My friend Devin is finding it difficult to pass lately, it's just really discouraging when absolutely everyone seems to call him "she" or allude to something uncomfortably feminine as soon as they meet him. They always have to come out with some stupid comment eventually that just chucks away any illusions of passing, I wish they would just keep their mouths shut. We used to think it was his voice but recently he doesn't even have to speak for someone to assume he's female. I personally don't see it, I think he looks manly at best and androgynous at the least, you'd think people would at least be a little confused.... anyway, I don't want him to feel bad about going out or meeting new people and I just thought I'd ask if any of you had any ways that he could change his face or his hair or something to make him pass better, pre-t? Thanks guys .

If he's okay with it you could pop up a picture or video.  Otherwise it's hard to say.

agreed with lee. a photo would really help. after that, we can give some great suggestions.

Yeah, I got some pictures but I'm having trouble posting them, how do I do it?

Seriously I can't find how to post them. Oh ->-bleeped-<- am I an idiot?

Yeah, you must be an idiot (Just kidding  )
I forgot to mention that you cannot post pictures until you have 15 posts.  Sorry for the inconvenience.
When you reach that point there is a small button that looks like a small Mona Lisa that you can push when writing a topic or reply.  You then enter the URL for the photo.

Oh well alright then, have some urls!
http://postimage.org/image/15pndqxok/
This is a bad picture but representative of his hair right now, which needs cutting, haha
and this is a better picture of his face
http://postimage.org/image/1bncn5r8k/

Passing, or presenting as male seems to be in my experience more than just physical attributes. There's the non-verbal communication, mannerisms, ways of relating to others, and being brought up as "female" give some of us harder times when in public. Also, does he live in a more city type of environment where some females dress more like guys/and or there are more gay women? when I first started transitioning, it was hard to present and be seen as male as there are a lot of lesbians that dress and act like guys here and I was seen by strangers to be a gay woman it seemed for awhile.

I still try to not wave at people and use hand gestures as much because it gets read as a more feminine way of being.   

hope this helps a bit 

Eh, well in my opinion he's never really acted in a feminine way, he seems to stand in more manly positions and his gesturing isn't really girly, before he came out trans he was in raging butch lesbian mode, so nothing very feminine about that. If you say about the waving and hand gestures I'll pass it on, but it's more about the first impressions, he doesn't have to do anything to get taken as female and it's getting ridiculous lately, mainly it's that people seem to make the judgement within the first seconds of seeing him and he doesn't even have to make a gesture or speak or anything. Even on ChatRoulette!

Oh well, I guess there's not much to be done until T then? The stupid thing is that he's supposed to go on a year of hormone blockers before T which does approximately nothing useful, why the hell don't they just believe that people actually need to transition sooner rather than later and that not everyone is some kind of confused teenage Buffalo Bill?

i can see what you're saying. with all due respect, while your friend is obviously presenting MASCULINE i would not necessarily read him as A MALE.

tips:
-clean up the hairline. (and i believe the shorter, second, haircut is much more male than the first and will help him a lot). males have a very distinct square or widow-peaked hairline. this can easily be done yourself or a barber can do it. it is a pretty common request. just say "square off the hairline" or "clean it up". the first thing i noticed about him was a female hairline. you'd be amazed at what just that will do. it makes the entire face more angular.
-i'm also not one to judge someone based on how they choose to express themself but the jewelry is a huge dealbreaker for me. the necklaces and rings say "woman" to my eye. again, i see "masculine" but not "male". that's fine if your friend enjoys that style, but if his concern is mostly to pass, then maybe he can compromise and hold off on the jewelry for a while.

there isn't really anything about his physical structure or features that i can see that scream female, so most of what's left to help him is the small details like squared hairline an sideburns and male accessories. of course i can't see his height, mannerisms, or voice, but all those can be improved or generally overcome by confidence.

i think if he cut down on the jewelry and changed his hair he would pass better. the first picture he looks extremely feminine.

Alright, thanks a lot, that's really helpful. I don't think he's at all willing to give up the rings, it's more of a metaller style thing for him, but I will tell him about the necklaces and the hairline thing, that was helpful, thanks.

absolutely #1 thing was the haircut i'm really sorry to say but in the first picture, even as the generally accepting person that i am, i do not see a male because of it. the necklaces was second. the rings were an afterthought, many guys into metal or punk/goth do wear lots.

Sorry for maybe posting unwanted.

I pick him as a female in both pics. The first is obvious, I wish I looked that feminine. Sorry I do not mean that in a nasty sense.

The second; the hair has not improved and sorry guys do not wear that amount of jewellery unless they are heavy rockers of bikers. And look very male.

When I started to wear more jewellery, I went from being accepted as male to female instantly. I do not know why.

Cindy

My son is FtM so I guess I can throw in my 2 cents worth! (Why have a normal family hey??)

If Devin can't grow sideburns yet I'd suggest trimming them shorter, to level with the top of the ears, like Anibioman's.  Also necklaces are probably not a good idea.  The rings are ok if they look like the sort of things the other goth guys around town are wearing.

Clothes will depend where you live to an extent.  T-shirts and jeans are a good standard. An old-style  Brando leather jacket is always a good choice, as it makes a straightforward dress statement. " I'm a guy and don't really care a lot about clothes and fashion. It fits, it's warm. End of story."

Boots too, although the style would depend where you lived.  Here in rural Australia, Blundstone or RM Williams elastic sided work or riding boots would work well. Maybe gym boots or Doc's somewhere else.

Best bet would be people-watch, and see what guys do, as well as wear.  I watched a lot of women before I started to go out dressed.

Karen.

That sucks. The metal-rocker rings have always been a part of his style, which is generally leather jackets and docs which I guess would be less obvious after his transition, though. He's not even on T yet, he can't grow sideburns and maybe once he is his face will change, GRR. I will get him to give up the jewellery and I'm also trying to teach him to put on a "hangover" voice to make it sound more masculine. It doesn't really matter what he wears, his binder is ineffective, honestly if I were trans it would be so much easier for me because my boobs are tiny. That hairline thing is definitely something I'll be trying to make happen, do any of you cut your hair yourselves and know how to do it? It's not likely he'll have the money to get a professional to cut his hair anytime soon, haha.

one of the easiest ways to get rid of a feminine hairline is to hide it with the hair. let it grow a little longer on top and find out how to style it to look more male while still hiding the hairline. just make sure the hair isn't long enough to get nice and soft curls, that can make him look too feminine again

you just reminded me that i need to cut my hair again. right now i look like your friend in the first picture, except for the color. or actually even worse

he could also try some male make-up. a little darker under the eyes, below the cheekbones, and under the chin can if applied right make the face look a lot less soft and feminine. there should be lots of videos on youtube on how one could do this

I read him as female in both photos.

Agree with what's been said about hair and jewelry.
But his face looks feminine to me. T will help that.
Until then, one thing that stood out to me is the feminine arch in his eyebrows.
Here's a link that explains that and ways to work around it:
http://www.eyebrowz.com/mens/eyebrowstatement.htm

Maya, what kind of binder is he using? Because if it's not working, he should probably at least look into other kinds (or the sizing could be off).

Okay, my two cents. First picture definitely looks female. The second picture, could've gone either way for me. Honestly, in that second picture he looks a lot like a kid I went to school with. Soft features on both of them, but still a male looking face.

The rings and jewelery? That's a whole different story. If that's what makes him confident, what makes him feel secure? Keep it. Or at least try it. I tried stripping all my "me"ness down, wearing just huge hoodies and baggy jeans, tucking all my hair up under a hat and even with all that, I got "miss" occasionally. Granted, they looked vaguely disgusted, but still. But since I went back to wearing my copious amounts of bling and whatnot, I haven't gotten anything beyond dude, sir, or guy. Granted, I'm exceptionally lucky with my voice, but still. I've got a huge chest, and I'm kind of...lumpy.
The confidence thing, seriously. I had no idea how true it was until I saw that in action.

If he's into that metal look, and if he's wearing tons of silver/pewter skulls and bones and badassery, people will probably think he's some highschool metalhead goth kid. Agreeing with everyone else on the hair, maybe try some hats? I know that wearing a beanie has always made me look a lot more masculine.

binders don't really work for me either (36F on an athletic/low fat frame) but what i've found really helps is wearing an undershirt (plain boxy white t shirt) one size bigger than you normally would, under your clothes. i find that it kind of bunches up under the outer shirt and keeps it from clinging to any curves that the binder didn't take care of.