Hello all, since coming to this site I have found a wealth of knowledge and advice. however in the process of my "roaming" especially here in the Philosophy arena, I have become very interested in becoming more informed as it were in the Philosophers themselves. I started by hearing and looking into references of Carl Jung, that lead me to Frederick Nietzsche, that lead to... well you get the idea.

Now I'm kinda over inundated with authors and titles to begin my search and exploration into this topic, however not having been a student of philosophy in my past and rather naive as to who's who and where to begin, I was wondering if you folks out there could get me started in the right direction.

Right now I'm reading Ayn Rand "Philosophy- Who needs it" and see she quite heavily slams Kant, so I figure I should back up and read Kant to she what she's referring to, and then...

Well here's a list of authors I was interested in, but don't want to kill myself with "information input overload" AKA a headache...

Carl Jung
Ayn Rand
Baruch Spinoza
Frederick Nietzsche
Judith Butler
Ludwig Wittenstein
Simone de Beauvior
Otto Rank
Arthur Schopenhauer
Jorge Luis Borges
John Locke
George Berkeley
David Hume

...so far. I'm sure there are others I might need to add, but one or two for now to start with would be greatly appreciated, oh yeah, titles of articles or books is what I'm looking for.

Thanks, Evie

Douglas V. Gnazzo is a good writer, some of it is "pass me what he's smoking" material, but good reading none the less (especially the "Whence & Pence" series)
http://www.financialsense.com/fsu/editorials/gnazzo/archive.html

You might want to start at the beginning with Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, Epicurus.

I have two for you.  Among the most brilliant thinkers of the late 20th Century.

Hannah Arendt
The Origins of Totalitarianism (1951)
The Human Condition (1958)
Eichmann in Jerusalem: A Report on the Banality of Evil (1963)
Crises of the Republic: Lying in Politics; Civil Disobedience; On Violence; Thoughts on Politics and Revolution (1972)

Anyone who thinks they understand the modern world and who has not read, if not prayed over these books, is kidding not only you, but themselves.

And just because I love him, and he makes sense...

Eric Hoffer:
The True Believer: Thoughts On The Nature Of Mass Movements(1951)
The Ordeal Of Change (1963)

Lisagirl, Thanks, I have them also on the list in my head, I've looked a bit into Aristotle. Realizing it all started somewhere and most of the philosophers from then on have always made mention of or referred to the "ancients" as it were.
Right now I'm finishing Ayn Rand's "Philosophy- Who needs it", and she's always pointing to Aristotle, and at the same time has been slamming the crap out of Immanuel Kant.

Tekla, thank you also, since I happen to live a few hundred yards from our neighborhood Library, it will probably become my second home for awhile. I've heard of Arendt's "The Human Condition" I think my dad has it in his collection, but he's 2,000 miles away so I'll rely on the library to help out.

I was at Barnes & Noble 2 days ago, only to discover there selection was very limited, and stuck way back in the corner, besides, I'm not very interested in "Philosophy, and the Simpsons" (yet anyway)


Thanks again, Evie

I think one of the best modern communicators of philosophy is Eckhart Tolle.

Hannah is very good, a bit thick, but the analysis is brilliant.  The book on the Eichmann trial is considered a modern masterpiece by many and I think she does a very good job of describing how the Holocaust was not done by these huge evil monsters, but by people just trying to get ahead in their careers.  Which of course is even worse.

Eric Hoffer is a most interesting person.  And where Hannah is a bit academic and 'New Yorkerish' Hoffer had by the time he wrote these books lived on skid row in LA, worked as a migrant farm worker, eventually becoming a Longshoreman on the docks of San Francisco, living right there and writing in his spare time.  His writing is plain, simple and easy to understand.

Tekla, as you mentioned Eric Hoffer, that reminded me of another name, Poet, Artist, "Thinker" Jorge Luis Borges, I think from Argentina: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jorge_Luis_Borges

I understand he was very influential

Familiar with him?

Evie

I love his short stories, that he never won a Nobel for Literature is a horrible oversight.

I was always in deep amazement over the two stories, "Funes, the Memorious" about a person who never forgets anything, and perhaps the most mind-blowing of all his work, one that haunts anyone who has ever read it, "The Secret Miracle" about the guy in front of the firing squad who as a gift has time stand still for a full year.

Borges is indeed a master. I remember when I first read "The Librarian of Babel" and I was totally amazed at the style of writing.  I had never read anything like it.

I don't think before he wrote anyone had ever written like that before.  It was breathtakingly unique.

Thanks for the replies, that reinforces my interest. I'll move him up on my list

I just finished Ayn Rand's "Philosophy-Who needs it" I'm gonna let my brain cool off for a bit, Maybe Borges would be a good way to do that.

hugs, kids, Evie

I'm kinda impressed that you could make it though old Ayn and still have a brain that functioned.  When it comes to being cosmically and universally wrong but sounding perfectly right she be the queen of the scene.

There are so many good books, good writers (read some Harlen Ellison^*, his short stories are pretty much way over the edge still) that its almost a shame so many people spend their time on WoW, but then again, some has to be asking if you want fries with that. 

Just for interests sake I'd also recommend:
Alfred D. Chandler, Jr., The Visible Hand: The Managerial Revolution in American Business. (1977).  It deals with the invention of management, very revealing. If only to think about management being an invention and not a natural occurrence.

William Appleman Williams wrote two great books about how the US gets into so much trouble overseas.
The Tragedy of American Diplomacy, (1959).
The Contours of American History, (1961).

And for an basic understanding of where a lot of current problems lie try
Daniel Yergin, The Prize: The Epic Quest for Oil, Money, and Power, (1992).


* - Far too much to list here, try this site:
http://harlanellison.com/bibliography.htm

In particular I love the two books of TV criticism called The Glass Teat.
and these short stories:
Along the Scenic Route
Anywhere But Here, With Anybody But You
The Beast That Shouted Love at the Heart of the World
Croatoan
Gentleman Junkie
Hitler Painted Roses
I Have No Mouth, and I Must Scream - this one will give you nightmares for a long, long time.
Jeffty is Five
Lonely Women are the Vessels of Time
Midnight in the Sunken Cathedral
One Life, Furnished in Early Poverty
Pretty Maggie Moneyeyes
'Repent, Harlequin!' Said the Ticktockman
Shattered Like a Glass Goblin
The Whimper of Whipped Dogs - this one, based largely on a true story, will tear you apart

OK I think my dance card is full
Thanks for the references.
As I was reading Ayn, I came across this little tid bit, talk about brain freeze I had to start over about 4 times until I got the verbiage down and could follow what was actually being said, check it:

Quote

THREE DIALOGUES BETWEEN HYLAS AND PHILONOUS,
IN OPPOSITION TO SCEPTICS AND ATHEISTS

by: George Berkeley (1685-1753)

THE FIRST DIALOGUE

PHILONOUS. Good morrow, Hylas: I did not expect to find you abroad so early.
HYLAS. It is indeed something unusual; but my thoughts were so taken up with a subject I was discoursing of last night, that finding I could not sleep, I resolved to rise and take a turn in the garden.
PHIL.   It happened well, to let you see what innocent and agreeable pleasures you lose every morning. Can there be a pleasanter time of the day, or a more delightful season of the year? That purple sky, those wild but sweet notes of birds, the fragrant bloom upon the trees and flowers, the gentle influence of the rising sun, these and a thousand nameless beauties of nature inspire the soul with secret transports; its faculties too being at this time fresh and lively, are fit for those meditations, which the solitude of a garden and tranquillity of the morning naturally dispose us to. But I am afraid I interrupt your thoughts: for you seemed very intent on something.
HYL.   It is true, I was, and shall be obliged to you if you will permit me to go on in the same vein; not that I would by any means deprive myself of your company, for my thoughts always flow more easily in conversation with a friend, than when I am alone: but my request is, that you would suffer me to impart my reflexions to you.
PHIL.   With all my heart, it is what I should have requested myself if you had not prevented me.
HYL.   I was considering the odd fate of those men who have in all ages, through an affectation of being distinguished from the vulgar, or some unaccountable turn of thought, pretended either to believe nothing at all, or to believe the most extravagant things in the world. This however might be borne, if their paradoxes and scepticism did not draw after them some consequences of general disadvantage to mankind. But the mischief lieth here; that when men of less leisure see them who are supposed to have spent their whole time in the pursuits of knowledge professing an entire ignorance of all things, or advancing such notions as are repugnant to plain and commonly received principles, they will be tempted to entertain suspicions concerning the most important truths, which they had hitherto held sacred and unquestionable.
PHIL.   I entirely agree with you, as to the ill tendency of the affected doubts of some philosophers, and fantastical conceits of others. I am even so far gone of late in this way of thinking, that I have quitted several of the sublime notions I had got in their schools for vulgar opinions. And I give it you on my word; since this revolt from metaphysical notions to the plain dictates of nature and common sense, I find my understanding strangely enlightened, so that I can now easily comprehend a great many things which before were all mystery and riddle.

I'm on the second dialog now
Thanks again Tekla, I'll be at the library tomorrow looking up Borges
Ta, Evie

Well long before you read Ayn, you should have a full background in classic philosophy, where she ripped off what few good thoughts she had.  But I have a real sick - almost fetish - for the Classical Greek Tragedies.

And the Ellison stuff is almost all very short stories, things that take less than 20 minutes to read, and a lifetime to forget.

Ayn Rand drives me up the wall.  Egoism is virtuous and altruism is destructive, yeah okay...  I would discourage you from polluting your mind with that garbage.

This is going to sound silly, but the best intro to Philosophy I've read is Philosophy for Dummies.  No joke, it was very well written and smart and gives a really nice overview of all the major ideas and thinkers.

Well I've picked up "A Short History of Philosophy" by Robert Solomon & Kathleen Higgins, and Jorge Luis Borges "Collected Fiction" as translated by Andrew Hurley, (Library so I have until Feb 13 to read them) So far both are extremely enlightening.

And yes Borges' writing is different, I have to pause and remove myself from each story after completing, He draws you right into his mind and the environment of the story, as though he's talking to you... fascinating!

Evie

Paul Theroux has an entire section of the The Old Patagonian Express where he talks about meeting Borges, the entire book is pretty cool, but that section is very interesting.

Holy hell y'all are making me feel like I'm not very well read. I guess I just don't read those kinds of books, but ya know I probably should. I can't just read classic English and American lit or books about physics forever.

Though if you want to get into applied philosophy, there is no better subject than physics, imo.  If you want to learn about Determinism, read up on General Relativity and think about it.  Want free-will?  Learn about Quantum Mechanics and think about it.  You have no idea of the bizzare ideas in my head that I have thanks to physics.

Anyway my friend and I have a little book club together.  Now I have a bunch to add to my list. So thanks!

Quote from: Jen on January 18, 2010, 10:32:59 AM
Holy hell y'all are making me feel like I'm not very well read. I guess I just don't read those kinds of books, but ya know I probably should. I can't just read classic English and American lit or books about physics forever.

Though if you want to get into applied philosophy, there is no better subject than physics, imo.  If you want to learn about Determinism, read up on General Relativity and think about it.  Want free-will?  Learn about Quantum Mechanics and think about it.  You have no idea of the bizzare ideas in my head that I have thanks to physics.

Anyway my friend and I have a little book club together.  Now I have a bunch to add to my list. So thanks!

don't feel alone Jen, I've just decided to get into this topic. I read a few posts here and decided i better get reading to play catch up so to say. I find the subject fascinating. When I do research I find myself overwhelmed with info and leads to additional authors etc.That's why I posted this thread so I could get advice and help as to the direction I might seek.

As far as Physics... well, String theory had it for me, I thought they were really on to something, then Dr. Michio Kaku comes at us with the parallel universe theory, and my world got one hell of a lot brighter (or was that the Super Nova). I often list quantum mechanics as one of my hobbies, though I understand as much about it as I do philosophy, but still I am intrigued with the subject.

Evie