So heres what I was wondering... This is the age old debate and I'd love some freaking answers here. I have been looking for ways to block more T than the spiro allows me to... Like in the good old days of self medicating XD


But basically... I finally was able to read in an article online that Tea Tree oil and Lavender basically both not only have phytoestrogenic qualities but ANTIANDROGENIC ones as well... Now what I'm curious about is stuff I've heard really...


I'm on a pretty low dose of estradiol, and things have seemed to REALLY slow down with my puberty and this scares me (understandably). T Levels go along with the E ones and have spiked a few times in the past even though the endo had no idea why.

So what I'm curious about... Is if you use estradiol, would using tea tree oil/lavender containing body wash/shampoo products be a bad idea? If it is anti androgenic, this is a good good thing for me... However I've heard in the past from people on this board that while being on regular old HRT meds, the effectiveness would be limited by things like... Lets say Fennel seed/Fenugreek. Tea tree also has anti androgenic qualities apparently...

So if I were to use this wonderfully smelling stuff sometimes as body wash/shampoo, would it make my hormonal absorbtion worse or better or not affect it. Does it depend on how much you use? Cause subtly keeping my T levels lowest is my intent, not "Gunking up the system"


I'm also a fan of Pomegranate (to drink) because of its anti oxidant qualities....


Now what I'm curious is... What can I use as an anti androgen along with the meds I'm already on... Because I know my endo is conservative as hell with her doses?

I'd love some evidence and stuff that people can back up their advise with cause no one seems to know anything anymore xD

If you change your levels on your own, & IF you let that show up on your next blood test, you endo will start making counter adjustments. As far as the natural stuff, waste of time unless you like it & it's good for you.

there's not enough of it in most body care products to make a dent in hormone regulation (even the herbal junk sold as a supplement doesn't do much at all)

you'll be fine

you'll have to push for spiro, unless you can pay out the nose for a GnRH agonist or LH agonist to shut the works down

Well I've been trying to subtly help my body along... I'm not looking for anything MAJOR, but what I'm curious about specifically is if and what naturals like these will or could be competing with the estrogen I'm already on. This whole argument of whether or not small amounts of naturals will actually make your HRT worse by "Competing" for the same receptors has never been proven to me and I want it to be...

I'm just trying to be conscious of my diet and what I expose my body to. It ALL plays its part even if its in small bits... And my body is weird... It masculinized a little six months after I started HRT for no apparent reason.


I'm basically not eating as much meat... Stuff like this. Just... Stuff...


So can anyone prove that "Fact" to me that I was mentioning?


Im not going on a full regimen of phytos obviously, I'm just trying to be conscious of what it does to me.


Knowledge is awesome.

This whole argument of whether or not small amounts of naturals will actually make your HRT worse by "Competing" for the same receptors has never been proven to me and I want it to be...

small amounts, no, overdose amounts, yes

Quote from: Flan on November 18, 2009, 11:05:26 PM
This whole argument of whether or not small amounts of naturals will actually make your HRT worse by "Competing" for the same receptors has never been proven to me and I want it to be...

small amounts, no, overdose amounts, yes

So in other words, using soap all the time that has phytoestrogenic qualities, and drinking pom sometimes isn't really ODing...

and there fore will not interfere with my HRT negatively...

And therefore the tiny tiny amounts in my everyday life would only be beneficial?


Who can back this up with facts? Im just curious... Not saying I dont believe you.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16163844
Phytoestrogens compete with 17beta-estradiol much stronger than with 5alpha-dihydrotestosterone for binding to sex hormone-binding globulin.

http://cebp.aacrjournals.org/content/12/6/497.full
In vitro and in vivo studies found that phytoestrogens may compete with estrogens to bind to estrogen receptors (1) 

More consistent results might be obtained from an increase in your dutasteride. At the usual doses it is supposed to get like 90% of our dht if I recall, but higher doses do increase the effect. 

Quote from: Becca on November 18, 2009, 11:27:38 PM
More consistent results might be obtained from an increase in your dutasteride. At the usual doses it is supposed to get like 90% of our dht if I recall, but higher doses do increase the effect.

I was on Finasteride but it was making me feel more depressed... Why has no one ever told me of dutasteride and how does it compare to finasteride?

Oh well if that's the case, maybe ya should give it a try. Dutasteride is better than finasteride in every way. I can't find any links that don't go into doseages, but you're a smart girl.

Well the interesting questions are finally getting a good ol' fashioned probing. The body only has so receptors, every body is different, how do E 1,2,&3 compete & live together, do any cacel out the other, can you control T with some extra E safely, what if you are just trying to explore the possibilities without making the big leap, how will the hard stuff be different, what is the best hard stuff, what is the safest soft stuff, is T & E a balancing act, or just the appearance of one, what is best for lipids, what is the easiest on the liver, why does the neccissarry dosage of E decrease after srs, even though T levels can be kept at a far constant both before & after srs, what is the difference between protien & platelette clotting, why doesn't my Dr know this stuff, & if they do why do they refuse to treat me, why can I not spell right no matter how much I read, why do I use so many consinents when I hate them so much to begin with, why are vowels so restricted even though they are so liberating to use, why do I feel like I am in a strait jacket even though I am not,  cuurrently, why are the walls white, does this colour really calm me, or am I just racially insensitive, why do my parents tell me I'm special & the teachers call me stupid, why do my teachers call me smarty pants when they are mad, & my parents call me stupid when they are mad, who is truely mad, how much do you have to love someone before you can officially be allowed you hate them with cred...