So this has been going on for a while, and I can't seem to figure out what to do.  I try not to tell people around me, because I don't want to impose my problems on them... but this is driving me crazy.  I transitioned MtF about 2 and a half years ago, and I don't really think I like being a girl that much.  I do enjoy being treated like female at times, I like the cloths, I like feeling pretty, but I feel so vulnerable all the time, I have developed such horrible body issues, and I tend to recluse now unless greatly persuaded otherwise.  I also don't like the hormones... Estrogen at times gives me a calm peaceful feeling, but it's almost always obscured by extreme emotional ups and downs... I'm tired of crying all the time.  The thing is, I pass completely, and most people have no idea I am trans unless I telll them... but if anything my gender dysphoria and anxiety around my body is getting worse.  I am so consciously aware of everything about me now, from my movements, to my voice, to how I interact and am interacted with and so on.   It's like I can't even have a normal conversation anymore without all my issues running through my head.  My best friend always asks me what's wrong because I zone out, get really quiet and start looking sad, but I just lie and tell him i'm thinking about something else. It's driving me crazy =(

I am posting here, because I feel like at this point I am identifying better with FtMs than MtFs... And if I were to detransition, or essentially transition back into a male, I would have to have a coming out party about coming out (telling everyone hey i'm going back to being a boy, oh and by the way I was born a boy too) since most of my friends don't know i'm trans. 

I know that it would take time, and effort... but I could go back to being a guy if I wanted to.  The only real problem I'll have is with my face, but even that will change back to male over time.  The thing is, I don't really want to be a boy... but I really don't want to be a girl either.  However, as a boy I would get my family back, most of my friends, and I wouldn't be terrified of leaving my house or having constant body obsessions... but I doubt I'd ever get as happy as I get now.  Either way, I'll never be the person that I was before I transitioned again... I didn't like that guy.  This is driving me crazy =(

Do any of you guys have any suggestions, or input, or did/do you have similar feelings at times? 

i don't know what advice to give you Vanna.   All I can say is don't rush into things or make irrevocable announcements.    I have just thought maybe all your tension, anxiety and confusion stems from the fact that you say that your friends don't know that you are 'trans'.   Do you feel that at some level you are deceiving them, could this explain what your are thinking and feeling? 

I'm sorry you've been having such a hard time. Is it possible that you don't have the right balance of hormones?

I think I may have had unbalanced hormones all my life, but doctors didn't really take me seriously when I brought it up back in the eighties and early nineties. Then again, maybe I just needed to be on T. I feel much better now.

If I were in your shoes, I think I would want a full medical investigation before I decided to detransition.

Then again, you say that you have body issues. On the one hand, a lot of women have the same problem. And a lot of trans women seem to struggle with their own brand of it. Have you talked to a therapist about it?

When you talk about vulnerability, I'm hesitant to respond. I used to feel pretty damned vulnerable in the decade or so when I was trying hard to be a girl. Then I realized what I was, and I started to "butch up." Over several years, I started feeling less and less vulnerable. But I was keenly aware that as long as I was perceived as female, I faced particular dangers, more than I would if I were presenting as male. It's a pretty standard element of living female--probably in most cultures.

Some cis women feel less vulnerable after they take self-defense classes.

You're new to all of this, and it must be overwhelming to be just thrust into it (I've had similar issues, but from the other side). I would normally say to give it time, but I'm not sure that's good advice in this case. I don't think it's a good idea to just sit and wait passively--take action to know yourself better and get more comfortable, both emotionally and physically.

It could be you're neither man nor woman. You might try the androgyne boards and talk to the folks there. They might offer some helpful insights.

This is probably quite a difficult thing to do but try and accept yourself Vanna with all your contradictions.   It is a mistake to search through your personality and sift and separate the parts that you like from those bits that you don't like.   In other words don't try and weaken the thoughts and feelings that disturb you by trying to suppress them, as whatever is suppressed always growths secretly silently in strength until one day it emerges from the psyche as a giant multi-headed hydra.  Vanna try and accept everything about yourself, and if you cannot do that then just accept that at the moment you can't accept yourself as a whole.  Say to yourself Vanna: "okay, at the moment I am in a topsy-turvey, flip-flopping mood.  I am being pulled in two directions at once but there is nothing to worry about, everything is ok as it is."   
   You should try this meditation technique which entails simply following the breath.  Sit in a cross-legged position keeping the spine straight and with eyes closed become aware of your breath, notice if it is high or low, rapid or slow, deep or shallow.   On an in breath count 1 and on an out breath count 2, all the way up to ten where you start all over again.  If your mind brings up images or distractions simply but calmly focus your attention to your breathing.  Ten minutes of this a day and you will see a great difference, you will feel noticeably calmer and more centred.

Quote from: Princess of Hearts on August 25, 2011, 07:47:19 PM
i don't know what advice to give you Vanna.   All I can say is don't rush into things or make irrevocable announcements.    I have just thought maybe all your tension, anxiety and confusion stems from the fact that you say that your friends don't know that you are 'trans'.   Do you feel that at some level you are deceiving them, could this explain what your are thinking and feeling?

I don't really feel deceptive towards anyone... I use to, but I seem to have gotten over it.  I just feel restricted all of the time.  I don't want to do anything where my gender may come up, because it could put me in an awkward situation.  I had to get something notarized the other day, addressed to Mr. Van the 4th... and I was so terrified because I was going to have to tell the guy I transitioned.  I had to do it though, and of course he asked why it said Mr and I explained... but the amount of anxiety that it caused me was profound.  I feel uncomfortable anywhere besides my house, and most especially around other girls.  I fit in with other girls fine, but I just don't feel like I am one of them... I prefer the company of men.

Quote from: Arch on August 25, 2011, 07:51:02 PM
I'm sorry you've been having such a hard time. Is it possible that you don't have the right balance of hormones?

I think I may have had unbalanced hormones all my life, but doctors didn't really take me seriously when I brought it up back in the eighties and early nineties. Then again, maybe I just needed to be on T. I feel much better now.

If I were in your shoes, I think I would want a full medical investigation before I decided to detransition.

Then again, you say that you have body issues. On the one hand, a lot of women have the same problem. And a lot of trans women seem to struggle with their own brand of it. Have you talked to a therapist about it?

When you talk about vulnerability, I'm hesitant to respond. I used to feel pretty damned vulnerable in the decade or so when I was trying hard to be a girl. Then I realized what I was, and I started to "butch up." Over several years, I started feeling less and less vulnerable. But I was keenly aware that as long as I was perceived as female, I faced particular dangers, more than I would if I were presenting as male. It's a pretty standard element of living female--probably in most cultures.

Some cis women feel less vulnerable after they take self-defense classes.

You're new to all of this, and it must be overwhelming to be just thrust into it (I've had similar issues, but from the other side). I would normally say to give it time, but I'm not sure that's good advice in this case.

It could be you're neither man nor woman. You might try the androgyne boards and talk to the folks there. They might offer some helpful insights.

I think I am androgynous.. I went as androgynous for about 6 months before I started transitioning, and it was the most confident I had ever been about myself and my appearance.  I was able to love all things feminine and masculine about me, but I felt compelled to pick a gender.  I am considering going back to that.  I tried to go back to being a guy in April, but it failed miserably.  I ended up getting asked out on a date by some guy and when I asked him why he told me because he likes women who don't wear makeup and are sorta tom boyish.  After that I got upset that i didn't pass as male anymore and consequently fell back into being female. 
My feelings of vulnerability are completely attributed to being a woman... it drives me crazy =(  I want to do a mix of things from different genders, and feel no pressure or constraints from either side... but for some reason I am compelled to pick one.

There's more than just men and women. Maybe there's a place within the gender gamut where you feel most comfortable.

I've been there.  I've extended my hand before if you want to talk with someone who has gone through it.  See if it is worth it.  Here is my hand again.

Quote from: interalia on August 25, 2011, 09:46:02 PM
I've been there.  I've extended my hand before if you want to talk with someone who has gone through it.  See if it is worth it.  Here is my hand again.

Thank you, I just sent you a private message =)

I am not sure what I am going to do, but I think I will make an appointment with a therapist.  A big part of me wants to go back to being a guy, but I would also really miss being a woman.... perhaps I could find a nice medium in between.  I told my friend today what was going on and we had a long talk.. he supports me either way.  He seemed to note that my issues aren't so much gender, as they are my body and my narcissism...
I tried working on my voice today to bring it back down, and i've made progress... but my throat is too sore to continue.  This is my 2nd time gong through this, and I feel like these feelings aren't going to stop... so it'll be interesting to see what happens this time. 

I'm sorry that you're having such a hard time right now. I hope things work out.

But in the meantime I'll throw a wrench in the mix because that's what I do best   

Realize that your issues may not go away by transitioning or de-transitioning, whichever you prefer. If you assume a male role you may literally have the same exact issues that you're having now. You could always be thinking about what people are thinking, if they know, what your voice sounds like, what you look like in your clothes, how you're acting, etc. In my personal opinion, it sounds like you may have some self-esteem issues that you should try and work out before you make such a serious decision. For the record, I think you look very nice, handsome, beautiful, whatever and would look quite attractive presenting as either gender so don't worry there.

On practical advice, you should probably get your hormone levels checked as other people have suggested, but also realize that mood swings are part of being a woman or a person with female-bodied chemistry if you will.

In the end, do what makes you feel comfortable, but realize that might take some experimenting with your identity and presentation. Best of luck.

Vanna I live as a male outside the house and I rarely leave the house as a consequence.   I do very very little outside the house.   On the rare occasions I do have to go out I come back as soon as possible, because I feel a powerful sense of being exiled from my true self. *   I have tried forcing myself to be male in the past, I have said to myself 'stop all this nonsense you are a man and adult stop acting like a teen girl and grow up, and be a help to your mother instead of a worry to her', but it never works, all that happens is that I don't last even a week and I make myself extremely miserable.    In some senses you and I Vanna are opposites.   You believe that becoming a boy again is possible, and that doing this would give you your life back.   I know that I am a girl and that can never change.   I don't want to invalidate your feelings Vanna, but could it be possible that you are going through a particularly severe bout what I outlined above: a psychological purge?


*  I cannot work as a consequence because denying my femininity and being treated as a man a male all day would kill me.   I found acting the male at university physically and emotionally draining and my day was a lot shorter than a typical work day and with more freedom of movement.


 

Vanna, it sounds to me less like you don't want to be a girl, and more like you just weren't prepared for passing so quickly and becoming 'stealth' by default. The things that bother you seem to be less about simply being female, and more about situations where you're afraid of being outed and you don't know what to do, or you feel like you don't measure up to cis women. And if I'm right, then in that sense you do have a lot in common with FTMs: a lot of us go through a very similar phase because testosterone tends to have much more dramatic effects than estrogen so we're quickly plunged into a social role that we may not be prepared for. I'm sort of in the same phase right now.

And if I'm right, then you're right, the hormones aren't helping at all. Estrogen amplifies emotion, especially self-doubt, fear, sadness, grief, loneliness, anxiety. That doesn't mean it's the wrong hormone for you - it has that effect on every girl. But it does mean that if you're in a stressful situation, you're going to feel more overwhelmed now than you would have in the past.

I'm not sure what advice I can give. You can try to reduce the stress (either by detransitioning partially or fully, or by just consciously deciding that you're going to stop pressuring yourself to be totally stealth, stop conforming, and just start being yourself). Alternatively, you can recognize where the stress is coming from and try to learn to cope with it; if you take this route, I suggest getting some counseling to help you through this time.

Transgender spectrum is a continuum.  We can be in middle enjoying part of each gender.  Transitioning is to make you happy.  It is not to make everyone else happy.  Be yourself.

I am old and have had gender issues my entire life.  I do not pass as female and only surgery would get me closer.  I just want to be me.

Did you remove your beard?  Did you remove your testes?  Did your breasts grow?  If you did not remove your beard and testes then your beard will grow if you stop taking testosterone blockers.  It is O.K. to stop blocking testosterone.  It will do its thing.  If you are under 21 you may grow a little more.  If not you are full grown.  If you still have your testes then you will produce T quickly.  You will grow a bread over time if you did not remove it.  If your breasts are small then you can live with them in short run.

This is your life and you can do what helps you.  Do you prefer attention of boys or girls? 

Are you chatting with a therapist?  Probably more people are in middle than are on ends.

I would start with blood test to make sure that the anxiety isn't metabolic. Too many MTF forget that women need testosterone too. Low T can have a negative mental impact so make sure yours is ok.  Taking martial arts and lifting weight may increase your self confidence and make you feel more safe. Don't worry about bulking up becasue it's just not going to happen without male levels of T and even then it's a slow process.

Strong women are beautiful. Just look at angelina jolie in some of her movies!

I tried to transition 20 plus years ago, and then returning to being male and then trying to commit suicide several times.  AT the time I guess I was not ready mentally.

Vanna, you tried to detransition and were still asked out as a woman.  To me that is a sign.  Do the androgynous thing for a while.  I am a firm believe that unless you are totally miserable being female, detransition is the last thing one needs.  Yes it may work for a few, but the facts say that it does not work for all.  I personally would never go back no matter how bad it seemed.

Vanna,
  I seen you transition since the beginning.  I seen the same rapid transition after a year on HRT as yours from others as well.  The results from those were different from each other.  Some had thoughts of detransitioning, but faded with time for most of those.  The others simply didn't look back.  I am letting things float as I transition and not let the things that would bother me because of this.  I am too old for worrying about when to start crossdressing, voice training, and the other things that comes with this. 
  Vanna, try to take it easy, your transition effects were quite rapid.  Give your mind time to catch up, then decide.  Yo-yo transitioning is not good for your body.
  Joelene

I did seem to become passable quickly, and that was something I had to deal with... but now i've been passing completely for 2 years and things have gotten continually worse in my head.  So, I don't think passing is the issue.  Several people have suggested having my hormones checked, but I had that done the first time I started flipping out like this... and nothing was odd, except slightly elevated T levels.  I suspect the high levels were because I was exercising so much.  I haven't had any surgeries besides on my face, so I could actually go back... although, I don't think I could go shirtless anymore.  I dressed up as a guy tonight for my friend and he said everything looked fine, except for my face.  Last time I did this I had somebody tell me I looked like I was about to start transitioning FtM, so I suspect if I do this again then that is what people will probably think at first.  I know that I'm trans... but I don't know if I have to transition... at least not completely anymore. Maybe being a feminine boy/androgynous person would work out if I stuck with it.

The time that I felt most happy and most confident with myself was when I was living androgynous, right before I started hormones.  A big part of me wants to go back to that, and identifying as male.. it seems it would make my life easier, and I'd get a lot of my old friends and family back too.  I really enjoy being female at times, and being carefree and dressing cute, but it never seems to last.  I get anxiety everyday before I leave my house now, and it only seems to get worse... and it seems to have started when I began transitioning. 
The thought of aging as either gender seems to bother me, and to me that seems like an indicator that the problem is more with my body and with my brain, than it is my gender.  I am going to think on this for a couple more weeks before I do anything drastic, but I kinda feel like I already know what i'm going to do.

there was a time in my life where i didn't think i should've been a girl, but androgynous rather. i was really unhappy and blase' before transition. i guess you should just think back to when you first started transition, and what you were thinking at that point in time. think about if you've met those needs you had when you first started transitioning.

Quote from: VannaSiamese on August 27, 2011, 01:32:57 AM
The time that I felt most happy and most confident with myself was when I was living androgynous, right before I started hormones.  A big part of me wants to go back to that, and identifying as male.. it seems it would make my life easier, and I'd get a lot of my old friends and family back too.

Living in your birth gender is easier for your family.  Transitioning is about you.  Are you happier?  If yes then slow down.  Unfortunately society "forces" us to select a gender.  If you look like a girl and dress in male clothes you are considered a girl in male clothes and reverse is also true but is frowned upon.

Would you want to be a "pretty boy"?

Did you get anything that you liked from HRT?

I dress as a guy because i do not like the attention i get from men. I don't think i can offer you much. I do like being seen as other and its enough to keep men from being interested. I like i do not have to worry about my appearence. I can just be me..

I feel like a non op non hrt ftm if that makes sense 

Sorry for the intrusion boys, but I wanted to show this interesting and neutral piece on detransition- straight from Susan's wiki! /shameless plug:

https://www.susans.org/wiki/Detransitioning

Remember, gender can be interpreted as a continuum, just like sexuality. Vanna, I trust you have given this issue much serious thought and I hope you soon find a place on the continuum that gives you peace.