I am not quite sure, but my feeling becomes stronger and stronger. I think my face becomes masculine as my biological age approaches 50. People comment that my body shape is indeed feminine and slim, but my face does not match with it. A few people sometimes comment that my face is also feminine, but I do not agree.

A few days ago, before taking shower in the morning, I was charmed by my own body shown in the mirror. It was so lovely to my eyes. But, my masculine skin was cacophony in my girly mood. I want soft-skinned body and face. Next month, I will talk to my friend who is a GP. He does not like my crossdressing, but he may write prescription for estrogen or others for me. I prefer edible pills to injection. Just slight dosage for feminizing my face a little bit, minimizing any chance of side effects.

I do not need strong sexual desire or libido. I hope people will accept me more easily as my face matches better with my body. Of course, I will continue to be a good dad to my kids. Just slight enhancement in my face...

Barbie~~

Estrogen does not just affect the face, I hope you know that,  But it affects the entire body.  Yes, you will get softer skin.  Yes, your face will feminize. 

But you will have reduced libido, breast enlargement, body hair reducetion.  Begin HRT is not for the fainthearted.  Make sure that you are prepared for all the changes.  And don't do it if you are remotely apprehensive.


Hugs,
Janet

Quote from: barbie on January 29, 2010, 11:19:45 PM
I am not quite sure, but my feeling becomes stronger and stronger. I think my face becomes masculine as my biological age approaches 50.

I do not need strong sexual desire or libido. I hope people will accept me more easily as my face matches better with my body. Of course, I will continue to be a good dad to my kids. Just slight enhancement in my face...

Hey barbie! I love reading your posts! Just when I think I do not "fit in" here or anywhere else anymore I stumble across the same concerns that preoccupy me! Being slightly past 50 with kids (boy girl 10 12) I too have a tall slender body a lot of ggs would kill for with long brunette hair (all mine!) atop a much too masculine face!

As you may or not know I am currently divorcing wife seeking full custody as she is truly *psychotic & criminal* yet it has been an uphill battle and despite all the wild allegations & lies flying on her part IT IS NOT REALLY ABOUT CROSSDRESSING for me so much as it is a more neutral based "genderdressing" to better fit casual observer perceptions given the fact how society almost forces us into a clearly identifiable either/or mentality . . .

Correct If Wrong but You and I seem to be caught in the same catch-22 because, in spite of our own sense of conflicting inner identity, we indeed do not have the luxury of deliberately attempting to misrepresent our birth gender as we seek to portray *quite feminine* while all the time retaining the cherished mainstream social role of "dad" for our kids - the highly biased, ofttimes ignorant "world" can quite easily challenge our *perversion of their natural order* based on chosen defining ways of dressing but how can they dare dispute *actual appearances to the contrary* as long as we nominally insist on continuing to assert ourselves "as male"?

Am I making ant sense at all 'cause it does seem like a huge contradictory goal that for me cannot otherwise be easily explained (so why try? what you see/think is YOUR PROBLEM NOT MINE)! lol "Er, excuse me maam, but did I hear your children call you dad?" 

barbie, to answer yer question having been mostly ON HRT for over three years now your facial look will definitely thin out & soften a bit and as far as breast growth is concerned estrogen will probably not become a real problem as long as you remain body thin (which like me I know you will) so GO FOR IT,

Nothing happens overnight and can always stop! Libido is also not a prob ; can *take it or leave it* but then again I have been judiciously avoiding cultivating any innate enjoyment of attentive men - as long as the kids are around I'm quite happy to be a single Mr Mom - have you ever considered any FFS? (as SRS is definitely OUT for now, can never see it happening to me!)

I so badly want to start on spiro at least, but have been able to resist that temptation so far... In part thanks to support here at Susans gently reminding me DIY is very dangerous, and in part because I know doing it behind my wife's back is dishonest and would get me kicked out onto the street.

But I also have a feminine-looking face (one other person here at Susans who has seen my pic said I "had a girl's face with a beard."), so I'm very curious how I'd look after the effects of HRT (and lazer, of course).

I also am eager to get all the other effects of HRT, both the mental and physical... but thus far I'm still on the path to do it the proper way (if I ever do it).

Thanks for all lovely replies.

As my kids are growing up, it would not matter so much. My little daughter likes to play with my 5-inch red high heel sandals, and she knows that they are mine. She also asks why dad wears make up while mom does not. She also sometimes searches for my nipples. My kids see and know that I sometimes wear skirts, which are hung in my closet.

I have not yet decided to transition, and I will listen to opinions of other people including my friends, especially the doctor. Probably I will not talk to my wife, as I think it can frighten her unnecessarily. Doctors may recommend me estrogen or spiro and others.

A few days ago, I walk along with my wife while wearing the 4-inch heels. She sometimes gave me her fashion items such as tight tops, tights and bags. She trusted me so much, and I will never disappoint her.

Kids and side effects are the major concerns to me.

Yes. Yesterday I ran about 15 km to meet my friends in a beer bar. It was really nice to drink beer after sweating. The effect of exercising is marvelous. I become so happy and confident. A problem was that I drunk to much as I was so much thirsty 

Barbie~~

This is a temtation I gave into ten months ago.  I am starting to notice changes in my face and I am increasingly happy with my appearance.  I know I have a long way to go but I am starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel.

What is important is not how others see you bt how you see yourself.  I know inside I am female and increasingly my external appearance is matching my internal feelings.   I am lucky, I have no spouse or children.  There are very few people to shock or disappoint.  I am finding it hard to express my feelings to others.  I cannot imagine how hard this would be with a wife and children.

Quote from: barbie on January 30, 2010, 12:27:37 PM
Thanks for all lovely replies.

As my kids are growing up, it would not matter so much. My little daughter likes to play with my 5-inch red high heel sandals, and she knows that they are mine. She also asks why dad wears make up while mom does not. She also sometimes searches for my nipples. My kids see and know that I sometimes wear skirts, which are hung in my closet.

I have not yet decided to transition, and I will listen to opinions of other people including my friends, especially the doctor. Probably I will not talk to my wife, as I think it can frighten her unnecessarily. Doctors may recommend me estrogen or spiro and others.

A few days ago, I walk along with my wife while wearing the 4-inch heels. She sometimes gave me her fashion items such as tight tops, tights and bags. She trusted me so much, and I will never disappoint her.

Kids and side effects are the major concerns to me.

Yes. Yesterday I ran about 15 km to meet my friends in a beer bar. It was really nice to drink beer after sweating. The effect of exercising is marvelous. I become so happy and confident. A problem was that I drunk to much as I was so much thirsty 

Barbie~~

If this ever makes you miserable I'm sure that your kids would enjoy you far more when you're truly happy. I dk of your situation completely, but if this is the case, part of me would think better to do it early.

But I'm no expert.

Quote from: Pippa on January 31, 2010, 09:44:37 AM
What is important is not how others see you bt how you see yourself.  I know inside I am female and increasingly my external appearance is matching my internal feelings.   I am lucky, I have no spouse or children.  There are very few people to shock or disappoint.  I am finding it hard to express my feelings to others.  I cannot imagine how hard this would be with a wife and children.

I agree that how I see myself is more important. Sometimes I need a courage and determination to change something and the world suddendly looks different. When I first go out wearing skirt and heels. When I quit smoking. When I started exercise...

Regarding my kids, I just worry what I should wear when I attend their wedding ceremony in which I should meet and talk with the partent of the spouse of my kid. I hope it would not be a big deal.

Barbie~~

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Post Merge: February 01, 2010, 08:00:27 AM

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Quote from: Kara-Xen on January 31, 2010, 11:22:28 AM
I dk of your situation completely, but if this is the case, part of me would think better to do it early.

But I'm no expert.

Kara, I do not think an expert is always better in advising me regarding my future. An expert is good at a specific area, not at the whole life of a person.

If I can quite smoking, I may consider starting HRT. I have smoked for about 25 years and tried several times to quit.

Barbie~~

Hi Barbie,

The line that worries me is this:

"I have not yet decided to transition, and I will listen to opinions of other people including my friends, especially the doctor. Probably I will not talk to my wife, as I think it can frighten her unnecessarily. Doctors may recommend me estrogen or spiro and others."

You should reconsider transitioning (or seriously considering it) without talking to your wife.  One of the truism's about transition is that you transition and you (unintentionally) cause your family and friends to transition too.  In the sense that they have to deal with the issues, whether they wanted to do so or not.  The changes from HRT can be quite dramatic and permanent.  Definitely not fair to your wife to start to do so, without her knowledge.  I believe that it is unfair to even consider it without her input.  The more she is involved, the more likely your marriage can weather the storms that are common when one partner transitions.

If your face is all you're worried about, why not just save up (a lot) of money and try for FFS?

Barbie,

I have not been around a long time. But you were one of the persons I knew best here.  I'm sure you remember me. You always were an inspiration. We have some things in common. Like children. I think we are both 'government officials'.

My son of 6 always takes away the nail polish when he sees it is next to me. And I think he also already knows there are some things in the closet which are not in their place.  Once he asked me 'why do you wear mama's underwear ?' I wasn't, it was mine. I didn't think he'd notice.  It looked almost male one but he still noticed.

I think I read once from you a long time ago you wouldn't take hormones. You already look much like a woman. You certainly have already a very good result.  If I would be you I would not really hesitate. The people around you accept you for what you mean to them.  The gender isn't the most important in that. And you certainly would have a good result.

Like 20 years ago I wanted to become a bodybuilding champion.  I never took hormones.  But many I knew did.  And it certainly made a huge difference. But also their whole personality changed.  Some became very aggressive.  They had psychological issues.  Legal problems also.  Their marriage became a mess.  My training partner got health problems as well.  I already wondered why he was so strong, then he told me why.  Me, I think I have this 'natural' sensitivity for male hormones. It's been over 10 years since I have been in the gym but I still have my big biceps and my 'tits'. Even if now I want to get rid of them ( I mean the big biceps, not the tits    ).

If you take female hormones, and if you really want to go on, I think you should.  However I don't think it will drastically change your face over night, especially iof you take low dosis.  Maybe better supervised also.  But then you will loose also your male confidence which comes with your male hormones.  I know that's what it does to me.  For a while because of medication I took my male hormone levels dropped.  And tell you the truth I didn't like it.   I had all kinds of bad effects, things I used to have which I took for granted disappeared.  Especially self-confidence. lack of fear. Ability to think abstract.  Like you I thought I did not need my libido.  But I do need it. I need my obsession and my 'dirty mind'.

I agree with silverfang in fact.  But Silverfang, the problem is money.  When you have a ( young ) family it's not always easy to put money aside for your operation. Needs are everywhere. 

I don't know where life will take me from here but it's a bit part of my personal strategy to try to get the means to do what I want to do. Mayeb there should be more information on this forum on 'How do I finance it ?  How do I make more money to find my liberty ?'  I would also do FFS surgery but I'm far from ready yet.  Money would not make a difference now.  I have many things to change still.  And I work on it every day. Step by step.

C.

Hi Barbie,

I know how you feel, I have the same body/face issues..

....although I am not as wonderfully slim as you, I have a very feminine body shape, but still male facial features etc..

...my soul craves HRT, but my reality denies it... 

If you find the answer....let me know.. 



Chrissty

Kaeren and Chrissty,

Thanks so much, and I am really glad to read your message here again. I guess we joined this forum on the nearly the same day.

Yesterday I visited a big university hospital. The technique of SRS is the most advanced there in this country. A doctor there is famous, as he proudly conducted several hundred SRSs successfully, including Ha Ri Su.

But, my purpose yesterday was to visit a psychiatrsit frist. Cashiers and nurses were too much routine, and did not notice my tall height, the junior's miniskirt, long red coat, and brown winter tights with manly voice.

There was no such thing 'privacy' in the psychiatrist's office. There were several patients in the waiting room, and the nurse loudly asked me "are you going to have SRS?" while I was standing in front of the cashier's desk.

Oh. My gosh.... This was her first question to me, and everybody there could hear it. It was like having sex without any foreplay. It was too much straightforward and .... very bold and of course plainly rude. As she also became aware of my anger, she reminded me that she can reimburse all money I already paid if I want to stop there. I became speechless.

I did not see the doctor. The nurse gave me a bunch of questionnaires for pyschiatirc test, asking me to fill in them at home and returning by postal mail. And I paid the charge by my credit card (ca. $200). She said I need to pay another $100 when I see the doctor after scoring and evaluating the questionnaires. She added that I may not have HRT without consulting the psychiatrist.

Sometimes the nurse studied my eyes. She explained how to fill out the questionnairs, and I sometimes was bored and did not pay attention to her. Then she asked me to listen carefully. Finally I found her mistake. One of questionnaires was marked as "for teens". I pointed out it, and she hurried to replace it with one for adults.

I said to her tha I can fill the questionnair within 1 hour at the waiting room, so that I do not need to mail them. She replied she should go home at 5:00 PM, and it was 4:30 PM.

It was a kind of cultural shock to me.


I was once so much upset on the treatment there, considering giving up my plan for HRT. But, I already spent several hours to visit there, and determined to listen what the pyschiatrist would say or recommend. HRT is not any kind of a must now. It is still optional....

I have not yet completed the questionnaires.

Barbie~~

Barbie,

We did join more or less on the same day.  But you came back I think, while for me it was a first time. 

The backside of going to a place with a lot of 'experience' is perhaps that it becomes an industry. What is for you a big step is an everyday task for that nurse who does not care at all. So much is clear.  They do it every day. What's the big deal ?

You know how to see whether a restaurant or a shop is good ? By looking whether there are many customers or not.  And if there are not many then something is wrong. Same thing for everything. Even for hospitals and doctors.

I'm not 100 % sure but I think in Belgium SRS is even paid back by social security.  It's not as common as in the countries from the east.  I suppose in Thailand it's part of everyday life But not so here.  Still, I would also prefer to go somewhere where there is a doctor with a lot of experience. The thing I exactly would want to skip is the psychiatrist.  I don't like it when somebody else decides it for me. I'm big, old and mature enough to know what I want and when I'm ready. All you need to get the pill is a woman / friend who asks the doctor for birth control and then gives it to you.  I guess I'm not a good advice at all.  I have no scruples for that. If I'll have to wait for the permission of another I'll wait for ever.  But honestly I don't know much about it at all. Don't listen to me !

I'm going to have my teeth done in 2 months. I have to wait so long because the dentist has too much work.  I made them white 3 years ago.  But I have 3 corrections made with mercury.  They have been there for more than 25 years.  But I've read now it is not healthy.  And it is also nicer if they are white completely.  One of the 3 is already replaced by a white one.  The 2 others will follow soon.

I'm making a statistical economical simulator on the computer.  A stock market program ( allthough it is more than that ).  That's my strategy for freedom. Money can buy you freedom. I think I need a lot of money to do all I want to do.  I have been working on it almost every day for more than a year now already.  It can even speak.  It started as a help for my professional work but it grew a bit out of proportion since. It's stable, fast and performant even if I say so myself.  I showed it to a private banker and he said he was impressed. But much work is still to be done. When it's done I hope it will give me the means of change.

K.

Kaeren,

Yes, I agree with you on the principle of captialism. A problem here is there are many hospitals that are not so much competent, but can survive anyway, partially owing to monopoly. During the Asian crisis in 1997-1998, most industrial companies in this country could not survive, and were restructured greatly. They are now very slim and competent. Hospitals are exceptional, but I guess they will also face the same crisis, urged to be restructured.

Regarding HRT, my major concern is the side effects like ther TG here. I read messages here on the side-effect issues. It would be uncertain what kind of side effect I would have. There should be a compromise between my desire and side effect. And I am still flexible on my HRT plan. I can stop it at any time or change the dose after consulting the doctor, and my friend will also give advice. As I've set about it, there is no turning back. Today I sent the questionnaires by mail.

I have worked on climate-change issues, and will be charge of the related research team in my insititute. I also nearly completed writing a research proposal at national scale. About 20 senior and young scientists around the country helped me draft it. I am also looking forward to moving to a university here to educate students.

Keep in touch,

Barbie~~

Quote from: barbie on January 29, 2010, 11:19:45 PM
I am not quite sure, but my feeling becomes stronger and stronger. I think my face becomes masculine as my biological age approaches 50. People comment that my body shape is indeed feminine and slim, but my face does not match with it. A few people sometimes comment that my face is also feminine, but I do not agree.

A few days ago, before taking shower in the morning, I was charmed by my own body shown in the mirror. It was so lovely to my eyes. But, my masculine skin was cacophony in my girly mood. I want soft-skinned body and face. Next month, I will talk to my friend who is a GP. He does not like my crossdressing, but he may write prescription for estrogen or others for me. I prefer edible pills to injection. Just slight dosage for feminizing my face a little bit, minimizing any chance of side effects.

I do not need strong sexual desire or libido. I hope people will accept me more easily as my face matches better with my body. Of course, I will continue to be a good dad to my kids. Just slight enhancement in my face...

Barbie~~

I'm not sure HRT would be the ultimate answer? it may help a bit but I also think hardness in my face is a problem despite being on HRT for many years, and it hasn't worked that well in softening my face. I'm now looking at other ways of doing it...possibly some form of dermibrassion or filler to give me a softer fatter face.

N.B., I don't know ... it definitely helped me in terms of skin. That's probably the biggest thing it has done so far.

I think if the idea is to halt the progression of male aging, it's likely you'll be satisfied with the results, though that certainly doesn't rule out other things such as dermabrasion.

About dermabrasion. Aging has nothing to do with being male or female. But everything with being alive. I came out of puberty with scars on my face from acne.  I'm lucky enough not to have them really visible.  You already need to look close to see them. I've read about dermabrasion but I'm a bit afraid of it.  It's very agressive as a treatment.  Maybe it is better to use 'normal' techniques.  A sauna can also give you a better skin.  And so can some vitamins.

Barbie,

What I hear and see about the economy and the whole world is that influence is moving to the east.  It will not be America or Europe which will be most influential but rather the asian countries. China, Japan, Hong Kong, ... .

About work. My statistical money project is a personal one. It will move on to a rule based system I think, rules based on statistical analysis.  The next thing I will build now is a rule seeker.  Tell you the truth I don't really find anybody interested, willing and able to join, certainly not 20 people. Sometimes I talk about it with somebody.  Even on dedicated forums.  But ....... nothing.  Some say the problem is too difficult to be solved, which is not the right attitude to get things done. 

The environment I would probably prefer most to work in would be research and development. But it's not so.  It's rather political and financial, not at all construction which was my first thing.  I don't know whether I would like to teach.  Probably not, I would get nervous from it. I prefer to apply things in real life. Let that be my judge.

I come in contact with hospitals and social organisations.  I have no idea how I tumbled in this kind of work which is a bit in the center.  I just knew my boss from long ago and she asked me to come work for her at a certain moment.  That's why.  I knew somebody in other words. She's far from being an angle but she's doable now. 

Money rules the world.  It can not buy everything but it can certainly help a lot.  You can have your body hair removed with it. You can travel. You can buy the best food.  You can pimp your car.  You can even pimp yourself.  You can go to the best hospitals, have the best surgeons help you.  Buy the best clothes.  It can buy you a flat in London and a house in Dubai.  I know I should not be so materialistic. But you become like that if you have had some bad experiences in the past with money.  My pretty wife had a period when she was not paid for a few months even while she went working.  She's worse than I am.  What's the result from having to live from nothing ?

You can say anything to whomever doesn't like your lifestyle if you have money.

K.


_{Profanity removed}

Quote from: Kaeren on February 13, 2010, 12:10:23 PM
About dermabrasion. Aging has nothing to do with being male or female. But everything with being alive. I came out of puberty with scars on my face from acne.  I'm lucky enough not to have them really visible.  You already need to look close to see them. I've read about dermabrasion but I'm a bit afraid of it.  It's very agressive as a treatment.  Maybe it is better to use 'normal' techniques.  A sauna can also give you a better skin.  And so can some vitamins.

Men usually have much harder faces than women no matter what age they are after puberty. My objective is to soften my face as much as possible which may or may not be with the assistance of surgical proceedure's!

Quote from: Kaeren on February 13, 2010, 12:10:23 PM
About dermabrasion. Aging has nothing to do with being male or female. But everything with being alive. I came out of puberty with scars on my face from acne.  I'm lucky enough not to have them really visible.  You already need to look close to see them. I've read about dermabrasion but I'm a bit afraid of it.  It's very agressive as a treatment.  Maybe it is better to use 'normal' techniques.  A sauna can also give you a better skin.  And so can some vitamins.

I once used dermabrasion creams, and the results were not so good. I once consulted with a dermatologist here. After examining my facial skin, he recommended to massage my face with ice, minimize the time in sauna, and always wash face with cold water. After following his advice, my skin became better and I no longer have any acne.

My skin problem was due to too much fat, which is related with male hormones. I heard that female hormones can decrease the amount of facial fat.

Barbie~~