FTM by a FTM.

Don't particularly know the difference.  I had an underworks binder though... well multiple actually.  I had the muscle shirt style one in black. 

I would definitely recommend it for a few reasons.
1. the muscle shirt, as opposed to the more tank top style ones, allowed more space for boobage to be squished/tucked/hidden in.  I probably had average sized boobs (never got fitted for a bra, so I couldn't really tell you like that)  but... they certainly wern't small (or large) so I'm betting average =p (b or c? total guess I have no clue what those even would look like) and even with the muscle shirt upon first putting it on my boobs would be all tryin to escape out my armpit holes (and I don't have much extra fat...so it wasn't that)  I don't think the tank top style "straps" would have created as flat a look all the way across my chest. 

2. its better than the ones with actual sleeves because your armpits can breathe which when so much of your body is being so tightly clothed is very helpful/important for comfort and not overheating.  also, I found while doing activity (hiking, biking ect. which I do/did a lot of in my binders) it helps to be able to take a breather and be able to use those arm holes to casually/not awkwardly or obviously pull your binder away from your body to cool off/get a chance to take a deeper breath.  though really I probably should have dawned a sports bra for these activities I couldn't bring myself to.  Really without the binder I wouldn't have really been all about riding my bike too much (wind and all making my boobs look more... there)

3. its full length... like a real shirt... The only thing that made the binder ineffective was when it would start to slide up my torso (not really "rolling" up ... but I guess thats what they mean by that) and as opposed to compressing it would end up forming itself around my boobs (giving a sports-bra like result so... not too happy.. well minus those bra lines on the back of the shirt.. so bothersome...) BUT this can be easily solved just by tucking it in to your pants, and wearing a somewhat snug belt. (don't go overboard on the snugness... my hipbones got somewhat bruised at first ... doesn't need to be THAT tight)  This is cool because it looks more like an undershirt than if it was one of those ones that only goes halfway down/just covers the chest area which through a light colored shirt would, to me, look more like a bra type thing... or at least more feminine than just a black undershirt.

also, as the shirt looses its elasticity (which can easily be reclaimed by handwashing (I don't recommend using much detergent just enough to where you feel its clean/not stinky) and then air drying.  Often I'd just put the binder on a plastic hanger and either hold it up to/hook it to the shower head and turn that sucker on hot until I felt that it was clean (water running from it looked clean.. at first it'll be all black...... thats just the dye [duh.]) and then leaving it there to dry/hang it in front of a fan (drying can be slow.... they're thick[ish]) anyway got a lil ADHD there.. sorry... so... as it looses its elasticity (on like day 3 of wearing the same one [yes I am that gross at times.../poor at first]) it will tend to do that whole sports bra effect type thing, which I imagine would be even worse/less preventable with one that you can't tuck in.  As the horizontal elasticity takes its toll (due to boobage pressure) you can always (in a bind.. hehe) stretch it further downwards which forces the fibers in horizontally.  (pull on some elastic... it gets skinny.)

one more plus the the full length: it kind of creates a false front from boob to pants.  when you've got it tucked in, and are standing, the binder usually (unless it has escaped from your pants) is pretty taught, so instead of having that awkward "drop off" or cliff effect under your boobs if you're wearing tightish clothes/there is even the slightest of breezes the binder will stop your shirt from pressing against your actual torso/underboob/"boob cliff region"  and the world will see a much flatter surface rather than a shorter binder which just compresses the boobs as much as possible but doesn't prevent from revealing that unevenness. (also its okay to have SOME volume up there and when there is no[or a lot less of a] dip under the boobs they look more like manly pecs than boobs also less noticable, but having it tucked in creates the same effect with the "tummy"/curvey/hips? it creates a false "shell" between curves looks much more manly and utilitarian)

4. GET BLACK  because I'm sure the white ones will get nasty FAST.  No one wants a sweat stained yellow binder.  ew.  I guess get one perhaps for if you need to wear a nice white shirt or something, but I'd just put a white t-shirt over my black one and its fine. 

5. The muscle shirt version cuts out any possible "cleavage" because it goes up about as high as a regular t-shirt (not quite, but past the collar bones most definitely) The tank top version is a little lower so if you stretch it down I could easily see your boobs being pushed into a "cleavage" sort of situation which god knows we all want to avoid.  (minus the MTF of course!) 

man.. I hate to type more... I feel as though I've already way over done this... but alas:

Okay... so those were my reasons to get the muscle shirt style underworks binders.
Now some other advice.

1. buy the 3 pack... its cheaper in the long run and you're going to want more than one really even more than 2 if you wear them every day.

2. rotate them.  They really do loose elasticity after a whole day of wear.  I found if I folded them in like 4s (so half then half.. kinda like they come in the package) and just put them in a drawer or wherever they were best.  Gravity pulls on them a bit if you hang them up (I mean not like permanent damage, and its not like it doesn't work pretty much just as well.. but i found folding them maintained/allowed for the elasticity to return.  (don't fold them wet obviously) 

3. wear deodorant... =p  but really get some of the spray kind just in case to help combat the binder sweat body odor. 

4.  I know you're probably afraid of smallish/snugish fitting clothes.. I was at least.. with the binder go ahead and let yourself try on some smaller clothes... you may find they look BETTER than the larger ones... I'm quite small (fit into kids clothes and small/medium shirts) and was wearing large shirts... without the binder I had to or my boobs were just obvious... with it the extra fabric left the boobs up to the other persons mind... whereas smaller shirts show off the "yea I'm flat what of it" gives you confidence

5. do some yoga at the end of a long day of binding.  I mean you'll be breathing at what feels like 3/4 capacity all day (you won't notice.. you'll be far to ecstatic that you're so flat and then when that excitement wears down... if ever... you'll be used to it.)  but you're lungs need to expand all the way and all that and yoga is so good for that (and stretching the rest of your torso/chest is probably also a good plan after all that compression) ALSO you'll get SUCH an oxygen high.  its wonderful.  (dunno what kinda person you are... but I can honestly say pack a lil bowl of that stinky green with the yoga and you'll feel like you're trippin face [on the realz yo.]) also it REALLY helps with the back/posture thing.  I know I was always hunched over and ->-bleeped-<- before binders/surgery and it must have been awful for my back/neck really whole body to be all self compressed like that.  you really don't let your chest/lungs/back/stomach have enough room to breathe at all! 
(yoga can feel awkward with boobs, but I actually could pretty easily ignore it (and I couldn't even lean over my desk to do homework without cursing the fact I could feel them there.. quite distracting)  you don't do much that you'd notice them with suprisingly. 

6. oh yea.  when I would configure myself within the binder I at first figured flat down would be best, but that created more of an odd bulge and actually discovered the best/flattest was more up.  not like up UP but like... I suppose lay down, and have them flat to where they come out of instead of pushing them up against other flesh/themselves.  This makes them look more like pecs (as they are where your pecs would be as opposed to lower like slightly saggy boob bulges) and they can be flatter to you they're not trying to be compressed into themselves they've got more room to spread out their blubbyness into... and it helps prevent from having them being all pushed up against your other skin which can become hot/itch/sweaty/nasty/uncomfortable. 

k im done I promise...

wait no I'm not....
some downsides to the binder I got:
1. belt can rub against the sides and fray/tear at them but this will be under your shirt/pants and won't effect the effectiveness of boob binding. Though if it stretches up above the belt it can allow some of your "spare tire" (even if you don't really have one) to ooze out through the worn out area.  I mean.. contents under pressure... any part not under compression is going to do its best to get out of that pressure.. upside you may look skinnier overall because you're stomach area is a lil compressed too...

2. downside to that is that you can't breathe into your stomach area as easily as those that are not as long.  but I'd personally rather be flatter and not have that underboob drop off there.. and my binder left me some room to breathe just... also hotter than the shorter ones as more area is covered/compressed/skin unable to breathe and all and its tucked in, so it can get a lil hot, but in hot hot weather I was still bikin 5 + miles a day and was fine!

I really, really want to get a binder bandages suck anyone know where I can get a cheap but effective one?

Wonderful information, GnomeKid, and completely helpful.  I'm pretty skinny, meaning I really just can't fit into most men's clothes (unfortunately), and am about 120 pounds at 5'7 or so.  I usually wear less baggy clothes as I don't want to look huge.  I like the skinny, form-fitting look for men, and when I have the ability to wear tighter shirts without having my tumors show, I'll be happy to wear more "form-fitting" clothes.  I have a boy-ish figure, thankfully.

You have honestly been a great help and I think the muscle shirt is up there in my top three at least.  I don't know much about the others, but I'd be glad to hear some detailed "testimonials", so to speak, for other types of binders.

Milliontoone - Underworks has affordable prices compared to a lot of places. 

Quote from: milliontoone on June 26, 2009, 12:58:14 PM
I really, really want to get a binder bandages suck anyone know where I can get a cheap but effective one?

Maybe try the Big Brothers Used Binder Program over at The Transitional Male.

Quote from: Arch on July 26, 2009, 05:15:05 AM
Maybe try the Big Brothers Used Binder Program over at The Transitional Male.

By the way that they advertise it, it seems like you need to have a binder prior.

Quote from: Monty on July 26, 2009, 05:30:40 AM
By the way that they advertise it, it seems like you need to have a binder prior.

really? what does it say? been wondering about donating mine.

Quote from: Nero on July 26, 2009, 06:11:18 AM
really? what does it say? been wondering about donating mine.

I'm not sure how it exactly works because they're confusing me.

First it says

QuoteThis Program was Created ONLY for Transmen Who Cannot Afford a New Binder!

This program is based on HONESTY and INTEGRITY by those requesting a reservation.

Each person who lies to get a free binder is only cheating others who truly cannot afford a new one - Can you live with that? Search your conscience before you proceed.

It specifically says a new binder, as if theirs had worn out. Then in the rules it says "This program is for Transmen who are pre-transition, just starting their transition or well into their transition ONLY!"

So maybe you don't necessarily need a binder prior.

Somehow I think I'm still better off paying for my own, seeing as I'm almost smaller what they make.

Edit: I tried filling out the form and I'm confused yet again because they ask you why you need a 'new' binder. They aren't very descriptive.

I have a t-kingdom 801, which is the sports-bra-ish one with a zipper down the front.
for reference, I'm 5'6", 145lbs, 30/32B cup.

It doesn't bite at all around the arms, and the shoulders are comfy. On me, it comes down almost exactly to the bottom of my sternum, so the pressure of the bottom seam on my ribs really gets to me after 5 or 6 hours, and I feel the need to try and tug it down; it always ends up right back in the same place. I think it's worse than it would be for other people, because it makes my stomach poof out underneath it, and I'm exceptionally self-conscious about being 'fat'.

The binding quality is nice. When you first put it on, you can either push your lumps up and out to the sides, or down and out to the sides.
Up and out can leave them sort of protruding from the arm-holes, which is fine in loose clothing, but might be awkward in tight clothing. I also needed to stop and 'adjust' myself halfway through a 9 hour workday when I did this, because they slowly migrated inward. The shape looks the best this way, for a manly profile, I can usually totally eliminate that underbust shadow. It does end up looking like I have a set of pecs, which is awkward with noodly arms, so I either wear a slightly loose shirt, a black shirt, a button down shirt, or a 2/3 or 3/4 sleeve long shirt under my overshirt it to cover my arms.
Because I work in a greenhouse and am rather active (walking, running, moving and lifting heavy objects, getting wet, etc), I usually adjust down and out; not quite as awesome of a manly chest, but flat, and more comfortable for me. They don't migrate at all, and I still usually don't have any underbust shadowing to make it look strange. I do tend to sweat in the chest-area more like this though, so that's something to consider.

As for the company, I ordered mine on a thursday, and it was at the post office (USA-east coast) by the following tuesday; with the extra 10USD or whatever for quick shipping. They make much smaller sizes; I have a size L with them, compared to the XS I ordered from underworks on their 997--Double Panel Compression Shirt Binder. I may have been able to fit an M, but I don't know that I could have gotten it zipped up at all. They definitely break in after the first 2 or 3 wears.

"This program is for Transmen who are pre-transition, just starting their transition or well into their transition ONLY!"

Um.... wouldn't that pretty much be everyone?

Quote from: Radar on July 26, 2009, 01:59:49 PM
"This program is for Transmen who are pre-transition, just starting their transition or well into their transition ONLY!"

Um.... wouldn't that pretty much be everyone?

They deny drag kings.

... but when you actually get to the forum it gets even more confusing. I mean, 7$ for a binder is great and all, but I'm not even sure if I qualify for them if they keep flip flopping rules around to the point where I'm not sure what they mean.

Quote from: Radar on July 26, 2009, 01:59:49 PM
"This program is for Transmen who are pre-transition, just starting their transition or well into their transition ONLY!"

Um.... wouldn't that pretty much be everyone?

I took this to mean that non-transmen and post-transitional transmen are not welcome.

And, Monty, this is how I've always understood it: if you need a binder and can't afford to buy one yourself, then you can qualify for one of Big Brothers' used ones. It doesn't matter whether you've never owned a binder or your current one is too worn-out to work.

If you're confused about a point of information, maybe you should point out their discrepancy and urge them to fix it. You could be helping a lot of other confused people.

I love the Underworks double front compression.  It's comfy and it works well.  The muscle shirt didn't work any better than a sports bra for me, which is unfortunate because it was very comfortable.  I tried a T-Kingdom 1700 and found it very uncomfortable (the velcro chafed) and the binding was ... odd. It wanted to compress just below the fat bags, which kind of undermined the purpose of the binder.  IMO T-Kingdom is not worth the higher price.

Quote from: Arch on July 26, 2009, 02:43:18 PM
I took this to mean that non-transmen and post-transitional transmen are not welcome.

I can see that point but why would a non-transman or a post-transitional transman need a binder? It just seems like a "duh" statement. They should probably just say "a transman in need". Once they get the background story of each guy (which I assume they do anyway) then they can decide.

Quote from: Radar on July 26, 2009, 05:29:31 PM
I can see that point but why would a non-transman or a post-transitional transman need a binder? It just seems like a "duh" statement. They should probably just say "a transman in need". Once they get the background story of each guy (which I assume they do anyway) then they can decide.

Drag kings and tomboys apparently.

They do ask for your background story, but I'm not sure if that qualifies you or not.

Quote from: Radar on July 26, 2009, 05:29:31 PM
I can see that point but why would a non-transman or a post-transitional transman need a binder? It just seems like a "duh" statement.

Some transwomen live double lives--at work, they present as male, and they wear tight sport bras or binders to conceal their breasts. I guess that's one more type of person that Transitional Male is trying to screen out.

I agree that the site is kind of unclear, though.

Thank god- someone who isn't pinching their pennies so tightly that $10 doesn't make a difference.

I found T-Kingdom to be much better myself.  The Underworks binders compress your whole abdomen and I found I could hardly eat with them on.

Quote from: Mister on July 26, 2009, 11:04:06 PM
Thank god- someone who isn't pinching their pennies so tightly that $10 doesn't make a difference.

I found T-Kingdom to be much better myself.  The Underworks binders compress your whole abdomen and I found I could hardly eat with them on.

Many thanks.  I want what is best, regardless.  There isn't much of a price difference, anyway.  I've purchased more expensive things.

I will have to order one, then.

Quote from: Mister on July 26, 2009, 11:04:06 PM
The Underworks binders compress your whole abdomen and I found I could hardly eat with them on.

To solve that, I pulled the bottom edge up over the shirt itself and pinned up, making the binder lay double. Even more compression where I want it that way and no pressure on my abdomen.