I just got my hormones blood work test results back and I am pretty upset. (but I'm probably overreacting as usual) My estrogens level came back at 3 to 4 times the normal range high for a male and my testosterone levels also came back high for my age group. I'm 54 and they came back at the level of a 21 year old. No wonder I'm always so conflicted.

This test was ordered by my psychiatrist so I haven't seen an endocrinologist yet. I'll make that appointment tomorrow. But my psychiatrist showed concern in how to treat this condition in both homones. So it scared me a little. I also sent these results to my gender therapist that I will see on Wednesday.

Has anyone else seen or experienced these types of levels? Or been treated sucessfully?

Gwen

Very interesting.  Well, I never had estrogen or testosterone levels tested before hand, but with what I had experienced prior to HRT, I wouldn't be surprised if I had the same thing going on.  In fact well into my hrt, my doctor had to end up doubling what she gave for the normal dosage of spiro because my levels weren't falling low enough, yet I experienced some kind of superspeed feminization when I first started.  Well, it's kind of too late to get that tested.  I also wonder if you look very feminine (for a guy) to begin with.

Melissa

Quote

I really don't look very feminine. (damn) Probably due to the also high levels of testosterone. That's partly why my psychiatrist was surprised at the test results. However, I only have about 15% of the body hair that my brother and father have. With very lttle on my chest. And that has always bothered me.

Gwen

  Hmm...I read a study that suggested that the average 54 year old male (coincidentally the ages match) has an estrogen level higher than a 59 year old woman.  Some studies say that elevated levels of estrogen and normal levels of testosterone in males are beneficial in many areas and high levels of estrogen combined with low levels of testosterone can be dangerous.

  As for having a high estrogen AND testosterone level at the same time I wouldn't be nervous right now.  Talk to an endocrinologist and let him/her interpret the results.  It may be something as simple as a thyroid imbalance or it may be completely normal for your age/weight.

   

 

Quote from: Gwen C on February 05, 2007, 04:46:04 PM
I really don't look very feminine. (damn)

See that's a matter of relativity.  I never considered myself to look feminine before until I looked back at my old pics after transitioning.  One way to tell if you were feminine looking was if people always thought you were quite a bit younger than you really were.  I always got tagged as being about 8-10 years younger and I started transitioning at 28, so that's a big difference.

Quote from: Gwen C on February 05, 2007, 04:46:04 PM
However, I only have about 15% of the body hair that my brother and father have. With very lttle on my chest. And that has always bothered me.

Yeah, I've had about the normal hair for a female (maybe just a bit hairier before) and my muscles have never been all that big or defined.  It's just really hard to say what the results will be with transition.

Melissa

I never had my estrogen levels tested either.  Before SRS, my HRT always revolved around my testosterone levels.  Normal testosterone levels in a biological man is between 270ng/dl to 1,070ng/dl...Yikes! no wonder!  >  Just kidding!    During all the years I was on estrogen and Spironolactone, my testosterone never went above 35ng/dl...which according to my doctor, was wonderful.   Actually you'll be surprised how well spironolactone works on lowering testosterone.  I am sure that your endo will find the appropriate regimen, just be patient ma cherie! 

tinkerbell

Thanks fo all the encouragement. Is it alright if I share my test results here?  I'd like to get some feedback on the specific numbers. I tried to IM someone who had asked and for some reason I'm not allowed. I used to be able to IM before I changed my name.

Gwen

I don't believe it breaks any rules to post that.  Just be sure not to display any information you don't want the world to see.  As for sinding PMs, you need to have 15 posts.

Melissa

The point and concern for me is that my tetosterone levels are all close to the normal statistical high's for a male my age. Which seems confusing and hard to believe when my estrogen levels are 3.5 times higher than the normal statistical high of 60 pg/mL for a male my age.

So it just seems wierd that I would be so high on estrogen and also high on testosterone. I can't imagine what my testoterone level would be without the high estrogen level. My psychiatrist even theorized a possibility that my testosterone levels are so high that my body is making the excess it can't process into estrogen.

That's why I'm scared and confused right now. If I'm so high on testosterone that it is turning into estrogen, then what am I? I'm afraid the endocrinologist and doctor's will want to try lowering the estrogen. Then what will happen? Thinking about that feels like such a threat and loss.

This gets more complicated and confusing all the time. Sorry for blathering on.

Gwen

I didn't have my estrogen level checked but my testosterone level was triple the normal male range at the high end. We kept doubling my spironolactone dosage until it worked.

Karen Lyn     

   Nooo...nooo....don't worry Gwen.  There are many things that will cause males to convert testosterone into estrogen.  The most serious of which would be diminished liver function.  The liver "removes" a certain amount of naturally occuring estrogen from the body.  If the liver function is diminished then it could result in a high estrogen level. 

   There are also other not so serious mechanisms that can cause the same thing.  It could be an excess of aromatase enzyme which is easily controlled.  The aromatase enzyme naturally converts testosterone into estrogen so if there an excess of aromatase there will be higher estrogen levels.

   Obesity is another potential cause (not saying this is the case...I don't even know you ).  Fat cells produce aromatase enzymes, especially abdominal fat, so the more fat the more aromatase and the more testosterone converted to estrogen.

   Zinc definciencies can also create high estrogen levels.  Zinc is a natural aromatase inhibitor so low zinc levels means more testosterone is being coverted to estrogen. 

   Alcohol consumption has proven to increase estrogen in men AND women.  <considers this as she sips cocktail>

   All of these are reasons to see your endocrinologist who can do a more detailed blood workup.  The primary danger of high estrogen levels in a male patient who isn't on HRT is that naturally occuring mechanisms, as those listed above, will eventually lead to a low testosterone level.  While this may sound appealing to transsexuals it is a very dangerous condition.  When estrogen levels are high and testosterone is low you are at an increased risk of problems such as heart attack,stroke and pulmonary embolisms.  Obviously the other things that can occur are low libido, breast growth and impotence. As long as your testosterone level is acceptable you are relatively safe with a high estrogen level.  Still it is important that your endocrinologist find the underlying cause for the estrogen increase before the levels of estrogen/testosterone reach a potentially dangerous imbalance. 

Quote from: BrandiOK on February 05, 2007, 11:55:10 PM
All of these are reasons to see your endocrinologist who can do a more detailed blood workup. 

Seconded. All of my tests and results (years worth) done before I saw my endocrinologist were dismissed by him with the comment 'I prefer to do my own essays'.

I'm glad he likes to do his own homework, too.

Wow Brandi, you sure know a lot about this subject. So I will take your advice and calm down until I get a better picture from an Endo. Thank you for taking the time to share with me.

"Obesity is another potential cause (not saying this is the case...I don't even know you)."

Don't think this fits as I am 6' tall and weigh 175lbs. The most I ever weighed was 217 once many years ago.

"Alcohol consumption has proven to increase estrogen in men AND women."

Nope. Been sober for almost 14 years.

I don't think I mentioned that I confirmed that I was exposed to DES in utero. That also may have something to do with this.

Gwen

I havent had my estrogen or testosterone levels tested yet. But one thing I can say is I have been since early on been tagged as being some 10 to 15 years younger than I was and still do to this day. Everyone I come in contact with says I don't look my age. I look to them younger. I also do have feminine eyes. If I only could have a smaller nose and uprased eyebrows I could easly pass as a woman. I also have a low muscle mass too. I never had quite the normal strenth as most guys. My body hair is somewhat normal but light in color but I still shave it. My beard is also light. I can go for a day without shaving and its not noticable.....

Linda Ann

Love being female

I wouldn't worry until an endoc has redone the testing and has sat you down and said, "this is a problem."

I have had a few blips on my testing radar, two of which were originally thought to be eventually life threatening.  They were not, they were blips.

And alcohol increasing estrogen?

Oh yeah, I am so going to be pouring on the estrogen tonight.   >

Quote from: LostInTime on February 06, 2007, 01:27:22 PM
And alcohol increasing estrogen?

Grapefruit juice. 

I have now talked to a psychiatrist, my gender therapist with 25 years of experience and an endocrinologist nurse that have never seen this situation. So this just gets stranger all the time.

gwen 

  Ok...once again.  Your psychiatrist is probably very good at what he/she does.  However what he/she doesn't do is specialize in endocrinology.  The same applies to your gender therapist.....

  While nurses do have a lot of knowledge on general medical issues there is a reason why they are nurses and not doctors.  Your endo has MUCH more education and experience on this subject than a psychiatrist, gender therapist or nurse will ever have regardless of thier experience.   Wait and see what your endocrinologist thinks of the situation before getting worried. 

  I wouldn't want the greatest car mechanic in the world doing repairs on an airplane I was about to fly on.

Thank you Brandi for caring so much to reply each time I post on this subject. My frustration is that I haven't been able to get the right referral of an endocrinologist to see me. My therapist highly recommended one for just a consult. But when I called her nurse told me she isn't treating transgendered individuals any more. However, since this post, I spoke with my therapist and she is going to call this endo on my behalf.

Maybe I'm going at this the wrong way? I'm keep looking for my therapist to recommend an endo. But she doesn't seem to have many recommendations for endo's with hormone and transgendered knowledge. Which is surprising since she has been treating transgenderd people for 25 years.

Is there another way I might go about this?

Gwen

  Hmmm....just a couple suggestions Gwen. 

  Try searching the internet for sites that break down information by state (perhaps a site like "TSroadmap" might have something).  The downfall here is that often times the information is out of date.  Also try contacting a local TG support site...they normally have the best information as to who is available and recommended in your area.  If none of these things work I would just open the phone book and find the listings for endocrinologists.  Call each one and ask if they have experience with and treat transgender patients.

  Good luck...I know it can be difficult to find qualified professionals who are willing to take transgendered patients but they are out there.