So...I just kind of need to get this out, and I guess that it's really not much of a discussion, or a question, or anything other than a rant.

I came out to my father, during June of 2010, after a huge physical break-down that lasted a month in which I was sick for nearly thirty straight days. In fact, during this time, my entire family thought that I was pregnant. I had my mother pick me up, my sister (Whom I was living with,) knew something was wrong, and had my father call me. After gathering the courage, I told him that I was planning on getting a sex-change. He seemed leery about it, but he was also happy that I just wasn't pregnant. He said that he understood that sometimes, "Wires get crossed," and we can't do anything about it.

His opinion has now changed...a lot.

I start Testosterone injections on May 8th of this year, and I noticed that now that I'm taking them, he's really pressuring me to be something that I'm not. I have a really unusual haircut (For a girl, or a boy,) And he's been trying to get me to cut it, and to grow my normal color out - he says that it's odd for guys as pale as me to have jet-black hair, and he says that people will only look at me more if I look unusual. But he just doesn't get that I don't want to be a 'boy' in his sense of the word. He wants me to become a muscle-bound sports obsessed meat-head. He's constantly trying to get me interested in sports (I hate sports...other than Nascar, Drag-racing, and wrestling, sorry guys,) It's really driving me up the wall. He seems to think that I just want to blend in with society. I mean, I know that some transguys are fine with that, but I'm just not. I've always been the kid to shred their jeans to hell, and load them with safety pins, splatter paint on my clothes, and add glitter and sparkles, patches and all kinds of other weird ->-bleeped-<-. I've never once claimed to be a manly man (Though I am lifting weights now,) Yeah, sure, I'm changing my sex, but that doesn't mean that I want to change what makes me who I am, for crying out loud.

And the worse part about this, it would be fine for me to be like this...if I was gay.

Frankly though, I'm not gay. I like women god-dammit, yeah...sure, I make out with men every once in a while, but as soon as it gets below the belt, I'm highly likely to deck them in the face and walk away. I am so not into cis-gendered guys getting into my pants, Now....if it was another transguy, that would be different (Because I would know that they didn't just want me for my pussy, thanks very much,)

So, this whole thing has just turned into a big whiny rant >___O; in which, now I feel significantly worse about all of my dysphoria...damn it. Anyway, yeah....I got it off of my chest, and I guess that I feel somewhat better.

For the sake of discussion; do you guys have these kind of pressures forced onto you to?
People trying to get you into a stereotype that you just don't belong in?
Any advice?

Even though the situation seems to suck with your dad, at least it looks like he would act the same way if you were a cismale and feminine. Stereotypical dads want stereotypical sons right. It might not have anything to do with your transition really. So at least you're dealing with a situation in a male-born type of way that feminine guys have to deal with too.

Plus it doesn't matter if you are straight and feminine, there are lots of guys out there like that. Despite my appearance and first impression attitude, I am actually feminine myself. To say you have to be gay to be like that is also stereotyping and besides there lots of girls who are into feminine men.

Well, I'm really not out to family yet, so I don't have that issue, however... I don't feel like a typical boy OR girl, in the sense that I don't act the way most stereotypical guys act and I certainly don't act the way most stereotypical girls act. So, I get what you're feeling. Maybe the best idea would be to ask your dad (or whoever else is pressuring you) why they feel you have to do this or that (e.g. get into sports), and then explain to them that you never liked that/did that/whatever and that it just wouldn't be YOU if you suddenly did do that. You aren't transitioning just to be as stereotypically male as you can, but just so that you can be YOU. The real you. Meaning, your interests won't suddenly change - only the physical aspects of you will change with transition (other changes in interests or something could come just from life/time/growing, but not simply from transitioning).

Regarding sexuality - you say you make out with men, but aren't into cis-guys since you fear they see you as a girl - what about gay men? I.e. if a gay man were to be with you, obviously he wouldn't be with you for your "femaleness" but your maleness. Just a thought - since it seems you might be attracted to men and women judging from what you've written. For me, that's exactly the case - I'm attracted to people, regardless of sex/gender, however, I can't be with a guy if he sees me as a girl. For some reason, even though I'd want a girl to see me as a guy as well, it's easier to deal with girls than with guys even when they don't fully view me as male. Just my experience, and my personal feelings. If I was seen as completely male, then it wouldn't really matter much I guess, whether it's a girl or a guy or any other gender, as long as it's a person I can feel comfortable with. Being that I'm in a loving, committed relationship with a girl, and I don't plan on ever changing that, it isn't really an issue for me - but that's just how things would be for me if I were single - it's just how I feel.

Quote from: Da Monkey on June 16, 2011, 06:44:20 AM
Even though the situation seems to suck with your dad, at least it looks like he would act the same way if you were a cismale and feminine. Stereotypical dads want stereotypical sons right. It might not have anything to do with your transition really. So at least you're dealing with a situation in a male-born type of way that feminine guys have to deal with too.

Plus it doesn't matter if you are straight and feminine, there are lots of guys out there like that. Despite my appearance and first impression attitude, I am actually feminine myself. To say you have to be gay to be like that is also stereotyping and besides there lots of girls who are into feminine men.

Well, this is true...
But, I can't help but feel that it would be at least somewhat different if I was born cisgendered. The thing is that my dad actually calls me 'unsexed' right now, because he's never seen any particularly feminine or masculine traits in me - he doesn't realize that his label is more offending than anything else. But I guess you're right about dealing with the same situation that a femine cis-boy would be dealing with.

I wasn't trying to stereotype, and I wasn't necessary saying that I had to be gay to act the way that I do. All I meant was that; within my community, it's more acceptable for guys to be feminine if they're gay. I've seen people react this way before, I often hear things like, "Hey, robby's pretty girly huh?" "That's cus he's gay," "Oh...never mind then,"

Quote from: GentlemanRDP on June 16, 2011, 05:50:57 AM
he says that it's odd for guys as pale as me to have jet-black hair

If that's true then why does every jocky white guy in my school dye their hair jet-black?

Quote from: ~RoadToTrista~ on June 16, 2011, 07:03:52 AM
If that's true then why does every jocky white guy in my school dye their hair jet-black?

Clearly, I need to drag my father to your school o____O;

Quote from: GentlemanRDP on June 16, 2011, 06:54:38 AM
I wasn't trying to stereotype, and I wasn't necessary saying that I had to be gay to act the way that I do. All I meant was that; within my community, it's more acceptable for guys to be feminine if they're gay. I've seen people react this way before, I often hear things like, "Hey, robby's pretty girly huh?" "That's cus he's gay," "Oh...never mind then,"

I see what you're saying now. That sucks.

Usually unless people actually know someone's gay for a fact they tend to say "he's probably gay" instead of "he's gay".

Quote from: Da Monkey on June 16, 2011, 07:56:41 AM
I see what you're saying now. That sucks.

Usually unless people actually know someone's gay for a fact they tend to say "he's probably gay" instead of "he's gay".

Hmm, well that's true too actually, you've got a point there.



And...being completely off-topic...
I love your chest. Holy hell.
Do you mind me asking how long ago you got it done?

Your Dad may also be worried about your safety and/or worried about how HE looks for having a girly son.

When you don't grow up socialized male, you don't necessarily appreciate how much pressure ALL boys have to be gender-conforming. You also may not think that you'll get the tar beat out of you for looking "too f*ggy."

Your Dad may implicitly get that when you appear like a cute little/feminine GIRL or even someone who is ANDRO, people may cut you a lot of slack that they don't if they see boy. They see boy wearing sparkly pants and glitter and while that may be YOU, your dad may just internally sense that the YOU that you are will be a target for bullying or violence - or that it is a reflection on his masculinity or fathering to have parented such a "sissy boy."

I think it's fine and dandy to dress and express yourself the way you like, but I also think it's unwise to ignore the dangers or discomforts that occur from being yourself when you are visibly male. If you're lifting weight and you like wrestling, maybe you could talk to your dad about this more and/or taking martial arts or self-defense or something that will show him that you are stepping up to "take care of yourself," like people expect boys to be able to do.

Quote from: Sean on June 16, 2011, 12:12:39 PM
Your Dad may also be worried about your safety and/or worried about how HE looks for having a girly son.

When you don't grow up socialized male, you don't necessarily appreciate how much pressure ALL boys have to be gender-conforming. You also may not think that you'll get the tar beat out of you for looking "too f*ggy."

Your Dad may implicitly get that when you appear like a cute little/feminine GIRL or even someone who is ANDRO, people may cut you a lot of slack that they don't if they see boy. They see boy wearing sparkly pants and glitter and while that may be YOU, your dad may just internally sense that the YOU that you are will be a target for bullying or violence - or that it is a reflection on his masculinity or fathering to have parented such a "sissy boy."

I think it's fine and dandy to dress and express yourself the way you like, but I also think it's unwise to ignore the dangers or discomforts that occur from being yourself when you are visibly male. If you're lifting weight and you like wrestling, maybe you could talk to your dad about this more and/or taking martial arts or self-defense or something that will show him that you are stepping up to "take care of yourself," like people expect boys to be able to do.

This is about what I was going to say. I think you're dad's trying to do his best in "switching gears" so to speak as if he's had a son all along and acting how he would in that situation.

I agree with the others have written mostly, I can say that at least with me and my brother, this was an attitude our family always had. While I didn't conform well because I didn't feel male at all, my brother did, but he still got alot of nonsense from my father and our aunt.

In fact, my brother got it worse really from my family in general because I think at a certain point they gave up on me being how they wanted, but even though my brother was always doing these masculine things and in general just being a normal guy, because he would listen to stuff like marilyn manson and get all gothed up with the 'guyliner' look they would give him flack over it, my uncle even called him gay because of the music he liked. And when he dyed his hair with streaks of color they said that was something only homosexuals do, but he has always been a normal straight cisgendered guy, it is silly to me that they would act like that to him, but in their view they were "tempering the steel".

I honestly can't say if it happens in all families or even if it is helpful to guys, since as a child it all seemed so mean and rough to me, but that was probably because I am female inside, I am just glad that they eventually gave up on me and focused on my brother. For what it is worth he didn't seem to mind so much, he was being a rebellious teenager in his view, and they were being "old people" in his view, so maybe it isn't such a big deal.

Quote from: GentlemanRDP on June 16, 2011, 05:50:57 AM
I start Testosterone injections on May 8th of this year, and I noticed that now that I'm taking them, he's really pressuring me to be something that I'm not. I have a really unusual haircut (For a girl, or a boy,) And he's been trying to get me to cut it, and to grow my normal color out - he says that it's odd for guys as pale as me to have jet-black hair, and he says that people will only look at me more if I look unusual. But he just doesn't get that I don't want to be a 'boy' in his sense of the word. He wants me to become a muscle-bound sports obsessed meat-head. He's constantly trying to get me interested in sports

You are now being treated like a man.  Congratulations.

Just tolerate it for now.  It probably won't change any time soon.  I can't tell you the countless times that my parents told me I needed a "relationship" with a girl.  Or the countless other stereotypes I was subject to because people thought I was "a man"

People will eventually give up this foolishness.  After many years of refusing to engage such idiocy, people have finally stopped suggesting that I find a wife, or any such nonsense.  The only comments I get are about my appearance (my hair, the length of my fingernails, etc.) which I usually disdain by making fun of the person promoting such nonsense as the idea that guys can't have long fingernails.

My favorite is "you need to cut your nails because it makes you look like a rapist" in which my usual reply involves repeated questioning on exactly how this person has such intimate knowledge of the grooming practices of rapists.

It's called reverse psychology.  Use it.

Quote from: Sean on June 16, 2011, 12:12:39 PM
Your Dad may also be worried about your safety and/or worried about how HE looks for having a girly son.

When you don't grow up socialized male, you don't necessarily appreciate how much pressure ALL boys have to be gender-conforming. You also may not think that you'll get the tar beat out of you for looking "too f*ggy."

Your Dad may implicitly get that when you appear like a cute little/feminine GIRL or even someone who is ANDRO, people may cut you a lot of slack that they don't if they see boy. They see boy wearing sparkly pants and glitter and while that may be YOU, your dad may just internally sense that the YOU that you are will be a target for bullying or violence - or that it is a reflection on his masculinity or fathering to have parented such a "sissy boy."

I think it's fine and dandy to dress and express yourself the way you like, but I also think it's unwise to ignore the dangers or discomforts that occur from being yourself when you are visibly male. If you're lifting weight and you like wrestling, maybe you could talk to your dad about this more and/or taking martial arts or self-defense or something that will show him that you are stepping up to "take care of yourself," like people expect boys to be able to do.

Quote from: VeryGnawty on June 16, 2011, 04:04:50 PM
You are now being treated like a man.  Congratulations.

This.  Many dad's are concerned when they think their son is a sissy.  Either they don't want anyone to think they raised a sissy boy or they're concerned for your safety- or both.  I'm not out to my dad yet, but I'm really fortunate in that he never was like that as far as acting macho.  He definitely dislikes femininity in guys when their isn't much manliness to balance it out (he loved my ex who dressed up in sparkly spandex super hero costumes, but before that he was an airborne ranger,) but I think that may have something to do with him being more the absent minded, non confrontational professor type rather than a guy who loves to hang out at sports bars.  Anyway, guys who don't appear manly get a lot of sh*t- and worse.  Having lived his whole life as a man, your dad knows this.  You probably should learn how to defend yourself unless you live in an incredibly tolerant area, and even then, be careful.  Of course, you shouldn't change who you are to please others.  If that were the case, why bother transitioning?  But that's probably where your dad is coming from. 

So who do you live with now? If you moved back with your parents, then I'm afraid you're going to have to suck it up. But really, he's treating you like his son. In a douchy way, but his son nonetheless.