Susan's Place Logo

News:

According to Google Analytics 25,259,719 users made visits accounting for 140,758,117 Pageviews since December 2006

Main Menu

How/When Did Your Romantic Partner Come Out?

Started by GinaDouglas, January 23, 2011, 01:44:44 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

GinaDouglas

It's gonna take a while to get around to the actual question here.  I think defining the question and putting it in context is important.

My GF and I have been living together for seven months, after courting for about a month.  Tons in common, very much in love, great sex.  We're in our fifties with five divorces between us.

We have been having a big roundabout regarding identity.

Her position regarding me:
You are not a man and you're not a woman.  You're both and neither.  You're only female in your own mind.  You only act like a woman in public and everybody knows you are transgender.  I knew right away and if I could tell, anybody can tell.

My position regarding me:
I am both and neither, but I am more of a woman.  Like it or not, the world runs on a gender binary and challenging that is harder than being trans, not that I would if I could.  I am a woman, I've always been female, even when I was learning to be male, and trying to be male.  It's nature and nurture.  I am female by nature, but was nurtured to be male, so there is going to be some residual effects of that nurture.  I'm way more female, and behaviors and attitudes that you perceive as male are pretty typical lesbian sensibilities.  If I tone down my femmyness at home, some of it is the way lesbians act and some of it is for your comfort.  In public, almost nobody reads me.  Everybody uses different cues to gender somebody else, and it doesn't even occur to most people to look beyond presentation, in most circumstances.  You were looking at me in a totally different way, in a bar, as you were deciding whether to hit on me.  Most people don't even suspect I am anything but an ordinary female, and those who suspect can never be sure, unless I cue them in.

Her position regarding her:
I've always been straight and am still straight.  How ever much we interact like two women, when it comes to sex you are putting it in me, regardless of how you perceive what we are doing.  It's still straight sex and I am still straight.

My position regarding her:
You may not be attracted to other women, but you are in a relationship with a woman.  You might not be a lesbian, but you are in a lesbian relationship.  In our society, you are either straight or you are not; you stepped outside the hetro-centric, cisgender paradigm, and that puts you somewhere on the LGBT continuum, whether you like it or not.  After three divorces, you spent ten years not being in a relationship because you did not want to be in another relationship with a man.  You wouldn't be, and you're not.  You like the femaleness of my body.  Some lesbians use strap-ons, and with some of them, only one partner straps it on.  Our love-making is lesbian-normal, nothing like a straight couple ->-bleeped-<-ing; and we both been with enough straight people to know the difference.

She does not want people at work to find out.  She says it is a prejudiced workplace, and it would be a disaster.  I have met her parents and her sisters, and we all got along fine; but word is that I would not be welcome in her father's household.  Her sisters have been out with us several times.  Her kids are being weird about it.  One son, partied with us and spent the night; but hasn't spoke to her since.  Her other son talks to us on Facebook, but doesn't return her calls.  Her daughter seems cool with it, but doesn't know how to deal with the 8 year old granddaughter.

She got a call from an ex-boyfriend the other day.  He said, "There's rumors going around that you are seeing a cross-dresser."  She said, "So what?"  He hung up.  Clearly it bothered her, and it bothered me that she didn't correct him.  Yesterday, the owner of the bar that banned us for kissing/dancing came into her workplace, and asked her how cum she hasn't been in the bar.  She said she doesn't live close any more, and he offered to give her a ride.  He definitely knows who I am, and that me and some girl are banned; but evidently he doesn't know it's her.

She sees it that she is out to who matters about what matters, and the rest of it don't matter.  I think she would be better off taking a pro-active approach, taking some control of how people find out and what they find out, rather than leaving it to chance and rumor.

I think this is too much of a Gordian-knot for people to be able to understand it, much less advise me.  I believe every couple has to work out their own kinks, literally and figuratively.  But I think I can get some relevant insight from the question I asked.  How have other romantic partners of transpeople come out to others, and at what points in your relationships?
It's easier to change your sex and gender in Iran, than it is in the United States.  Way easier.

Please read my novel, Dragonfly and the Pack of Three, available on Amazon - and encourage your local library to buy it too! We need realistic portrayals of trans people in literature, for all our sakes
  •  

Elizabeth A.

Hi there,

Hmmm, there is a lot going on here. And don't worry about confusing us...You are a great (articulate) writer!

Is this really about how she self-identifies? Or is it about how she sees YOU?

I am a (female, cis) partner to an FtM. I met him years after his transition, and he passes 100% of the time; so we may be in a different stage than you and your partner.

I never think of my partner as female, or part-female, at all. He has not had bottom surgery; but when I see him nekkid I do not see girl or trans. I see a boy, who has unusual parts. Likewise, when he shows me photos of him pre-T, I do not see a girl. I see a boy stuck in a little girl's body, like it is a bad joke or something.

He is just so all-boy; how could anyone not see that? His heart and his personality and his energy are all-boy; even when the body still does not 100% conform.

So, on to your partner. I get that there is something very special between you. I wonder though, how does it affect you that she does not see you as the female you say you are? How does that support you in being your full self?

We all need to surround ourselves with people who will support us fully, and see *us* for what we *truly are.*

Maybe her perception of you will change with time? How do you feel about that?

I'm sorry. Those are maybe hard, personal questions. All asked gently.  :)

- Elizabeth
  •  

Lacey Lynne

@ Elizabeth A.:

Great and informative post.  Truly, I commend you for your intelligence and understanding.  If only most of the rest of society had your kind of intelligence and understanding.  Of course, they do not.  How sad.  Your post evinces that he and you are happy in your relationship.  That's awesome!  May you two continue to have peace and happiness in your relationship and in your lives.

@ Gina Douglas:

Well, maybe I'm stupiding-out in my advancing years here, hon, but it seems to me from your post that your significant other is focusing on genitalia and nothing but genitalia and, thereby, defining your physical relationship as straight. 

You are preop/nonop, right?  Well, if so, strictly speaking, she is quite right ... from her genitalia-only determination of type of sex taking place.  Honestly, from what you say, I believe this is what's going on in her mind.  It's that simple.  

Doggone if I don't envy you!  That's not an insult.  That's a compliment.  Take what you've got, and you've got a lot going on with this woman, and rock the house with it, honey!  What I wouldn't give to have a woman like you have.  Like, that's EXACTLY what I will look for and hope to find once my for-now-wife and I actually divorce some day:  A majorly bisexual partner (genetic female) who is way into my femininity and way into guy genitalia.  I could SOOO live with that!

You see, I'm into women HRT notwithstanding.  Heck, if I could find a woman like you have, I'd remainly happily preop/nonop!  Gina Girl, count your blessings!  You totally have it goin' on, so enjoy the heck out of it while you're still young enough to do so!  Envy, honey, ... I'm green with envy!

>:(    ;)    ::)   Lacey
Believe.  Persist.  Arrive.    :D



Julie Vu (Princess Joules) Rocks!  "Hi, Sunshine Sparkle Faces!" she says!
  •  

GinaDouglas

Quote from: Elizabeth A. on January 24, 2011, 08:15:31 PM
Is this really about how she self-identifies? Or is it about how she sees YOU?

how does it affect you that she does not see you as the female you say you are? How does that support you in being your full self?  Maybe her perception of you will change with time? How do you feel about that?

I think the identity questions are related.  Especially since couples form a third identity called US.  We are very close.  We use the Lakota term mahasani (which means "second-skin") to describe the way we feel.  She bumps her head and I say ouch.  But the unintended consequence of this is that, if there is perceived derision for me, she feels it.  It might not even be real, and it wouldn't bother me anyway; but she's new to it and it bothers her.

I'm not thrilled about the way she sees me.  At first, I thought she saw me totally as female.  It took a while for her to admit that she didn't, and then there was a whole lot of discussion behind getting to where we are now.  I believe that she will eventually accept the reality of the situation, and get more comfortable with it.  But right now, she is still clinging to the idea that she wishes things were different.

Thanks for your insight, and nothing is too personal when I am laying it out like this, using the people here like a support-group or group-therapy.
It's easier to change your sex and gender in Iran, than it is in the United States.  Way easier.

Please read my novel, Dragonfly and the Pack of Three, available on Amazon - and encourage your local library to buy it too! We need realistic portrayals of trans people in literature, for all our sakes
  •  

GinaDouglas

Quote from: Lacey Lynne on January 25, 2011, 12:33:24 AM
You are preop/nonop, right?  Well, if so, strictly speaking, she is quite right ... from her genitalia-only determination of type of sex taking place.  Honestly, from what you say, I believe this is what's going on in her mind.  It's that simple.

Take what you've got, and you've got a lot going on with this woman, and rock the house with it, honey!  What I wouldn't give to have a woman like you have. 

Yeah, non-op.  Don't get me wrong.  I know how lucky I am.  Just that it's still a struggle to get through from where we are now to being together forever.


It's easier to change your sex and gender in Iran, than it is in the United States.  Way easier.

Please read my novel, Dragonfly and the Pack of Three, available on Amazon - and encourage your local library to buy it too! We need realistic portrayals of trans people in literature, for all our sakes
  •