...the 'F' part of the FtM bugs me. I may not be mentally male all of the time, but I have trouble coming to terms with having SRS from female to male, as I don't feel female (I know, I've ranted about it before, but it's still true, obviously). So, yeah... No offence to anyone or anything, but does anyone else have trouble actually remembering that, if you haven't started transitioning yet, you are actually still physically female? I just continually find myself getting confused with the acronyms and thinking that I'm an MtF because the 'M' bit comes first. I can't really say I'm an MtM, because that seems like it would be ignoring the fact that I did wear dresses and ridiculous make-up and play dress-ups as a princess when I was little, but now I forget about the need to transition sometimes, because I'm just a man. Like now, the idea that I could be perceived as female seems ludicrous as I'm just a regular guy sitting in bed with his laptop. The moment I open my mouth to talk to someone, of course, or look down, I'm reminded that physically I'm not, but still that sense of "I don't need SRS, I'm already a man and you can't go from female to male if you're not female" looms.

Sorry, rambling. Just, yeah, anyone else have similar issues?

Well I can sort of understand how you feel. I don't feel female at all either, even now when I'm bleeding out my crotch... Now that is weird.

Well I can't say I feel the same way...  Some days I feel more female than others, and some days I just feel like a total guy.

But I do understand how you could feel this way. 

Personally, I haven't been a fan of the term "FTM" since I realized that I was already a guy in my head. I felt this way pre-transition, and I feel that way now. Some people say that the term refers to my sex, not my gender--that is, it means that I'm changing my physical sex, not my brain gender. But I haven't had any surgery on my sex organs, so is that statement correct?

If people in this society weren't so hell-bent on identifying people's sex/gender the minute the baby pops out of the womb, and if people realized that there is more to being male or female than a two-second glance at external genitalia, then most of us wouldn't have to go through such a tortuous route to find ourselves. We wouldn't have to worry so much about what other people have decided we are; we could just proclaim ourselves what we feel that we are. Of course, medical transition is not a joke, but wouldn't it be so much easier if the FTMs didn't have that great big F hanging over them and the MTFs didn't have that M hanging over them? And people who identify more in the middle of the spectrum would be free to explore that, too.

So I would prefer an initialism that more accurately reflects where I came from and how I identify. "FTM" just doesn't cut it. And I agree that it would be nice to start off with an M. Something like "Male, Incorrectly Designated Female at Birth."

MIDFaB. Well, I guess it could be worse. At least I'm fab...

Quote from: Arch on September 27, 2009, 01:02:52 PM
So I would prefer an initialism that more accurately reflects where I came from and how I identify. "FTM" just doesn't cut it. And I agree that it would be nice to start off with an M. Something like "Male, Incorrectly Designated Female at Birth."

MIDFaB. Well, I guess it could be worse. At least I'm fab...

That sounds like a good idea to me.

FtM works as a label for where my body's going, so I'm okay with it, but I do have those problems with the whole remembering other people think I'm a girl thing.  Like the other day, my mother and I were in my brother's dorm.  My brother's roommate was there, and my brother started to introduce us, and he was like, "Hey, Nathan, this is my sister . . ." and I was all like, "there is no way our mother can pass for your sister, what?" before I realized, "oh yeah, he was talking about me."  And moments of, "I can't be transsexual; I don't REALLY want to be a girl, I'm just gay" before remembering I'm in the other direction.

I feel your pain!

It feels odd to me too, acually, it almost feels better to type FtM, because the F comes first, and I guess that my brain interperates that phrase as Female... with Male as the physical details, currently.

Honestly I don't think any of the current terms or labels are very applicable to any of us, but they're useful for communicating with others.  It's hard to talk about in abstract unspecific terms, even if the specific, nonabstract terms that we do use are mostly or completely wrong.

I tend to think of myself as a Male Transsexual.

What I hate is when people think of me as a woman who wants to become a man. Or when people think of me as someone who used to be a woman and is now becoming a man. Or, worse yet, when they think of me as a woman who is pretending to be a man. The term "FTM" implies that these are valid interpretations. To me, they are not.

I reject all of the societal brainwashing that forced me to pretend I was a girl and a woman. I have never felt comfortable living that way or presenting that way. I have always been male in my head. I only pretended to be female. So the big fat "F" in "FTM," to me, only refers to the lie that I lived, not the reality. Why would I want to embrace that lie by calling myself FTM? I don't, but it's a useful term. So I use it. Grudgingly.

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Post Merge: September 27, 2009, 07:30:12 PM

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Quote from: Kumodamoogle on September 27, 2009, 07:24:20 PM
I tend to think of myself as a Male Transsexual.

I like this, but such a term confuses a lot of people if you use it outside of your own head!

I completely agree.  I accidentally think I'm "MTF" because of the word "male" being at the beginning, because for some reason I cannot come to terms with my body's femaleness.  I use "FTM Transsexual" on this site because it gives me access to forums that are useful to me... But honestly, I don't really take it to heart.

I think, we're just male, and the ladies are just ladies.  The end.

It doesn't really affect me much. I guess I have come to terms that if I am marked Female its because my body is bio female. Doesn't mean my gender is actually female. I guess because I am half way through my transition, with also my gender marker being changed helps alot.

There is a mountain to over come and its to change my body from one sex to the other.

No matter how much I cried, shouted, ranted or wished. I can not change the fact I am bio female.

Just my 5 pence.

Jay

FtM doesn't bother me in the slightest when applied to myself. I was born with female reproductive organs (sadly), my legal documents say 'F' on them, and I was socialized as a little pink-dress-wearing-princess with butt-length hair. Can't change that 'F', it's already happened. But I can definitely work on the 'tM' part.

I do consider 'FtM' to be a label for those 'in transition'. Because... well, when you're done, you're just 'M'. So I guess if the label ever does start to bother me, I'll just be more eager to finish 

Quote from: Kumodamoogle on September 27, 2009, 07:24:20 PM
I tend to think of myself as a Male Transsexual.

I tend to think of myself as Male.

I hate, hate, HATE it when people identify as trans...mostly because to me, it points out to society that I'm different from them. I'm a person, just like every other, I just happen to have incorrect anatomy. We wouldn't call a male born with no legs as a Male Paraplegic for the rest of his life.

Granted I know there are people out there that are perfectly proud and happy to be identified as transsexual, it's just not a term that I like for some reason. And one day when I'm dont with transition, I'll drop any hint of that title...it's a birth defect, a "whoopsee of nature", nothing more, and nothing I feel I need to parade around with.

Quote from: chrissyboy on September 28, 2009, 07:04:06 PM
I tend to think of myself as Male.

I hate, hate, HATE it when people identify as trans...mostly because to me, it points out to society that I'm different from them. I'm a person, just like every other, I just happen to have incorrect anatomy. We wouldn't call a male born with no legs as a Male Paraplegic for the rest of his life.

Granted I know there are people out there that are perfectly proud and happy to be identified as transsexual, it's just not a term that I like for some reason. And one day when I'm dont with transition, I'll drop any hint of that title...it's a birth defect, a "whoopsee of nature", nothing more, and nothing I feel I need to parade around with.

I couldn't have said it better.  To assume that the status of "transsexual" alters one's identity is to assume that they are not genuinely their gender of identification.  It's also to assume sex itself alters identity, which as you said, may as well mean that a disability would do the same.

Arch, let them be confused.

On the other topic of, we're just "male" there's no "transsexual" to it, I wonder about that. As a young man I felt just like you guys, Im male, Ive always been male, so I have crap Karma. But then I thought about it. What bio man has to spend the first formative years of his life in a female body? I doubt that doesnt alter ones perspective on life and the sexes. Also, has it ever occurred to any of you that we're a completely different sex? Nature isnt real fond of purity so I believe that Transsexual men and Women are just different, normal sexes beyond the "hardcore" extremes of bio male and female. Perhaps its a perfectly natural "screw up" because the extremes exist, but its a favorable mutation anyway because of over population?

A friend once asked me, how do you know youre male? I mean how can you be sure? Youve never been male, so how can you be sure? From a purely objective point of view, you cant. I was however, 100% certain I wasnt female. If not A, then B. I also feel alot of root-brain, or instinctual tendencies/desires that I feel would be better served if I were male, or atleast not female. Plus I have never thought of myself in a sexual situation as anything but male, even from my earliest fantasies, in full out REM sleep. To me, thats enough proof and ->-bleeped-<-ing crazy angst on a base animal level for me to conclude Im male. I will however concede that Im not, nor will I ever be a genetic male. For want of a better way to put it then, Im a transsexual male. I was born that way, and Ill die that way. It is a birth defect, and yeah in polite conversation you wouldnt be , oh hey Im Drayke, the trans ->-bleeped-<- any more than Im going to be like, Oh hi, Im Drayke the Gimp. I no longer walk with braces and crutches, I havent since I was 8, but that doesnt change the fact that I have CP.

Far be it for me to tell you guys how to think however. To each his own. For instance I blow a gasket everytime some tries to be politically correct and refer to me as Transgender. Ive never been Transgendered a day in my life. Ive taken enough anthropology to know what gender means, and to me thats a way of saying, "you people think youre the opposite of your biological sex, just because of the cultural ramifications involved". Well screw that, if it was manly to wear a tutu and butt-length hair, guess what? Yours truly would be sporting a tutu and making Godiva jealous. There are Transgendered people, hell there are probably Transgendered Transsexuals, Im just not one. So, if youre 100% certain youre a biological male with crapped up chromosomes, hey more power to ya.

Quote from: CodyJess on September 28, 2009, 11:59:49 AM
FtM doesn't bother me in the slightest when applied to myself. I was born with female reproductive organs (sadly), my legal documents say 'F' on them, and I was socialized as a little pink-dress-wearing-princess with butt-length hair. Can't change that 'F', it's already happened. But I can definitely work on the 'tM' part.

I do consider 'FtM' to be a label for those 'in transition'. Because... well, when you're done, you're just 'M'. So I guess if the label ever does start to bother me, I'll just be more eager to finish 

Couldn't agree more. . .

SilverFang