Kind of a mild thing I've been noticing.

I was talking with this girl at my school, and I said I really was a very "feminine" person. I like to sew and make dolls, I love stuffed animals, I have a small Holiday barbie collection, and I'm a drag queen. While I do dress very relaxed, I have days where I can go all-out camp with rainbow necklaces and skinny jeans. I'm softspoken, generally switch between a very high-pitched "gay" voice and a relaxed deep one. I can balance eveything out with "masculine" things, but overall I consider myself very feminine.

She said I wasn't feminine at all, though she knows I do all that. She knows my birth sex, so she said that I'm actually extremely masculine -- simply because I bind, pack, and "dress like a boy." Even if it's like, a pink polo with rainbow flowers raping glitter-unicorns, it's masculine because it came from the men's section.

Has anyone else heard this from anyone? Masculine MTFs, feminine FTMs, "you're not masculine/feminine because you dress like a girl/boy."

I don't think clothes can make you masculine/feminine. I have a few feminine qualities and a lot of masculine qualities but whether I am more than the other is not for anyone to decide. Everyone has both qualities.

I got that kind of thing from my mother. She didn't like it that I'm a woman who isn't into all the typical female things much. "How can you be a girl when you play those games?" (referring to one of the Ace Combats, 4 I think). Obviously one's interests do not determine their gender. Yes, I'm a woman who doesn't like skirts, doesn't like dresses, doesn't like makeup (though with this face it's a necessity) and probably knows more about physics and mechanics than most guys. None of that has anything to do with how masculine or feminine I may or may not be.

The thing that gets me the most about it though is that these people think it is somehow their place to decide who and what we really are. People seriously need to stop horning in on other peoples' personal matters.

Ugh, tbh if you were a cisguy she probably would've said "Hellz yeah you're feminine."

I was never to my knowledge perceived as actively "feminine" when I was growing up.  I was, however, perceived as distinctly "un-masculine" which brought with it plenty of bullying and ostracism. The fact that I was smart only added to my problems. High school was torture. 

Today, nobody really comments except for those who are "in the know"; they actually tell me I seem more like myself when presenting as female and that I always seem sullen and depressed when trying to pass as male. Probably because I am.

It is interesting to note that since I "came out" to myself, I have lost interest in a lot of the overtly masculine activities I used to enjoy, mostly because they now just kinda bore me.

Well said Dana, I'm very much on the same page. I think that because I was 6' plus and around 200lbs it made it hard to see me as feminine. Growing up, I think people saw me as unmasculine or just plain weird. The connection to being feminine was just too difficult to make for most. Plus, since I am attracted to females, it might have been that my orientation made it easier to see me as male but in a very non-masculine way. Oddly enough, I was always seen as being one of the smart kids though I totally underperformed in school. Boredom, depression, disinterest would be the best description of me way back when.

Now that I am out to myself, spouse and a few close friends, I too have lost interest in the masculine activities I sort of enjoyed but it was pretty thin. I'm much happier to read books, knit, have a glass of wine in a candlelit bath, etc. Ahhh... The good life, well at least for me. Now, I'm moving forward and I'm not looking back. One day, I'll be able to go full-time. In the meantime, I'm much happier being me and slowly I'll get the body to match.

I don't really like being told I'm "feminine". But I find myself to be somewhat metrosexual. I like being clean, well-kept, and when I go out, I like to be decently dressed (clean shirts and pants, sometimes a suit jacket and fedora, etc.). I'm also a fan of very old fashioned chivalry, treating a lady like a lady (saying ma'am/madame, opening doors, offering assistance, etc.) and being creative with words whenever possible. I consider myself cultured, but oftentimes I get a lot of grief because of it, especially from my girlfriend's mom. She claims that me bleaching my hair and liking fine cheese are "taking women privileges", among other things.

Quote from: TheAwesomePrussia on August 14, 2011, 04:51:43 PM
sometimes a suit jacket and fedora

HAWT!!!!

Oh... er... sorry.  I'm a sucker for fedoras.

But on the matter at hand, yes, I was always teased for being a very effeminate boy back when I was in school.  But most of all, everyone simply thought I was gay.  They were right (kind of) but I was so intent on stuffing my feelings down and living a straight life that it disturbed me to no end.

My mom doesn't think I'm feminine enough.  I don't really have a problem with it but it makes me feel a little like Mulan, insomuch as I can't be that perfectly feminine daughter.  How weird is that?  She learned to accept that I couldn't be her son but now has somehow managed to turn it around and say I need to be a more feminine daughter.  I swear, I can't win sometimes.

But as for you Silas, I would say on a bio-guy, rainbow flowers raping glitter-unicorns would be seen as supremely un-masculine.  But don't let it get you down, do whatever you want, I'm sure there are worse things.

Quote from: Maddie Secutura on August 14, 2011, 09:56:05 PMI would say on a bio-guy, rainbow flowers raping glitter-unicorns would be seen as supremely un-masculine.

Unless you are playing D&D, in which case you are a profoundly evil and disturbed wizard. Ultimately, however, if you are comfortable with yourself then I think it will work for you. I don't have a personality that matches with that kind of clothing as a guy or grrl. But, I figure I could wear some long funky socks and that might not work for you. 

Wow, that is tough one Maddie about your mom and not being a feminine enough daughter. I know where my head would instantly go, nowhere good unfortunately.  Your recognition of it as a no win situation or at least a longterm challenge speaks to your strength. I know this is something I am having to wrap my own head around on the family front and my mom will be a bit of a challenge. Hope it all works out for you.

Quote from: TheAwesomePrussia on August 14, 2011, 04:51:43 PM
I get a lot of grief because of it, especially from my girlfriend's mom. She claims that me bleaching my hair and liking fine cheese are "taking women privileges", among other things.

Ummm... I suppose you could become a beer drinking lout, belch, and scratch a lot for a night while repeating frequently in an obnoxious voice "how do you like me now?" Well, maybe not. 
I cannot speak about the hair thing since I've never been into bleached hair. However, liking fine cheese means you have good taste. It was only when I went to Europe that I could appreciate that. There is life beyond cheddar and mozzerella. Shopping in a little market town... Sigh... Where is my shopping bag?

I guess I'm a cheap date then because I loves me some cheddar, extra sharp.

Sharp cheddar is nice. But I'm personally a fan of Danish cheese and Swiss Gruyere.

Creamy Lancashire is nice. I love bbq'ed Halloumi too...

Quote from: Maddie Secutura on August 15, 2011, 08:44:51 PM
I guess I'm a cheap date then because I loves me some cheddar, extra sharp.

I'd heard somewhere that your taste in cheddar (sharp or not I guess) was a regional thing...

As a Global Studies major, I should look into that! o.o

I like to accentuate my masculine qualities sometimes I am quite proud of a few of them! (and I'm not about to change them to try to fit people's gender stereotypes)
I say, stuff them if they think all girls should be typically feminine and all boys should be typically masculine.

Quote from: TheAwesomePrussia on August 14, 2011, 04:51:43 PM
She claims that me bleaching my hair and liking fine cheese are "taking women privileges", among other things.

wtf! Enjoying fine cheese is not gendered.  And how the heck would that be taking women's privilege?  It's not like enjoying cheese grants you privilege.    And if girls can do stereotypical guy things (try telling a female feminist that she can't enjoy football because she's a woman) then why can't guys do stereotypical girl things?     Anyway, I can't imagine many other people would tell you that enjoying the finer things in life is taking women's privilege.  My ex bf used to bleach his hair, and he's the one who taught me about wine and cheese, which I do enjoy.  He's never been accused of taking women's privilege because he can pair wines with food.  Usually, women just see that as a plus. 

I guess I'm kinda androgynous in my interests and personality.  I am really competitive and I'll do anything short of cheating to win, I love playing sports and watching baseball, I'm a gamer, I like history (especially military history,) and I used to be a physics major, now I'm a computer science major.  I also love cute animals, skirts and feminine clothes, hugs, flowers, cooking, and I'm really sensitive.  It's just stereotypes anyway.  I have female friends who love pink, hate babies, don't "get" most girls, and are physicists, and I have guy friends who cross dress much of the time just because they prefer women's clothes, are really sensitive, are artists, gamers, play D&D, and love to bake and cook.  None of them identify as trans.   

Also, lemon goat cheese may just be my favorite cheese of all time.  Or maybe an aged smoked Gouda.   

We've determined she's just jealous that I'm actually going somewhere in life at 20 and her daughter has better taste in men than her. :U
That and she's just attracted to jerks, like the guy she's dating right now. My girlfriend's dad is moving back here later this year and she says the second he does, she's out of that house.

ack, completely forgot about this thread.

I honestly wish I owned a pink polo with rainbow flowers raping glittercorns. Even if I never wore it, sounds like a good pillowcase. A manree one, too. Would go fantastic with the unicorn pillowcase I already have. XD Or maybe I'll just be a crazy evil D&D wizard? lol.

@Sarah7 and Trista: Shoot, I'd bet a cisdude'd be the gayest-looking person ever in it. And yet, guyish on me, and guyish despite my character. Offensive, but only worth an eyeroll.

QuoteI got that kind of thing from my mother. She didn't like it that I'm a woman who isn't into all the typical female things much. "How can you be a girl when you play those games?" <snippy> None of that has anything to do with how masculine or feminine I may or may not be.

The thing that gets me the most about it though is that these people think it is somehow their place to decide who and what we really are. People seriously need to stop horning in on other peoples' personal matters.

Seriously. Hobby is not gender. If a cissexual chick liked video games like that, her mom would probably just bellyache about the price, not "LYK OMG DATZ SO BOYISH! D:" tomboys are cool, at least to me. o.O but grief will be forever given. -_-

Prussia -- suit jackets and fedoras are love. I just got allowed to own a suit jacket. Although metrosexual probably wouldn't be a way I'd describe myself. I've always heard it was something only attributed to straight guys, although that's really homophobic when I think of it? hm.

But... bleaching your hair and cheese? WHAT? XDD That is so hysterically stupid! Dudes bleach their hair all the time! Most people I know bleach it so they can put wilder colors in, but what's wrong with preferring bleached hair? I was gonna bleach and dye mine white. I'm so anti-feminist? lol. The cheese part makes no sense. Only women can be gourmets, if that's the word?

Maddie -- so dumb. -_- My mom called me feminine because I screamed when she got mad and came toward me with scissors. She said I screamed girly, because we all know manly men have manly screams of mannish terror! I do wish you luck. (Mulan's a brilliant person, too.)

Apple -- comfort is comfort is comfort. I generally reject the notion of feminine/masculine mannerisms and such, and I'll emphasize whichever I feel like, usually without thinking. I love gender as a whole, so any way I can show my identity in regards to it is fun. Haa.

I used to go to my 'Ex' therapist after work, in my work clothes and boots. I don't think he took me seriously because I was in my (I guess you could say) masculine work clothes. Really.... I was there for therapy, did he expect me to dress up to try and convince him?
I think a lot of people assume things about people by what they do or what they wear. When I came out to my cousin, he thought I was manly man because I wore manly work clothes and drove a large 4wd