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What is really the huge deal about wanting to live as the other gender???

Started by justme19, May 21, 2010, 01:44:52 AM

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justme19

Title really says it all, i was just thinking today... what is really the big deal??? I can't think of any reason why?

Maybe because it's not the norm? But who really cares, life is it short, you should be living it how you want to....
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Silver

I don't know, there's a sort of feeling of "life is meaningless if I live it like this" feeling that comes with it. I wonder the same. Either way, I'm under enough stress that it's worth my time to find a solution.
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justme19

Just another thing..... It's not like we are chosing to live as the other gender..... we were not born in the right boidies so what is the big deal.....
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Janet_Girl

Quote from: justme19 on May 21, 2010, 01:57:54 AM
Just another thing..... It's not like we are chosing to live as the other gender..... we were not born in the right boidies so what is the big deal.....

And that makes it a big deal.  As I always say "No one in their sane mind would go through this on purpose"
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Silver

Quote from: Janet Lynn on May 21, 2010, 02:03:54 AM
And that makes it a big deal.  As I always say "No one in their sane mind would go through this on purpose"

Yup. All I know is that it's real.
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Arch

"The hammer is my penis." --Captain Hammer

"When all you have is a hammer . . ." --Anonymous carpenter
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Hermione01

Exactly. I wish a day would come where everyone was accepted as they presented, no questions asked.  :)
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andream

I'm gonna view it from the perspective of the people who aren't transitioning. Why is it such a big deal to them? Because we're changing who were are, at least in their eyes. Human gender and sexuality are such fundamental things, that if you mess with that, people simply find it hard to deal with. It forces them to question that which is fundamental to who they are. People don't like to be forced to question their life. By transitioning we become a walking statement against the status quo, whether we like it or not. That's why arguments such as gender, politics, religion etc are so heated, because these things involve the fundamentals of human mind and existence.
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Nero

Quote from: SilverFang on May 21, 2010, 01:57:04 AM
I don't know, there's a sort of feeling of "life is meaningless if I live it like this" feeling that comes with it. I wonder the same.

That's how I always felt. Since about age 11, there was never a point to anything. No matter what I did, it didn't matter because I had to do it as someone else. Until now of course. Now it just feels good to be alive.
Nero was the Forum Admin here at Susan's Place for several years up to the time of his death.
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BunnyBee

Quote from: andream on May 21, 2010, 03:22:51 AM
I'm gonna view it from the perspective of the people who aren't transitioning. Why is it such a big deal to them? Because we're changing who were are, at least in their eyes. Human gender and sexuality are such fundamental things, that if you mess with that, people simply find it hard to deal with. It forces them to question that which is fundamental to who they are. People don't like to be forced to question their life. By transitioning we become a walking statement against the status quo, whether we like it or not. That's why arguments such as gender, politics, religion etc are so heated, because these things involve the fundamentals of human mind and existence.

I agree with this.  And the status quo is so important to so many people because of the simple fear of the unknown.  The unknown is unmalleable, you can't control something you can't see or don't understand.  It's an issue of control, and the need for control relates to fear.

The fact that gender is so fundamental to identity is also the very thing that makes it such a big deal to us too.  It's one of the main components of the foundation upon which we build our lives.  If the foundation is thrown off, everything else is thrown off with it.
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rejennyrated

Quote from: Jen on May 21, 2010, 04:47:25 AM
And the status quo is so important to so many people...
Actually I always prefered Dire Straits to Status Quo!  :laugh:

(sorry - yes I'll get my coat - TAXI!)

although before I go a bit more seriously I think it is in part because a lot of people derive part of their own identities from who they are in relationship to us... therefore when you change yourself you also change a bt of them, and that can feel a bit like a rape of the personality.

I got something of the same feeling myself when one of my friends suddenly came out and transitioned. This was someone I had known for some while without any inkling that we were fellow travellers in that way! It felt a bit weird - like she was invading my territory!  :embarrassed: (although I know of course that she wasn't...)
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BunnyBee

Quote from: rejennyrated on May 21, 2010, 05:03:20 AM
I think it is in part because a lot of people derive part of their own identities from who they are in relationship to us

In a way, this goes back to how gender is such a fundamental component of who we are and who we are perceived to be.

If somebody asks why would it have been so hard to just suck it up and live as the gender we were born with, the answer is it's been so hard for us to live in that guise for the very same reason it's so hard for them to see this "new person" as the same person we've always been.  It's like, "This is me, and you can't see me as being this person.  Can you see the problem?"

Gender is a big deal.
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Arch

I think it really all goes back to tribalism. Our brains are hardwired that way, and living in larger communities doesn't seem to have caused us to evolve away from that...yet. We've only been living in larger groups (with more people than we personally know) for a few thousand years, really. I am curious to see what happens in the next ten thousand years. Or even five.

Oh, I forgot. I probably won't live that long. Bummer.
"The hammer is my penis." --Captain Hammer

"When all you have is a hammer . . ." --Anonymous carpenter
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FairyGirl

Quote from: Jen on May 21, 2010, 01:58:41 PMIn a way, this goes back to how gender is such a fundamental component of who we are

The big deal to me is because that "other gender" is not who I am. So to me it's not about living as the "other" gender (male), it's about living as MY gender (female). If I were male, then it wouldn't be a big deal to live as one. But being female and trying to live as a male is just not healthy in any way. Hope all that makes sense.
Girls rule, boys drool.
If I keep a green bough in my heart, then the singing bird will come.
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spacial

I've given a lot of thought to this notion over the years.

There us a part of us, as a society, that refuses to view past wasy of living as being intrinsically incorrect.

We have cars for transport, but these only replace transport that we previously used. We have telephones, TV, medicines and so on. Each updates of what we previously had.

But fundimental preconceptions remain. What is is to be a man or a woman. Homosexuality.

If I had lived, say 100 years ago, or 200, 300, 400 years ago, would I have managed to survive any better than I am now?

I have to conclude that, in the past, I probably wouldn't have made it to adulthood.

If I consider the sources of my own difficulities with daily life, my innate effininacy, my sexuality, my continuing attempts to act out a part. The last of these, which has more or less, defined my own life, would have made it almost impossibe to function within the ordered existance of working class people in a society dominated by a social elite.

As someone born in the post WW2 world, I have been able to take advantage of the social breakdown of the old orders. The needs of an economy that could no longer cushion its limitations with the production of Africa and Asia meant that it became an imperitive to expand the entrepunerial pool to include those born in the lower classes. The priveledges of the social elite needed to be broken. Most of them seem to have retired into a sort of self imposed social exile. Living out their own pretensions, financed by their control of the profits from which they skimm their living.

This is a virtual mirror of the aristocricy, of course, many of whom have been living this way since the 17th century. Though, of course, they did so with the full agreement of the suceeding generation of social elite.

The opportunites are there for us. They aren't easy, nor are they free. They are certainly not an easy option.

We can reject a telephone, we can reject a car, a TV, electricity. We can reject the opportunity to change our gender.

But the question is, why?
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alexia elliot

I think the fundamental base for our hardship is in the need to be accepted, as many of you have already stated, in the societal structure. It isn't of who we are or who we aren't but how we are perceived by others, those with close ties and those totally inconsequential. It is all in introverted life perception which makes for our anxiety, we have a black whole of a brain which sucks in all the information surrounding us and calculates our position within. So for instance I just read one post here about passing with no intention, and this event was of magnificent happiness, of course it was but scientifically why was it so grand when the person inside is still the same person who was there ll along even when not passing! We are a sponge of human emotion and unfortunately can not separate other than building a concrete shell around our sole, but everyone here knows bit about this. We want to be free of negative and full of positive and that goes for our appearance because it is the first dimension of human existence within a group. Almost to the point that nothing else matters as much as projecting a appropriate female character. We do not want to be judged but just pass thru life with feeling of assigned purpose. For us, part of that purpose is to be a woman.
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sarahm

Before starting my transition my feelings were more like;
My life is not worth living if I live this way. I have to make my life worth living and be myself, not be scared anymore.

Low and behold, my whole outlook on life has changed dramatically since starting HRT 2 months ago (25th or March ;) ) I am now a much more positive person, and actually care about myself, and care more for people around me. ^_^
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Carolyn

It's a big deal to others who are not like us, mainly because most of them will never question themselves as we all have. They do not nor can not understand our existence. Because they don't understand it they fear it, fear leads to hate and hate leads to suffering. Human kind destroys what it fears and hate thus my most people hate us and wish harm upon us.
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Silver

Quote from: Nero on May 21, 2010, 04:00:05 AM
That's how I always felt. Since about age 11, there was never a point to anything. No matter what I did, it didn't matter because I had to do it as someone else. Until now of course. Now it just feels good to be alive.

Cool to see I'm not alone. Well, I don't want anyone to really deal with problems but it makes me seem a little less alone.
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Rock_chick

Look at it from a cultural/media studies point of view, the big deal comes from the fact that the gender binary is the dominant discourse in our society. Because what we go through and do is in opposition to this discourse makes it a big deal. Most people don't even think about the whole gender binary thing, to them it is merely natural and logical that men are men and women are women, but then that is the whole point of a dominant discourse, it naturalises a certain way of thinking. We know differently however and just by being ourselves we force people to question what they believe about the world and maybe even re-evaluate themselves in relation to those beliefs.

Basically what we need to do is change the dominant discourse and naturalise it to the point that it achieves the status of myth that the whole gender binary thing enjoys in western society. The only way I can see of doing this is by getting Jenny elected as galactic president I'm sure we'd see some changes then. hehe

So the moral of this is vote Jenny for Galactic President!

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