I've been looking around here and I notice that alot of guys want to take T. I've seen one who's hesitant. I haven't seen any who have chosen not to take it, but I haven't been around too long.

How did you all who are on T come to such a big decision?

If there any here who have chosen not to take T, why? Does it make you feel like less of a man? Might you change your mind?

Are any of you still hesitating to take it?

I personally don't think I want to take T. When I think it over, there are only certain changes I would want to occur, but at the same time I'm still confused. On a side note, might this mean I'm not the guy I think I am...? Eh, I'm thinking way too much. 

Everyone's transition is different. It doesn't make you less of a man for not wanting to go on T.

Transitioning is the very last option. Most of the guys here are at that point.

Quote from: Tristan H. on November 13, 2009, 07:13:00 PM
Everyone's transition is different. It doesn't make you less of a man for not wanting to go on T.

Transitioning is the very last option. Most of the guys here are at that point.

Well put.

I wasn't sure about T when I first came out either. T is some powerful stuff. And it literally is going through puberty all over again. Some changes are less desired than others. It does get to the point though (for some of us) where it's no longer a choice whether we can live without it or not.

I haven't begun T yet, but not because I don't want to. I have no insurance, thus not been to a counselor. I have been diagnosed as having GID while I was in the PCU for suicide attempt. I'd give anything to be able to go onto T and get top surgery done. I think so much of my depression will go away.

I have been out as male to myself and other people for over 3 years now. I'm still unsure as to if T will be necessary for me to feel comfortable within my own skin. I know for sure that I want top surgery because I have a large chest and want to get rid of that. I think T may help, but I'm not 100% certain. I feel that after being on T I will know if it was the right decision or not.

Quote from: Kvall on November 13, 2009, 07:24:15 PM
I disagree. Transition doesn't always have to be a "it's this or suicide" option. It can simply be something you want to happen.

I wonder if you misunderstood? Tristan didn't say anything about suicide...it's just that we don't generally just jump into transition; we have to live with what we have before we get to that point. At some point before transition, a guy will generally try less extreme options: clothing, haircut, voice training, binding, packing, nickname, telling people "I'm really a guy, so please use male pronouns," top surgery only, hormones only, temporary hormones, whatever.

Or maybe I'm the one who misunderstood.

Getting my T next week (if the doctor responds to my email, has space for me, and everything comes together "right"... Please.. if there is a god!... any god!... I'm not picky!.. )..

The decision wasn't easy for me. See, I'm an information addict.
I need to know what the consequences of my choices are before I make them, almost all the time.
This sometimes results in me not having preference at all when given the choice of food, drink, entertainment, etc, because I recognize that all choices are equal, and my taste is so broad that it could be sated with any choice, and my momentary "want" is nonexistent. (Okay, this happens frequently and hubby is still learning that "no preference" actually means "no preference" and not just "I want you to choose what you like no matter what it is I want".)

.. Right, tangenty Miniar goes off on tangents.

When I had all the information (method, types of T, frequency, side effects both good and bad) I made the choice to pursue T, and then I joined this forum and I learned about something I hadn't found in any of the other places where I'd gathered the information.
The engine simile. That suggestion that it might clear my head, give better emotion control, make me feel my brain was finally running on the right fuel... that suggestion sealed the deal.

I choose to get T because I want that. And I want the fat redistribution. And I want my little guy to grow up. And I want my voice to break and drop. And I want my facial hair to come in. And I want the effects on muscles as well, I could use a boost to my strength to help with fibro.

I am willing to accept the other side effects, the hairier body, the chance I may loose some of my hair (unlikely as my 80 something granddad has a solid head of hair still.. but the chance is there), and everything else.

It won't make me "more" of a man, but it will make my body a little bit more right.
It won't make me "happy", but it will alleviate some of what bothers me every day.

That's why I make this choice.
It's something I need to do.

Arch is correct. That is what I meant.

For about a year and a half, I was one of the "no-ho" guys. When I went full-time at 24, I was sure I didn't need T, because I already had (some) facial hair, my voice was fairly low, and I passed about 95% of the time. Little by little, though, I saw my face begin to feminize. Before I knew it, I was passing only about 50% of the time, and that was hardly enough for me. I did what Miniar did--- researched everything, checked multiple sources against one another, and weighed all the alternatives. In the end, I did feel like there was no other option, though I would never have attempted suicide. I just decided I might as well get on T.

I don't think any other decision in my life has been so beneficial, honestly, and I wish I'd gotten on it much sooner. I was vehemently against taking hormones prior to that, but changed my tune pretty quickly once my voice dropped, the facial hair thickened and increased, and I started to feel like myself, probably for the first time in my life.

That said, you should do what's best for you. Maybe you don't want T now, but you will at some point down the road. Maybe you never will. It doesn't make you less of a man if the latter is the case, just a man who knows what he wants and doesn't let others push him into something that isn't right for him.

SD

Quote from: Kvall on November 13, 2009, 08:37:26 PM
I would consider all of those things a part of transition.

Well, you and I seem to have differing views. I have a buddy who has short hair, wears male clothing, packs sometimes, and likes to be called "he."

This is as far as it goes for him. He does not consider any of his actions to be a part of transition. I tend to agree.

For some, transition means hormones and surgery, and it seems to be used in that way here a lot. Or at least, I've observed that.

Does the social part of transitioning count? It does, but I'm referring to getting on hormones and surgery, myself. Not everyone is prepared to transition through hormones or surgery and some don't feel they need to. Before we go on hormones or get surgery generally we do test these things out. When you are exploring a part of yourself, you're not going to jump into everything. You explore your feelings, you go through therapy, and then after that you either take hormones or have surgery or you don't depending on your needs.

Of course, there are people who didn't need therapy, but they had to come to that conclusion, even if they were young.

I need T. I've considered going DIY for a few months and rocking into a GP's office for a level check... but I don't want to risk it for several reasons.

Initally when I came out I wanted T, though not as badly.

I told myself to wait until I had been FT for at least 3 months before making the decision - then chase it down if I still felt the same way. I've made the decision, I'm just having trouble with the chasing it down part (It's been way more than 3 months and still nothing - can't find resources here).

What drove me to the decision is the lack of other options, coupled with knowing the changes I want to make. I really look forward to the effects. I don't care what order they're in, I want to collect them all! (Disclaimer : Nobody in my family is bald. At all. Either side).

The real kicker that pushes me along when I think I can deal without T for a little longer? Getting clocked, or outed by family. It takes all my strength not to start punching things. The less I have to deal with that, the better.

Well I want to be as close to a biological male as possible.

Want to pass (I think I'm pretty androgynous-looking but I have a real high voice).

Am sick of the red death, mood swings, and all other hormonal female bullsh*t.

Would like the slight bit of energy, ability to gain more muscle, sex drive, and I don't want to feminise more.

Quote from: Kvall on November 14, 2009, 01:36:33 AM
What are they, then?

He does not see any of his actions as part of transition. He is not legally male. He is not read as male. By his own definition, he is not transitioning or transitioned. As I said, I agree with him.

But I think you've pointed out something important: different people have different definitions of "transition." Perhaps that is where our apparent misunderstanding lies. My friend has no desire for surgery or HRT. He has no desire to change his identification. Nobody but a few close friends regard him as male. By his own definition, he is not in transition. It just so happens that his definition coincides with mine, but I should not impose my own definition on him, should I?

Quote from: Kvall on November 14, 2009, 01:36:33 AM
Especially since in your original list of stuff you listed as "less extreme" stuff to try before transition, you included things like top surgery... Unless you are saying they're not part of a transition with the implication that they are the end point?

I've heard of a couple of guys who did top surgery but not HRT. One of them, I understand, is not legally male; I guess he just needed top surgery to be more comfortable in his body. I only know of him through a mutual friend, so I don't know whether he considers himself to be in transition or finished with transition. I guess I should leave that up to him.

I also know of a number of people who are on HRT or who have been on HRT and who have no intention of having top surgery or any other kind of surgery. Some have M on their licenses; all are legally female with the federal government. One is often read as female and lets the pronouns fall where they may. Are these guys transitioning/transitioned? I guess I should let them decide how to label themselves, if at all.

Interesting discussion, but we wound up hijacking the thread a bit. My fault. So let me get back to it.

I took T because men operate on testosterone, because I wanted the physical characteristics of a man (at least as much as T could provide), and I was hoping that T would prove to be "the right stuff" for my body, including my brain. So far, so good. I'll never go back to E.

Well here's my two cents. I didn't want T in the beginning - and it's not as though I had some profound moment where I realised I had to get T. It started out with me researching like a lot of the other guys - weighing pros and cons and deciding on the risks etc.
I eventually thought I would really like to have the facial hair I always thought I would get. To have the kind of body I always thought I would develop. To stop the things I dread happening in my current body. I also realised that I really want a hysterectomy. I am never going to bear children - it to me is a useless bit of kit and I'm not willing to have the necessary medical checks to look after it so why have anything down there. I then realised the body must run on at least A hormone(oestrogen or T). And after realising how much better I felt after stopping the OCP, I realised I would really like to take T or at least try it.
Another thing that started to get to me was pronouns. And I realised people were never going to get it right unless I look the way I am supposed to in my eyes. It has gotten to the stage now where I feel like people might as well be calling me cat. Either way it isn't right!
It is a very big personal decision but. It took me ages to admit I wanted T. I thought it might alter me too much. Be unrecognisable to myself and family. But I finally saw that I didn't really recognise myself now! I have always said I would try anything once - within reason. Just my feelings...
Cheers guys,
Jay

Quote from: Kvall on November 13, 2009, 08:37:26 PM
I know this topic has been beaten to death, but is your granddad on your maternal side or paternal side? You didn't receive either of your X chromosomes from your paternal grandfather, so your baldness risk will not be related to his. You have a 50% chance of having one of your maternal granddad's X chromosomes, though.

I just mentioned him cause he's the oldest male relative I got still alive. (Paternal)

I have to admit that I fought the urge to start T. As I said before, I wanted to live as a man and have those physical changes. This I knew. And my therapist was all too willing to write me a letter. But I delayed because of my then-partner. I knew that he would probably have some problems with stuff like hair...I thought about starting T and then stopping; I knew that I would probably get some vocal effects before I had to worry overmuch about hair.

Secretly, I wanted hair. But I couldn't admit it to myself. One day I did. That's the day I knew that I wouldn't stop T no matter what my partner thought.

As for how I arrived at my decision in the first place...I simply knew that it was what I wanted. Nobody else influenced me to decide as I did. I knew that T was for me. I suppose everyone who makes that decision just gets to a tipping point.

Do your research, and don't do anything till you're really ready.

Quote from: Arch on November 14, 2009, 03:41:46 AM
He does not see any of his actions as part of transition. He is not legally male. He is not read as male. By his own definition, he is not transitioning or transitioned. As I said, I agree with him.

But I think you've pointed out something important: different people have different definitions of "transition." Perhaps that is where our apparent misunderstanding lies. My friend has no desire for surgery or HRT. He has no desire to change his identification. Nobody but a few close friends regard him as male. By his own definition, he is not in transition. It just so happens that his definition coincides with mine, but I should not impose my own definition on him, should I?

I've heard of a couple of guys who did top surgery but not HRT. One of them, I understand, is not legally male; I guess he just needed top surgery to be more comfortable in his body. I only know of him through a mutual friend, so I don't know whether he considers himself to be in transition or finished with transition. I guess I should leave that up to him.

I also know of a number of people who are on HRT or who have been on HRT and who have no intention of having top surgery or any other kind of surgery. Some have M on their licenses; all are legally female with the federal government. One is often read as female and lets the pronouns fall where they may. Are these guys transitioning/transitioned? I guess I should let them decide how to label themselves, if at all.

Interesting discussion, but we wound up hijacking the thread a bit. My fault. So let me get back to it.

I took T because men operate on testosterone, because I wanted the physical characteristics of a man (at least as much as T could provide), and I was hoping that T would prove to be "the right stuff" for my body, including my brain. So far, so good. I'll never go back to E.

good points, Arch.

Kvall,
I think what we may be losing sight of here is that for some people it is transition or die. That doesn't mean it is that way for everyone or that it has to be. Also, dysphoria often worsens with time so that how someone may feel about transition at 20 might not be how they feel at 40.

As of right now, I'm too young to get T for myself and my mum doesn't want to pay for it.  Partly because she doesn't have the money right now, and partly because she doesn't want to be "responsible" if it turns out to be a bad decision.

All of that makes me extremely frustrated, because what I want more than anything in the world right now is T.  I feel really ready for it, and I feel like once I have it I'll be so much better off.

So I guess I kind of have to question myself here, don't I?  I get suspicious of myself when I'm that sure of something. 

But when the time comes I don't think I'll hesitate to get on T.  I feel like I've already decided, even though It'll be some months before I have the authority to get it for myself.

I was also unsure at first. I then researched everything and in the end when I finally transitioned went on T. Very happy with my decision, definitely helps with things, makes me feel much more even and more comfortable with myself.
Myles