Quote from: A on October 29, 2010, 10:59:25 PM
Gosh, you make me dizzy with all those missing capitals. Don't sweat it though, I'm a maniac.

But thanks, I like discussing with you. I fully agree with you on that.

oh, you are a maniac with grammar? well, i actually am too. i don't like to use acronyms. i like to spell out all my words, and make sure it's all punctuated perfect. i just don't use capitals on the internet, because it's much quicker.

Let's make a club !

You may want to read this https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,86433.0.html

Quote from: Fencesitter on October 26, 2010, 04:59:13 PM
But I think for MTFs, puberty may be much more traumatic, as the body moves farer away from a female or at least neutral shape. I don't wanna sum the points up here, as I'm no MTF, but what do you think of that theory?

From the passing perspective, MTF individuals might find the results of first puberty a bit harder to overcome. This is because height, bone length, bone structures, etc often cannot be overcome or require surgery to overcome. It is harder to undo gender-specific bone changes than it is to undo or hide gender-specific fat/muscle changes. It is also easier to grow some gender-specific secondary sex characteristics (eg. body hair and facial hair on the FTM side, or a little breast tissue on the MTF side) than it is to remove what has already grown out (eg. broad shoulders or big hands).

The reason this becomes important for MTF individuals for passing is that society tends to notice and observe women and their features with greater scrutiny. A couple of years ago, a transman who dated me discussed this with me and he said, "a young-looking boy of short height is often treated better in society than a man in a dress except on Halloween".

However, from the gender dysphoria perspective, it is definitely hard for both MTF and FTM individuals. I do not think anyone is in a position to compare.

We both have it bad in different ways. I'd say it's equally bad unless your "first puberty" ended up being the right one/only one.

I think this is the problem of generalising...

Some MtFs are very lucky in that they have very suppressed androgens or forms of AIS that then makes a later transition say in their late 20 30's still very successful.... or they get medical intervention in their teen which is even better....

And then there are the blokes built like brick-sh#t-houses that life as male a life as they can till there 40's....who will never get the kinda jessica-rabbit physicality easily, and beautiful facial features, that deep down they might desperately crave...

Ditto if you be an uber small, tiny petite foot/handed, uber hip-to-waist ratio pretty faced FtM, rather than an uber 6ft plus, balding stallion muscle clad broad shouldered alpha male type...

Then a convincing Bruce Willis type you're unlikely to ever be!

(And the cruel irony of all this physicality against you malarkey is also hard to take)

As an aside while I was in Scottsdale recently I did notice that an awful lot of chaps I saw in the good doctors reception over the month or so I was there (and a lot of em to boot) who were seeking out 'top' work were lets say in the main somewhat height challenged.... one chap tiny in fact....

And men being the jocks they are - when out as a boyz pack on the town - do really work on the hierarchical king of the castle mentality, where he who's toughest, hardest, bigger better wins... so lets say if you take up Rugby, best to keep outta the scrum unless you want to be broken....

If a skinny, pretty and aesthete femme boy-toy type you be.... in which case heading up a Japanese boy band might be a better choice of divertissemént?

Quote from: marissak on November 08, 2010, 02:11:54 AM
The reason this becomes important for MTF individuals for passing is that society tends to notice and observe women and their features with greater scrutiny.

Good point. I've noticed a lot less eye contact from people since I started passing. People don't generally stare at men. Men generally avoid looking closely at other men and so do women. Probably in both cases because they don't want looking to be taken the wrong way.

Quote from: Nero on November 08, 2010, 10:44:48 AM
I've noticed a lot less eye contact from people since I started passing.

That is the measurement I use to figure out if I pass or not.     People look at me a lot less now in the last few months than they used to previously. And there is a feedback system too which adds up quickly ... if you know that you pass, you become a lot more confident, which seems to make you pass even better. I used to be in the negative spiral downward a couple of years ago when my confidence was down, and I can easily see the difference now.

Who cares? It is too late!