the reason i'm posting this is that i'm trying to be a social person
i'm usually the silent type , don't talk (especially in groups) unless it's something i really wanna say  , so it usually goes like this:
*a conversation is going*
me: "saying an advice/opinion"
someone: O.o ok but how long have you been here?
ok lol it doesn't always get this awkward but yeah , i'm that silent

the thing is .. i mean .. when someone telling me something informative (i.e not a question or so) i'm like ,"ok" .but i have to say something to become more of a social person, so when i try to say something back ,most of the time i come up with a random stupid thing , and that's IF i came up with something to say =/

i wonder how come do i have friends    seriously
anyway , anyone having a similar problem , or have a clue how to fix this?

I have the same problem, but mine is more if I say something, it is ignored.  So why bother?  My opinion is not important, I guess.

and maker of fools

I'm exactly like that too except I don't want to fix it. People like to see the nontalkative people as the weirdos and creeps but that's their problem not mine . I've just learned to embrace that I'm a quiet person and if someone has a problem with that they can get over it lol.

Quote from: Janet Lynn on May 16, 2010, 08:27:32 PM
I have the same problem, but mine is more if I say something, it is ignored.  So why bother?  My opinion is not important, I guess.

*hugs* , although i know for a fact that your opinion is important to A LOT of people janet ,of course myself included , seriously

Quote from: ƃuıxǝʌ on May 16, 2010, 08:29:52 PM
Alcohol: the social lubricant 

yeah ,that doesn't work very well with me hehe, like lordkat said , it makes me just blur out anything that comes to my mind without even the ability to listen to what others say

Quote from: lightvi on May 16, 2010, 08:55:24 PM
I'm exactly like that too except I don't want to fix it. People like to see the nontalkative people as the weirdos and creeps but that's their problem not mine . I've just learned to embrace that I'm a quiet person and if someone has a problem with that they can get over it lol.

go go weirdos hehe , well i'm the weirdest person i've ever known in my life .. and i like it
actually i went through the phase of embracing my tendency to quietness long time ago , but couldn't do it 100% , i mean i like being quiet , but because of it i'm always feeling left out

Practice. You can practice being silent and if anyone has a problem with it, they'll go away eventually. Or you can practice talking and eventually become more proficient. It's a skill, like anything else.

Oh god bad memories. I've had people ask me "why are you so quiet?" and I'd just respond with a meek "I dunno" , makes me want to crawl into a hole and die

I always found it easier talking to someone one on one (or just a couple of people) so I usually just try to avoid being in groups .

When you're being silent do you feel out of place (in regards to the conversation)? I'll try to explain that more... when I was in high school, I'd sit with these group of guys during lunch occasionally since I had a few friends in the group. They would talk about getting high/drunk. I don't smoke, or drink, so I was never really sure how to be a part of that conversation . Hanging around people I have stuff in common with (or at least not hanging out with people I have absolutely nothing in common with ) it felt easier to talk, because I could actually relate to them - even if only a little. I agree with Arch though, practice , you might make a fool of yourself (I know all to well ), but you have to try

lol , yeah i even tried that IRL (talking to mirror) but it doesn't work as i always like what i say and the 'other part' say the same thing hehe

but yeah i do practice , and that's when the "saying stupid things" part occurs , and here comes weirdness : i like being quiet , i wanna be silent , but i don't wanna be quiet or silent (!)  , i want to interact , be able to have a conversation that has no purpose other than chat or just talking , i mean i can't do this even on the internet , now i  stopped trying to, partially because of feeling down and mostly because i don't want people to think i'm retarded or something if i say something stupid

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Post Merge: May 16, 2010, 09:42:44 PM

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Quote from: Katelyn-W on May 16, 2010, 10:20:26 PM
Oh god bad memories. I've had people ask me "why are you so quiet?" and I'd just respond with a meek "I dunno" , makes me want to crawl into a hole and die

I always found it easier talking to someone one on one (or just a couple of people) so I usually just try to avoid being in groups .

When you're being silent do you feel out of place (in regards to the conversation)? I'll try to explain that more... when I was in high school, I'd sit with these group of guys during lunch occasionally since I had a few friends in the group. They would talk about getting high/drunk. I don't smoke, or drink, so I was never really sure how to be a part of that conversation . Hanging around people I have stuff in common with (or at least not hanging out with people I have absolutely nothing in common with ) it felt easier to talk, because I could actually relate to them - even if only a little. I agree with Arch though, practice , you might make a fool of yourself (I know all to well ), but you have to try

omg that's exactly what's happening with me . i do find it a lot easier to talk to 1 or maximum two people , and yeah in high school i didn't fit in quiet well because they were all going 'bad boy' mode and i was the nice little sweet one heh , so i was often picked at even , started to find people with things in common in college but even those (although i feel pretty comfortable around them) i don't talk very much either .so the outcome is , i can only talk freely when it's one on one conversation with someone i know and trust , otherwise :x .   thanks ^_^
and thanks for the input everyone

I'm only quiet around people I feel uncomfortable with...given that I feel uncomfortable around everyone right now it's a wonder I'm not communicating via semaphore.

I know it's a stage though, so the best thing is just not to worry about it because that always makes things worse.

I'm one of those who don't talk unless they have something to say. When I was younger, that equated to pretty much "never," but as I've grown older I've sort of begun to adapt by trying to learn something about everything so that I have something of value to add to most conversations.

I guess I'm different though because I love large group conversations and hate one-on-one. When there's only one or two other people around, there's so much pressure to keep coming up with things to talk about. In a big group, people are bouncing ideas all over the place, the burden of keeping the conversation going is broken into a lot of smaller pieces, and people keep bringing up new topics or saying interesting things that I can respond to.

Ok - Something else... in my experience the keys to this is "active listening" - that is don't just sit there silently letting it all wash by, think about what the people you are with are saying, try to imagine what they must be feeling like to say whatever they are saying. Try to put yourself in their shoes. Then try to find an interesting question to ask to open up that aspect.

Now if you are a bit of a factoid person you may immediately think of factual questions - but that is not really what I mean - you don't want to turn this into an inquisition - i mean factual questions are good, but perhaps later on in the conversation - at this point the question ideally should be one that has a more empathetic leaning... one that shows that you have heard what they have just told you! It's also good if you can avoid using too many closed questions - that is ones that are answeable with a yes/no answer. Instead try to find an open question which makes people want to talk more.

Hopefully by now, if you have been listening to what the other people said, they will have said something that you either agree with or disagree with. Either way now is your chance to come back with a witty story or another point of view... and so the dialogue begins. It's not rocket science here - but the beginning of it is to ask questions and then LISTEN to the answers before starting to try to make too many points.

The basic point is that if you want to be "sociable" you have to undertand that most people tend to like other people who seem interested in them and are engaging.

Jenny hit on an important point. Some people are way more enamored of their own commentary or planning what they will say next than interested in actually listening to what the other person is saying. I think it's possible that many of us tended to be loners. We kept to ourselves, not communicating because we were hiding our true selves inside a shell. Listening to other people's conversations helps too, noticing the things others talk about, usually it's not rocket science. Doing that helped me break out of my shell. The real social lubricant is being sociable. Yeah people say a lot of stupid, meaningless things and no doubt you will too sometimes. It's part of being human and it's okay. Sometimes it's not so much what it is you are saying as it is the fact that you're talking at all.

i agree , listening to people is helpful . but that's like the one thing i like in being around people , i like to listen actually an i do.  well listening ,watching ,reading , i always like learning new thing , i just can't be a part of it
for me i've benn training myself for years now , and actually that's how i got my current group of friends , before that i had absolutely none , i mean i was A LOT worse , but that's the best thing i could do in like 7 or 9 years of trying to train myself to talk more heh , get he picture?

Some people are way more enamored of their own commentary or planning what they will say next than interested in actually listening to what the other person is saying.
True that.  Particularly the part about thinking about the next witty bon mot, and not listening to what's being said.  Really listening is about the rarest skill in the world I do believe.

But I also very strongly feel that while people want to be heard, and want people paying attention to them, they tend not to really appreciate it when someone really listens.

One way to practice both active listening and conversation is to try to rephrase what people have said and see if you got it right.

And a great bit of knowledge that someone gave me once when I was all bitching about never fitting in anywhere, never being a 'part of the group', my person told me "well then you can go anywhere with anyone because it's all going to be the same to you."  Turns out he was right.  It never matters who I'm talking to, because I'm always the same.  I try to find things they like, or are interested in, and when in doubt - as girls know because its in every set of dating tips ever published - let people talk about themselves, most people LOVE to talk about themselves, so all you have to do is let them, and they will think you're a brilliant conversationalist even if you really don't say much at all.  Really, it's just finding a bunch of ways to ask 'why.'

Like this - because its a pet peeve of mine - on internet boards, like this one, someone will start a topic, oh say "favorite X of all time", and you get fifty people responding, but all you have is a list of items.  I want to know why you like that, what speaks to you, what connection does it have.  It's just that why thing.


And, OK, I'm not telling people to lie.  But you can be, as Jerry used to sing 'honest to the point of recklessness' and its often counter productive.  So you don't like it, might even think it sucks - OK, we're only talking about it, we're not doing it so relax.  I have a great gift in my life through my work because as I tell people "I've worked with all your favorite bands, and I've worked with all the ones you don't like so much too."  So when I talk to people its something we can talk about.  Now if they say "Hey, you ever work the Screaming Crotchfruit, or the Anal Puswarts?" I can usually say sure.  And I talk about it, how cool it was (I got paid, that's always cool to me) - I don't tell them, at least right off, that I think their favorite band sucks, they are one chord, perhaps two chords short of being a three chord band, or that they are ->-bleeped-<-s, or any of that (even though it might be true, hell, odds are its true no matter who were talking about) I can almost always say "Hey, its not my thing, but everyone there sure had a rockin good time."  Because the venue rocks when the band is on even if I'm sitting there on the side of the stage thinking a root canal would be more fun, or a bag of cats tossed into a river would be closer to 'on key' than the singer.  I try to say nice things (yes I have to work on it), and not go "oh yeah, those guys, you know the drummer took a girl on the bus and if she was 13 I'd be amazed.'

See, if I say that I might have a momentary sense of triumph of oneupmanship - but I've alienated the person, so you win the battle, but lose the war.

I get asked stuff sometimes, or I go to art stuff like plays, gallery openings (free wine and cheese), experimental music, or the two scariest words in art 'modern dance' and I don't want to come off as some critic, or hurt anyone's feelings - its art after all, and its subjective by nature - so I've worked out some things to say.  Which I do.  I don't say, even though I'm thinking it, what follows in the parenthesis.

- Only you could have done that, or pulled that off.  (Because everyone else in the entire world has more talent than that.)

- That's very unique.

- I've never seen (heard, witnessed, read) anything quite like that.  (I don't have to say that I sure hope I never will again either.)

or the classic "what was your inspiration for that?"

They all sound ab-fab positive, and only when you parse it do you find out I really never said anything at all about my liking it or not liking it.  I'm not lying.  I'm just being selective in the truth.





Alcohol: the social lubricant
True that, however it does have one tiny drawback, to wit:
well, I hadn't intended
to bend the rules
but whiskey don't make liars
it just makes fools
so I didn't mean to say it
but I meant what I said
In vino veritas and all that.

Quote from: tekla on May 17, 2010, 10:42:34 AMSee, if I say that I might have a momentary sense of triumph of oneupmanship - but I've alienated the person, so you win the battle, but lose the war.

That's so very true. I run an online CG artist's forum and I always try to say something nice about the work that's posted, even if it's just "great composition" or "I love the way you managed to get all those things in one picture". To be perfectly honest part of the reason is that many of these people are my customers and I want to encourage them to keep trying. But also because I believe in positive reinforcement and it costs nothing to be polite to others, which is another, often sadly neglected social lubricant.

Quote from: FairyGirl on May 17, 2010, 11:02:59 AM
That's so very true. I run an online CG artist's forum and I always try to say something nice about the work that's posted, even if it's just "great composition" or "I love the way you managed to get all those things in one picture". To be perfectly honest part of the reason is that many of these people are my customers and I want to encourage them to keep trying. But also because I believe in positive reinforcement and it costs nothing to be polite to others, which is another, often sadly neglected social lubricant.

So very true - and isn't it great when everyone adopts that same constructive philosophy on boards like this...

Happily I think almost everyone on susans does which is one of the reasons that I am happy to stick around even though I'm so long since done and dusted. You wouldn't catch me on many of the other sites - far too many bashers and snipers!

Yep...I have this problem times twelve

Probably why I never get hired when I go to interviews. I'm asked questions I don't know how to respond with. I can't help it...it's hard to be a social person when I grew up with no social life

Wish I could help those who have the same problem but I'm trying to figure out how to fix this myself so...lol

the interesting thing is in this forum non of you have a a social issue your all articulate and social so maybe its a matter of becoming more comfortable witht the people you associate with if thats possible.
jessica

Nah, the point of forums, and any correspondence really, is you don't have to be 'social'.  Meaning, you don't have interact, you only have to read and reflect (if that).  For people with something like Asperger's syndrome it means you only have to decipher the worlds on the page, not the meaning and clues behind them as you do in a face to face conversation - and you don't have to do it in real time.

The world is full of people who write like angels but can't have a conversation to save their lives - and even more so going the other way, people who can talk, but can't write.

The timing is way different.^*  For people who are gifted in this area (face it, some people can tell a story, or a joke, others can't to save their life - not to mention that some people are 'people persons' while others are 'inanimate object persons'), who have studied and practiced it, you get a bunch of them together and conversation starts to flow at a really rapid rate.  It's kind of like someone who is an excellent shot all by themselves on a basketball court, and how that does not necessarily translate into being good in a game when you stick a bunch of good players on the court and all those dynamics change.


* - I once contemplated doing a study of one of the last international business giants who did business by correspondence, that is, by letter.  So I spend several days reading selections of this business correspondence from the 1920s.  For someone who grew up in a phone culture, and at the time it was the beginning of email, the pace seemed absolutely leisurely.  It took this guy a week plus to get the letter to the recipient, who responded in a day or two, then a week plus getting back - so you had almost half a month between actions.  Compare that with today, with all of our instant access around the world by phone, IM, text, email, where I frequently find people telling me (demanding, whatever) that I reply to something they sent me a whole five minutes ago.

Quote from: tekla on May 18, 2010, 07:30:45 AM
The world is full of people who write like angels but can't have a conversation to save their lives - and even more so going the other way, people who can talk, but can't write.

I take your point Tekla - but I would point out that it is possible for some of us to do both equally well/badly (delete as appropriate).