Hiya,

I've got two problems.

1. There's another transguy, we spent many evenings on the phone chatting. He's a great guy. I first met him "live" a couple of days ago at the biggest German trans reunion that ever took place (yeah, we broke the Guinness record, 250 people there, biggest Trans* reunion of Germany of all times yeah!). He's been on hormones for almost 2 years, and his body language is still very feminine. He also studies Gender Theories, so I don't know how he would react... Well I don't think it's bad in itself if a transguy has very feminine body language. But I'd like to tell him this as a feedback without hurting him, as maybe he might want to get some feedback there. How on earth can I do this without hurting him?

2. Myself. I have no idea what impression I make on other people, or what my body language and intonation are like. Only feedbacks I got yet was from a 60 year-old couple and some random passenders who read me as a straight guy, others who thought I was or might be gay, and friends of mine who told me my body language and intonation are "slightly gay".  Er well... I think most of these people have a bad gaydar, so it does not mean much.

And this annoys me. I'd like to know at least which impression I make on other people, but if you ask people you know well, you won't get an honest answer. I don't want to become a cliché, a fake of maleness, but I'd like to adapt to some degree if it's necessary or useful.

It's like a culture clash. I needn't ever adopt Japanese culture, but if I ever move there, it would be nice at least to get along with the usual behaving rules and to know what they mean, yeah, and adopt them up to a certain degree and at least know them. If I ever moved to Japan, I'd try to adopt as much of that stuff as necessary to avoid a culture clash and people going  , but not more than I can accept for myself.

Changing gender and moving to Japan, I think, are comparable experiences concerning the culture clash. (Unless for Japanese people, of course  )

P.S.: My total impression of the FTM guys there was - some of them you would never have imagined that they had a transsexual past, many of them were kind of effeminate in the sense of being read as "gay" by the general population. Though the impression they make is somewhat different from being gay and pinging the gaydar of people who are from the gay scene, it's a very special FTM thing/impression. Okay, but being read as "gay" is okay for me.


But some FTMs made an impression to me like females, from their body language and intonation, but with beards and a low voice. And I went Oh-my-god, I hope I'm not too much like them, cause it's exactly how I don't want to end up myself.

I know it's not nice to write this down in a transsexual forum, and many of these people are still mid transition.
It's mean, it's not okay to write this down... But it worries me a lot, for myself as well. Do I make the same impression without noticing it? I'm really afraid to make an impression on people like a "girl with a beard and low voice", body language, intonation etc. This really is my biggest fear. And I'd immediately detransition if this were my final outcome. Honestly.


So what could you suggest for how I could talk to my friend?

And how about myself, where or how can I get honest opinions?

1. If he is not asking for feedback, don't give it.

2. Different people are going to see different things. There won't be something about yourself that everybody will say is "too feminine" or "too fake." Having confidence (IMO) is one of the biggest things that will help you get people to see you as you are.

As a general rule, I would say don't give anyone feedback if they aren't asking for it. I know that I would be pretty upset if another trans guy told me that my mannerisms were "very feminine" and I hadn't expressed any concern about it. If he's not asking, you shouldn't be telling.   

I don't think you should give him feedback since he's not asking.  If he asks, go ahead.

I will always be "too feminine" in body language, but I don't really care.

I don't think it's rude to talk about your fear; I mean, MtF are afraid they'll turn out looking like guys in dresses, we're scared of seeming like women with beards; it's OK to talk about it.

You could discuss it in terms of asking about how you look, but if he isn't concerned I wouldn't pry.

As for yourself you could always wear a Rammstein t-shirt!! 

Okay, thanks for your advice.

I think you're right, so

1. I won't tell him unless he asks

But,

2. How on earth can I figure out what impression I make?

A tad off topic, but upon the whole Japan trans thing, it seems like being FTM may start being recognized;

http://www.tokyohive.com/2010/09/girls-to-men-held-debut-performance/

Sorry I didn't really answer your question, but a suggestion of mine personally would just ask one of your friends, that you met when transitioning, and ask what impression you made on them when you first met. That's what I'd do atleast.

As far as what impression you make... if you have a web cam or a camera/camcorder you could always video it just for yourself and play it back. Just leave it on throughout the day or something? I speak a lot differently than I think I do plus my voice sounds differently than it really is so when I was curious I recorded a short vid and played it back to hear how I really sound. Plus that way I was able to understand the whole "male speech pattern" thing that I apparently do that one of my friends was telling me.

I catch myself doing little things that are, in my opinion, ultra-feminine gestures. They set me off on a "how the F! do blokes do this?" sort of a frantic search to correct it, because the gesture feels awkward to me and yet it comes from a "well trained" sort of a position.
I trained myself to do many of these gestures. Little flick-of-the-wrist things for example.
I trained myself cause I was trying to come off as a girl, I was trying to "Be" a girl.

I think I'm far more aware of it than the people around me, they read me a gay at most, but it still sets me off.

Quote from: Fencesitter on October 16, 2010, 06:14:42 AMOkay, thanks for your advice.
I think you're right, so
1. I won't tell him unless he asks
But,
2. How on earth can I figure out what impression I make?

You might be able to accomplish both here, ask him what he thinks of your mannerisms, and maybe he'll ask you about his.