Okay. Since most of you disagree with me, I have to take another look within and see if I have been disrespectful an d just downright rude. Ill look into it, and thank you all for reading this and giving your thoughts on it.

hey, Iris, we just wanted to hear the inspiration behind your original post. It's hard to say anything meaningful if we don't know what's the point.

But now I see it was more of a theoretical one. Nothing wrong with that though, but then you shouldn't be surprised at the responses you're getting

g

Quote from: iris1469 on September 18, 2010, 10:16:40 PM
Okay. Since most of you disagree with me, I have to take another look within and see if I have been disrespectful an d just downright rude. Ill look into it, and thank you all for reading this and giving your thoughts on it.

Thoughtless and presumptuous more than disrespectful and downright rude.

Quote from: iris1469 on September 18, 2010, 10:16:40 PM
Okay. Since most of you disagree with me, I have to take another look within and see if I have been disrespectful an d just downright rude. Ill look into it, and thank you all for reading this and giving your thoughts on it.

Lets just say that you didn't exactly make yourself clear in the first post. The subsequent ones made much more sense and were more reasonable, but the first one came across as very presumptive and judgmental. You may not have intended it, but that sort of statement really needed a bit of background to understand. Hence the reactions you got.

Mind you I do think it is perhaps still a little dangerous to imply that people in this forum do not care about the future generations. I am past transition and SRS by nearly 30 years. To me you ARE the next generation! I have no ongoing support needs, I'm very well integrated into my society with a large network of friends. So why else would I be coming here if not to care about the next generation? And I am NOT alone in this. Many of those on here do it because they care.

Finally you don't have to be "out loud and proud". Although I am not in "stealth" I don't go around advertising my trans-ness, but I think it really isn't helpful or indeed healthy for anyone to ashamed of it. In private I will discuss it with those whom I think it appropriate. All of them know, that far from feeling ashamed of who and what I am, I actually feel a sense of real pride at my accomplishment and precisely because I am secure in that genuine pride I don't feel the need to go shouting parading and waving banners. Instead I am one of the unseen subversive activists, who you will never see marching down the street, but who can often be found quietly in boardrooms and the corridors of power making changes that will hopefully improve your life.

Quote from: rejennyrated on September 19, 2010, 04:32:51 AM
Lets just say that you didn't exactly make yourself clear in the first post. The subsequent ones made much more sense and were more reasonable, but the first one came across as very presumptive and judgmental. You may not have intended it, but that sort of statement really needed a bit of background to understand. Hence the reactions you got.

Mind you I do think it is perhaps still a little dangerous to imply that people in this forum do not care about the future generations. I am past transition and SRS by nearly 30 years. To me you ARE the next generation! I have no ongoing support needs, I'm very well integrated into my society with a large network of friends. So why else would I be coming here if not to care about the next generation? And I am NOT alone in this. Many of those on here do it because they care.

Finally you don't have to be "out loud and proud". Although I am not in "stealth" I don't go around advertising my trans-ness, but I think it really isn't helpful or indeed healthy for anyone to ashamed of it. In private I will discuss it with those whom I think it appropriate. All of them know, that far from feeling ashamed of who and what I am, I actually feel a sense of real pride at my accomplishment and precisely because I am secure in that genuine pride I don't feel the need to go shouting parading and waving banners. Instead I am one of the unseen subversive activists, who you will never see marching down the street, but who can often be found quietly in boardrooms and the corridors of power making changes that will hopefully improve your life.

Jenny!! I love this post!! This is why everyone loves you!!

This applies to any and every stereotype, and it is not the fault of the purpotrators (entirely) but of the stereotyper. If someone can be so ignorant to take the actions of one or two people to define the actions of a whole race, gender, age or in this case medical disorder, then they are in the wrong far moreso than the people who did the silly things.

"Stop stereotyping, you're giving the human race a bad name!"

^ Ahh, best reply yet.

Ellie , I'm constantly stessing to the transpeople that their actions DO have an effect on us as a whole ! ve been kicked off two Yaho forums that deltwith transpeople and saying the same thing . I just hope those that need to hear it agin will heed yer notes ! ellen

I would like to hear what the story is that made you post what you did. And no, I am not slamming you. I have had my own run-in with a situation that made me feel a bit like you seem to feel.

Quote from: Dana Lane on September 20, 2010, 10:57:35 AM
I would like to hear what the story is that made you post what you did. And no, I am not slamming you. I have had my own run-in with a situation that made me feel a bit like you seem to feel.

Lol, that's why I've asked twice!  It may not be a funny story, but there is something meaty here... that needs to be told.  Then we would have a worthwhile discussion.

Melan

Okay so it seems that there is interest in what motivated me to post the original, "PLEASE". I'll bite, here it is. I have been living female fulltime for 7 years now. Someone told me about a transgender meeting at a place called FRIENDS. So I thought i would go ahead and give it a shot. NEVER AGAIN! There were about 8 "girls" in attendance. I dont think that any of them had showered in the previous week. Half but makeup job, with MAJOR beardage going on, wearing WAY too little clothing....several of which had their, uh, male private personal parts OBVIOUS. No attempt to tuck.....that is what started me on this track of mind......THEN just before i posted the original "PLEASE" I was coming home from getting my bunny rabbit (was fixed) and low and behold at the bus stop is another one, not a bad makeup job, but with VERY dark 5 oclock shadow, saying in an exagerated voice, "hey daddy" to every man that drove by...and I could not help but to be insulted. I live in gang neighborhood and I try very hard to be the best I can be and then I see this creature and I feel and am of the opinion that it is this type of individual displaying this type of classless behaviour that assists strangers puttiong me in that category......

Okay, Now for those of you that read this and want to bag on me,,,,please keep it to yourself, this is just my opinion and my feelings....okay??..............................i just know that i should not click the post button..oh weell here goes it

Quote from: iris1469 on September 20, 2010, 02:36:17 PM
Okay so it seems that there is interest in what motivated me to post the original, "PLEASE". I'll bite, here it is. I have been living female fulltime for 7 years now. Someone told me about a transgender meeting at a place called FRIENDS. So I thought i would go ahead and give it a shot. NEVER AGAIN! There were about 8 "girls" in attendance. I dont think that any of them had showered in the previous week. Half but makeup job, with MAJOR beardage going on, wearing WAY too little clothing....several of which had their, uh, male private personal parts OBVIOUS. No attempt to tuck.....that is what started me on this track of mind......THEN just before i posted the original "PLEASE" I was coming home from getting my bunny rabbit (was fixed) and low and behold at the bus stop is another one, not a bad makeup job, but with VERY dark 5 oclock shadow, saying in an exagerated voice, "hey daddy" to every man that drove by...and I could not help but to be insulted. I live in gang neighborhood and I try very hard to be the best I can be and then I see this creature and I feel and am of the opinion that it is this type of individual displaying this type of classless behaviour that assists strangers puttiong me in that category......

Okay, Now for those of you that read this and want to bag on me,,,,please keep it to yourself, this is just my opinion and my feelings....okay??..............................i just know that i should not click the post button..oh weell here goes it

Strangely enough I too would find all that pretty disturbing too, but the point you may be missing is that by looking so bad these clowns may actually be doing you a strange kind of favour, because as I said previously while people are busy laughing at them and getting the idea that this is what all transpeople look like they are unlikely to spot you.

In effect their sad failure makes it easier for you to pass as female because presumably you don't look anything like them.

As for wanting to bag you, I doubt that anyone will want to do that, and if they do I promise you that I and my moderation colleagues will come down on them like a ton of bricks for violating Terms Of Service which specifically forbid personal attacks.

If you did anything wrong at all, it was merely failing to explain in the first place, and perhaps, wrongly making the tacit assumption that Susans would have any people like those you met.

I have known the folks here for some time now, and though we do have our occasional oddballs and misfits they are very much in the minority and the VAST majority of people on here are perfectly normal and like you anxious to be seen in a good light. Moreover I count many of them as my friends.

Okay. Thank you for listening and trying to understand.......well understanding! Makes me feel a whole lot better.

Hi Iris,
Thanks for the follow up, that makes understanding your viewpoint a lot easier
I personally would have problems 'enjoying' going to such a social event, and would be extremely disappointed if it had been advertised as a sociable event for TG natured people.

I have been to TG friendly events in my home town, which most are held in very public clubs and pubs which are 'mainstream'. These have all been pleasant. I went to dinner last night with about 5 TG girls. One SO, and two couples who have TG daughters, both of whom couldn't attend due to the flu . It was a great night, lots of laughs, fun discussion, and nice pub food. One of the great things about the particular venue we were at is quite a few 'young' people go there, and some social clubs have a dinner tables there as well. I think it's great that we can show in a totally non-demonstrative way that we are exactly like everyone else. A group of friends who want to have dinner, a glass or two of wine and a nice night out.

It's also funny, at times , in the ladies loo. As ever two stalls, and several woman, waiting. I'm still amazed BTW of how woman just talk in the loo . Biggest gender difference there is .

One young woman joked with me when I made a 'Oh No about the queue', (very friendly nothing rude), 'you could always go next door and point' . A roll of fun laughter, 'And you young lady can run always next door and squat'. More laughter. Then a multi person discussion on boy and girl toilets, and habits. Several of us were close to weeping. It was a good night.

I also think your point about prostitution is pertinent. Although I see little difference between, male, female or TG prostitution. It is often argued that prostitution is a way out for people with no job skills and terrible family problems. It has been argued' on this site, as a means of raising the money for SRS.

I have to admit I tend to reject those arguments. There are people of every gender that will have the mental strength to survive and use being prostituted for their own gain. I think, an opinion based without factual evidence,  that these people are few and far between.

But to your point about the 'TG' at the bus stop, and to those at the social event. These in my opinion are not normal people who are dealing with gender issues. They are dealing with other issues.  Their  aim in life is. I believe, different to anyone's else I have met on this site, and as a Mod, I've met some doodies .  There (apparent) desires are not those that I have seen in this community. I have no desire to judge them, not my role in life. I think I feel sorry for them.

Keep posting Iris, you have created some nice discussion, when the info came out

Cindy

Quote from: CindyJames on September 21, 2010, 04:06:06 AM
I think I feel sorry for them.

There's no need for that I think. They don't necessarily have to be losers. They do "something" that makes them feel good. At least I hope that they're happy that way

g