try to type this again....grrrrrrr
-------
how do YOU..FTM folks see yourselves relating to and with us bio males, in social circles?
I am not-------criticizing or saying THIS or THAT way is wrong.
I would like YOUR feedback.
==
i.e.--

you are at the gas station,...saturday night...gassing the car,...and there is of course how many other folks running around and carrying on coz it's the weekend...ya have to go in and get sodas and chips and whatever else...............

so, tell me........how do YOU feel about interjecting with bio males?
nervous--scared---hesitant...what is a good or bad side comment or topic for you to use or stay away from?
what do YOU see as accepted body language FOR a guy?
how do you overall act?
I am really interested to hear...

thanks
take care out there

I just act like any other guy. I'm aware that I'm a lot smaller and shorter than most, so I'll be cautious about crowds of drunk teenage males, but otherwise, guys don't interact with other strange guys much other than a nod or a flick of the hand, and I don't either.

Dennis

so, by your answer, you are not uncomfy in public, waiting in lines, and walking around,..hand gestures, male stance, etc etc........

interesting.

coz see in my head,....I would think FTM would be nervous about how they come across in public....

I am happy to hear ....you...are doing well.
thanks

interesting ! ... because if it was me I'ed be nervice as all get out !
I know how BIO Males react... and it would make me very nervice to go out in public eather being MTF or FTM  ... Human Male Rednecks are a dangerous sort to find or be arround.
if you happen to find them at the right place and the right time you could wind up in the hospital just because you walked by ....   
   and if I'm the only one here that reconizes this, I got some Paranoia teaching to do !
heheheheheh
Bob........

Most guys have never heard of an FtM. Those who have wouldn't recognize one if they saw him, except for maybe a very early in transition or pre-T guy.

And that might be what you, Bob and Veronica, are thinking of - an early transition or pre-T guy. Most transguys blend in and are entirely unremarkable after long enough on T. I'd be as much at risk walking by those guys as you would, Bob. And obviously there are some groups of guys anyone would be a fool to mess with or even just walk near. But your average crowd of joes at the gas station, no worries for either of us.

Dennis

Those who have wouldn't recognize one if they saw him, except for maybe a very early in transition or pre-T guy.

==================

umm?  is it just me here?   bio males DO have that ever tattletale called..an adam's apple..........!
what you mean wouldn't know?

most folks ain't that dumb.

every bio male "I" know...looks for...that tattletale.

but that's my just neck o' the woods? dunno.

I know at least 1 FTM that grew an adam's apple.

Melissa

as the new kids of today say it.........

                                       kewllllll           

Not all bio males have a very pronounced Adam's Apple, and the Adam's Apples of most FTMs grow with testosterone. Also, you don't see many males looking around and checking other guys' necks. I have a low tenor (beginning the drop to baritone), a masculine face shape, and am taller than most of the guys in my dorm--how could they possibly read me as a girl? Do you know any girls with a deep voice and a flat chest?

Yeah, I know lots of guys who's adam's apple doesn't show at all. It has to be really large to stand out, like my really skinny, tall friend who has a thin neck but a large apple.

I get nervous around guys because I know that I'm obviously not like them. I'm eccstatic when I fit in with them, even a little bit. When I meet new guys I don't feel natural, since I know I don't look natural. Still pre-T by the way. Even though I confuse some people as to my gender, I think it's fairly obvious if you see me from the back or the side, with my huge curvy bum. Blegh.

okay  okay  okay
fear of not fitting in..
not a big big deal being girlie..to a point.
girlie ya ain't gotta worry about locker room jokes and talk about service time or the ole lady and the kids..and aww she's just a woman and got no idea how hard it is being a man...

ya don't have to rough it up and be super macho man....
---------
now being a guy......
I feel bad for those FTM coz I worry about those joke times, and the service talk..and the woman at home and all about..holy jeez it's her-time again...and how owly she is...

all that macho guy talk........
FTM...you have no experience AS a guy...so I fear some time  some how...some one will say something and the FTM will have no answer...............OH BOY....


ok..soapbox over

Consider that, other than the TS experience, how radically different of a viewpoint FtM and MtF's have.  Veronica, FtM's are men just like any other man intellectually, regardless of their state of transition, and they fit in with other men almost intuitively / naturally. 

Of course, some things need to be learned because of differences in socialization, that goes for both MtF's and FtM's though.

Do you really think things are going to be that different for a MtF?
When you go to the Doctor and you're asked when your last cycle was?
Or when you are with a group of women friends and pregnancy, ovulation, menarche, development or about a thousand other topics that are very GG specific comes up?

Besides, as a guy all you have to do is mumble, "yup, know how that is" and you're set, regardless of the topic. As a girl, other women expect conversation and answers.

Just some thoughts

Jessica

Veronica,
    I act as any other guy in any place. No one bats an eye. As long as  we pass physically, then the rest is just attitude. Guys as strangers dont interact too much other than a forced hey whats up, or a head nod. Thats about it.

I have had plenty of experiences as a guy. I'm not sure what you mean by none. Since I live as a guy, then how could I not continually have experiences as one? That is how the world percieves me 100% on the time now, so that makes no sence to me.
                                                Marco

                                       

an interesting note, I was in some run down gas-station on my bike when I was about 18 or so... figured I'ed better go empty the bladder as I had a long ride ahead of me ...
there were 2 urnals and a stall with boots showing that it was in use...  I was busy releaving myself in  the one urnal when this other guy comes in and stands by the urnal and reaches into his pocket and pulls out a Pee funnel... gals can get them so they can stand and Pee like a guy... I noticed he was wrasseling his dwars to get the funnel positioned correctly when he said Viet nam, got it blown off by shrapnal I said Oooh man that sux , he said yah well it got me discharged ! I said COOL ! ... finished my business and left...
but you know, that could well have been a TS FTM and I never even thought about it untill now.... 30 years of being convinced i'ed say she passed with flying colors.... if indeed it was a FTM !.... which ofcorse matters not... but I thought it worth mentioning.
...
...Your right Dennis... I'ed never reconise one if I saw one !  because it doesn't realy matter to me....  now if someone tries something strange in the bathroom their lible to get my foot in their mouth.... <GRIN>... I doubt i'ed be very forgiveing in that respect.
......
Bob......


Bob....
     

Quote from: Bob on September 23, 2006, 01:13:32 AM

but you know, that could well have been a TS FTM and I never even thought about it untill now.... 30 years of being convinced i'ed say she passed with flying colors.... if indeed it was a FTM !.... which ofcorse matters not... but I thought it worth mentioning.

Bob....
     

Typo, right? You meant 'he' passed  >

And yeah, we do grow adams apples on T. I have one now. My mother thought I had a goiter when it first started growing.

Dennis

Veronica,
not all Ftms have had "proper" female socialization,
some Ftms are all man though they have a "female sex organ".

hehehe YAH ! typo.... thats it !  ummm oops ! hehehehehe
.
but thats the thing... male or female its... how you act that guy acted as if it was normal... so why shouldn't I .... heheheh
...
that was the day My bike ate the drive chain at 65mph and locked up the rear wheel... as I brod slid the bike off the side of the road I was wondering what I was doing so far from home ! .... about 3 hrs later I finally got the chain back on and headded back home... never did make it to where I was going ! hehehehe I was later bragging to a guy on the CB radio that I didn't dump it when it happened and he said he did the same thing at 100mph and didn't dump it , lost the rim on his bike though as it chewed through the tire and rim before it came to a stop.... the tire swallowed a spoke from the wheel and caused a blow out, the tube came out and wraped arround the wheel and locked the rear tire up... I think he was lucky to survive it and I told him so, he said actually his flat tracking experience was the only thing that saved him as the bike was all over the road ! hehehehe
that triumph tridant of his realy moved ! and he used it too !  he said he was doing 130mph when something felt wrong and at 100 the rear wheel locked up.... after that he just flat tracked it to a stand still.... and had to walk 20 miles to a phone to call his dad.... as the rim was ground in-two ! they had a heck of a time loading that beast because his dad forgot the ramp ! hehehehehhehe
... ahhh those were the days... when a bucks worth of gas would fill your tank and you could go all over....now its $12.00 and you better have a fill up spot close by ! heheheheh
...but my bike is alot better now ! HA !
Bob.......

 As a girl, other women expect conversation and answers.

Just some thoughts

Jessica
==================

ok  my bad

me sowwy

you right

Wow Bob, sounds like you were pretty lucky to survive your chain incident too. Is that a loose chain that causes it? Now I'm gonna be even more paranoid about checking my chain regularly.

I had a flat rear tire once, which caused a complete lack of control, but I wasn't going that fast, so I was able to wrestle the bike over to the side before anything disastrous happened.

Dennis

Actually Dennis  the chain and sprockets were badly worn out but Not having any money to replace them I didn't ....  you can tell if the chain is worn very bad by holding it in its side .... lay the chain out stright  and flop ot on the side so the rollers are vertical
and pick it up by the center.... if it droops very mich on the tips of the chain its wore out,....how much the droop is veries with the chain ...if it obviously is sloppy like a snake in all directions its time to replace it  you can usually replace 2 or 3 chains to 1 set of sprockets.... but when replaceing sprocket alwayse replace the chain too.
.....

I have been out-of-touch in the motorcycle industory for years now stopped working on them in the late 1980's so the recomendations may well have changed, especially on the crotch rockets !  as they are a high preformance breed that ware parts fast.
My bike now is a Honda shadow vt1100c v twin and I love it before that was a vt700c shadow
which I am trying to sell now, to get rid of the thing... so this machine of mine now is the first bike i've ever owned over 1000cc and I enjoy it emencely every time I get on it ! <GRIN>
You ain't had fun till you had a flat tire on the front ! ...corse you don't wann'a have that kind of fun eather ! 
I've had 17 or more motorcycles in my life so far and loved every one of them
I put on 1000 miles a month on my bike for a few years while in highschool and just after
... the thing I fear most is hitting a deer or bear on a bike ...so far I have been very fortinate .<crosses his fingers> I went to the Kawasaki mechanics school in portland Or.
and for a while I had my own shop in Redding Cal. Motorcycles are my life or...were but i still love the silly things, their the best transportion known to man in my opinion! a might bit chilly in the snow though ! hehehehehehe


....
back to the subject....
As diferent as the male and female rolls are in our socioty there is common ground to walk on in both.... getting off the main path so to speak may well point a finger at you, so sticking with the common conversations and responces would probly be the best bet!
... I have been "interigated" by GG's before and its amazeing the info that a person can get out of you if they want ! .... sense then i play stoopid and say duh geee I dunno !
and that usually cures the problem completely as they think I am too dumb to answer any questions at all ! HAHAHAHAHHAHA
.... you could dye your hair blond and use my method... it might work ! <GRIN> !
heheheheheh
Bob....