Quote from: Randi on December 17, 2010, 07:09:00 AM
Inside,
If you want to disagree with what I said that's ok-I know what I said works because I got the belt to prove it-they don't just give those away. You are right that you should be careful or you will get injured but you have to give everything you have in order to get the greatest results.
Randi

There were no belts in ancient martial arts. When I was involved with karate, kung fu and tai chi I refused to participate in the belt system because I did not need a rank or award to get something out of the training. I have no need to prove it, but that's just me. If having a colored belt floats your boat, good for you. All I'm saying is that is a more modern mindset that does not align totally with the ancient arts. Also, it is not honorable or respectful of oneself or one's opponent if you use force where force is not needed. There are plenty of ways to train hard and get out any aggression without taking it out on someone else or injuring yourself.

And @Squirrel698 I don't mean to hijack your thread! I'm glad you're getting something out of the class, just be aware of the safety factor. It sounds like the other guys in the class look out for you so hopefully you'll do well.

My father made my instructor promise to refuse too use a belt system of rewards with me when I trained in my youth.

That's all well and good but since it wasn't my school I did what I was told and learned. In Okinawa there were two color belts-White & Black. If you don't want colored belts to signify gradual progression that is great but don't discourage others from studying at a good school that might use this system.

Squirrel, I hope you have found a good quality instructor and use this time wisely-it will pay off in the long run.

Randi

Marital Arts classes and schools can be run by several principals, you can do it for sport (codified rules), for general self-defense/physical workouts, for spiritual enlightenment, and as a training school for violent thugs. Some of those require that training, at least a considerable degree of it, be practiced at full speed, full contact with only the most minor rules (nothing to the head) because if you ever need to use it, that's the way its going to come down, full-speed, full-contact.  Despite all that Hollywood show-biz fight stuff (which is much closer to dance than it is to fighting) most fights I've ever seen go down in my life last (as a 'fair' fight) about one punch.  One guy gets the drop-off on the other one and out go the lights.  Because in any street fight, once you're put to the ground, you've pretty much just lost, the only issue left is how much you are going to get really hurt.

Heh, no problem Insideontheoutside!  This is interesting just and things I should be considering.  I am aware of the safety factor and so far so good. 

Randi - Thanks for the advice and I'm going to do my best to learn as much as I can.  By training hard I don't just read throwing yourself into practice but also working on the techniques outside of class.  Which I should start doing and thanks for the reminder.

Tekla - This school has another principal, how to defend against violent thugs.  The curriculum is a combination of various Marital Arts forms,  including Juijitsu and T'ai Chi Chuan.  They told us they recreated them a bit in terms of how to react when you are attacked as opposed to be the attacker.  For example Knife Tapping from Filipino Martial Arts is turned around so instead of trying to cut someone we are learning how to block against a knife attack.   

Thank you Joseph 

I love doing karate, and it's introduced me to an amazing group of people.

I was forced to 'come out' maybe two or three months into it when I attended my first sparring class (they normally don't allow white belts to spar, but made an exception for several of us). The instructor called for a cup check and... yeah. Didn't have one, because I don't pack. He even tried to give me money to run to the store and buy one, heh. So I "left", then came back and asked to talk to him in the office. His response was, "-shrug- Okay. Now go out there and hit people for my amusement." And when he told the other instructors, he said that their reaction was "In a group with a blind guy, a colour-blind guy, a midget, a giant, and a bunch of sociopaths, he ain't nothing special."

What I like about my class is that there is no differentiating between men and women. Everyone's expected to do the same amount of work, and there are no adjustments to exercises or body conditioning unless you're sick, injured, or disabled. So no 'girl push-ups'. We all take the same class, we all play with each other, and new guys that come in and complain because they 'don't want to hit a girl' (or take issue with being hit by a girl) are VERY quickly corrected. Everyone wears the same uniform. 

Safety is also a huge issue and our instructors watch to make sure we pair up with the correct people for the exercise and are playing safe. Even for those of us who have a tendency to ignore pain or illness will be prevented from doing certain exercises or body conditioning until better, or put on a light/alternate exercises (though we'll get yelled at for being stupid and aggravating the injury by ignoring it in the first place, heh...) 

Karate has done wonders for my balance, self confidence, and strength; particularly upper-body. A few months ago I couldn't do a single push up and could barely hold myself up. Now I can do about ten shallow ones. Which is... a huge improvement, because I've played sports since I was four and never made the same level/amount of improvements in my upper body strength.


I've also found this site to be amusing and informative, if you'd like to learn more about martial arts (yay Stumble Upon!):
http://www.badmartialarts.com/index.php

Quote from: Squirrel698 on December 15, 2010, 12:28:11 PMWhen I joined I expected some sort of instruction.  What it actually is we are given sticks and told to attack each other.

That doesn't sound like an effective self defense class.  Unless you are constantly carrying around sticks, sticks will not be much use in self defense.

QuoteMy God they hit damn hard.  I am literally covered with bruises.

My friend can hit really hard, and he's always trying to get me to learn MMA and stuff.  But you should really be learning technique before you start beating the crap out of each other.  My friend learned the hard way that "training hard" and conditioning his body wasn't as useful as learning the proper fighting technique.

If all you are doing is punching people and obtaining bruises, but you aren't learning HOW to punch, then your training is going to be mostly a waste of time if you are ever in a real self defense situation.  It sounds like you are learning how to take a hit, NOT how to defend yourself.  Self defense is all about incapacitating your opponent so you can get away.  It's not about giving them bruises.  Any given person can be stunned momentarily by hitting them in one of the various weak points on the body.  Only someone who has done serious conditioning to strengthen these points is going to take a blow like that and not have the fight knocked out of them.

Real fighting is about physics.  The body has leverage, weak points, strong points, speed, strength, and mobility.  The values of these physics determine the best way to attack any given opponent.

QuoteWe did practice groin kicks the other day and I was all ready to put on a show if someone did connect.  Fortunately no one did but I got another guy!  heh

As I was born male, I can attest to exactly how painful it is to get hit in the groin.  I'm not even very sensitive there, and I wouldn't want to take a hit there.  If I were ever attacked by a man, that would probably be the third place I would look for an opening.

Keep in mind that a groin hit only works on someone who hasn't trained their pain tolerance.  It won't do any damage to their arms, legs, elbows, knees, or anything else that they are going to be using to put the hurt on you.

Unless the T toughens up your skin or builds some muscle, you will probably remain the small fry of the group.  But remember that real self defense is about abusing your advantages, not your disadvantages.  You probably have more speed and flexibility than larger guys.  If you can get them to the floor, they are playing on your turf.  Grappling is about flexibility and leverage.  Raw strength is useless if they cannot remove themselves from your holds.  Also remember that most of the serious martial artists who have trained for decades usually don't have huge muscle.  They tend to be small and fast, but they are tough enough to take hits.

I also agree with Tekla.  A streetfight probably won't last more than a few hits.  There are no rules.  One party will often be outnumbered or outmatched.  If the fight is fair, then the winner will probably be the first person to land a blow to the opponent's weak points.

Martial arts is great for self-confidence, but don't let that new found self-confidence make you overconfident.  That gets people hurt real bad.  I see more people hurt trying to do that little bit of martial arts they think they know against people who really know how to fight (and really, really like it, because they LOVE violence, violence is their best sexual release).

My step dad, a Viet Nam vet. and also my first instructor made it very clear and simple when I asked him what belt he held... "You will either survive or you will not survive an attack... Your attacker does not care what kind of belt you are wearing"

Nothing against the belt system, it is great for sport or to monitor one's progress in a martial arts class that uses it

Your best defense is awareness and the ability to act upon that awareness