It's pretty mundane.

To identify as androgynous/genderqueer: what does it really matter?  For the vast majority of us there will be no real change in our bodies, it's all mental.  Is it?  I keep looking for concrete examples and find few.  Ken/Kendra, perhaps.  I don't mean to call people out, but it's just what is there,.

"I don't feel. . ." are the words that I use, but my actions are the same as they ever were.  I do identify as androgynous/genderqueer.  Even this weekend, I didn't check that little box on a form.  Wow, big deal, I know.

Maybe I'm making more of this than it really is.  I am not that interesting of a person; a bookish, nerdy, fat, effeminate kind of person who, sometimes, wants to be a girl rather than this half-man with the slightly-abnormal attachment down there.  Oh, yeah, I'm pretty self-absorbed, too. 

(I know I can be dramatic and self-pitying, too, so I know that by putting that in there, some may be inclined to respond "oh no you're not" and I'll feel better for a while and the cycle will start over again later.  I do take pride in one thing: that I seem to know why I do most things, even if it works subconsciously.  This whole gender thing has me confused as hell, though.)

Perhaps...
this is just a stop along the way.
this is a stopping point until I transition or determine that I cannot (I do not subscribe to the 'transsexuals must transition' belief.)
this is just to make myself feel better.

And are any of those morally wrong?  I don't think so.

Time for work.

b/d

I think your post is an interesting one. I have asked myself this question a few times.

You know, the thing is for me, putting myself in a box called 'androgyne' is very dualistic for me, just like many things in my life are very dualistic, like my gender feeling.

You ask yourself 'what does it matter'. You can only give yourself the answer that is right for you.
For me, it is like this;

I have always felt somewhere in between. I never felt like a girl when I was a child, and I never feel like a woman now I am grown up. But I also never felt like a guy. And I also always felt girlish and womanish, and boyish and masculine. So it is neither and both. Always this dualism.
I have always felt being from the two genders .

This made me unhappy and confused for many times. It made me think there was something really wrong with me. I could feel jealousy towards 'real' woman, because they had something that I never understood. I didn't belong to them and I still don't, and at the same time I don't belong to men. I could feel jealousy for that too.

I thought I was some kind of a freak. Something must be really wrong with me. Maybe my ->-bleeped-<-ed-up childhood was an influence. But now I know better.
Yes, I do have a ->-bleeped-<-ed up childhood and every reason why I can distance myself from being a woman. But unfortunately as that is, that is not why I have those feelings of androginity. And in my heart I have always known that. It just made everything more complicated, because it was a nice excuse in a way.
The truth is that I truly AM androgyne. Now, I can say that with pride and without feelings of shame or confusion.

I have spend many years in dealing with my past, and I did a great job in it. I became a strong, self-confident and self conscious person. But those androgyne feelings never went away.

One of my friends has a child. He is born a boy, but clearly he is not a boy. This is the only transgender child I know. Other friends of mine also have children. They are clearly from the gender they are born with. To see this, and see such gender-specific behaviour when the children could hardly talk, made me realise even more that what I have always felt is right for me. I am not a freak, and definitely not mentally disturbed, I was always right.

I actually do think this is not a mental thing. I think it has got something to do with my hormones and the way my brains work.

I was proud of my androgynity for the first time when I was 14. I tattooed a symbol of androginity on my own leg. The feeling I had when I discovered that symbol was a feeling of freedom. Finally I saw something that expressed the way I felt.

I let the label go. Until a few years ago. It was just too much of an issue for me, this whole gender-feeling I had/have.

I have a love/hate relationship with a label like that. It gives me freedom, and puts me behind bars at the same time. In a way I declare myself abnormal using that label, especially to people who feel like the gender they are. They will never be able to fully understand it. I also declare myself normal with it, because this way I could find more people who feel the same thing. They (you) help me to accept and understand myself better.

I am a bit cautious now with who I tell what I feel. As a 'biological (?) woman' it is easy to dress androgyne without getting strange looks. And I don't feel the need to express myself to the point that I want to look like a true man. I am not into wearing the moustache, allthough I have to admit I can find many dragkings extremely sexy and sometimes I wish to look like that myself sometimes.
So, in that way it is mental, it is the way I feel and I don't feel the urge a lot to prove this to other people.
For a while I did, and I told many people about my feelings. Most friends of mine know about this. I think most accept it but just don't get it. That also confused me a lot to be honest. I AM a normal person, I concider androgynes or other people between the genders to be absolutely normal. But most people don't. So I was stigmatising myself, and feeling the frustration from that because I do think that we should ALL be considered normal people.

Can you still follow my story?

Anyway, why does it matter,
it matter because it makes me accept myself and find people like here to help me understand myself
it doesn't matter ->-bleeped-<- because I am who I am and I don't need to be boxed for it.

Like my boyfriend always says: What does it all matter what label you are, just feel yourself and be yourself and live yourself!
Besides that I díd find recognition (and thus freedom) by labeling myself, he is absolutely right! 




.....I have to add one more thing... about the clothes I wear, I have to admit that when I feel more masculine (I am kinda fluid and can feel from pretty femimine to pretty masculine) I do feel the need to look less like a woman. In that moments I want to shave my hair off and dress much more like a man.
Because I am afraid that I might regret the hairthing, I still don't have the guts to shave it all off.... but actually recently I am thinking about that strongly again!.....

Well, hair does grow back ...it's worth doing at least once.  I've never shaved my head (my head is kind of small and I think it will make me look disproportionate) but I go through phases of cutting it off and growing it.

Back to the topic at hand.  Labels can help classify things and help others to know what you're talking about (think binomial nomenclature) but they can hinder because as individuals were hard-pressed to fit into a set of attributes that are either directly defined within the label or, worse, are assumed by the rest of society and colors their view of you.

My opinion, you should place the labels aside for time being and challenge yourself to think about and experience things that are new and different to you or have made you uncomfortable and explore those feelings and reactions. I think that will help you to know yourself better, then if you want to, worry about labels.

QuoteTo identify as androgynous/genderqueer: what does it really matter?  For the vast majority of us there will be no real change in our bodies, it's all mental.  Is it?  I keep looking for concrete examples and find few.  Ken/Kendra, perhaps.  I don't mean to call people out, but it's just what is there,.

Its ok to call me out. And your right in that I dont represent something so vast as  androgyne and genderqueer. I do have the ability to talk about my own personal experiences either common or different.

Something like gender and how your are is extremely important. Even if you naturally being that doesnt fit popular definitions and rules.

I do remember several nights laying in bed crying to myself about things that did not seem to make sense. One thing I did hear though is others saying similar things. Does it really matter that there are others? Certainly you compare 2 different cisgendered persons, and they will not be the same. Compare 2 androgynes and they are not the same either. To one aspect, being unique is important. In another aspect finding others that may have similar experiences can help you and others along this path called life.

"it's all mental" - maybe some is abstract, some is more emotional, its definately something natural and free flowing. Certainly things can and many times have physical manifistations.

QuoteYou ask yourself 'what does it matter'. You can only give yourself the answer that is right for you.
For me, it is like this;

I have always felt somewhere in between. I never felt like a girl when I was a child, and I never feel like a woman now I am grown up. But I also never felt like a guy. And I also always felt girlish and womanish, and boyish and masculine. So it is neither and both. Always this dualism.
I have always felt being from the two genders .

This made me unhappy and confused for many times. It made me think there was something really wrong with me. I could feel jealousy towards 'real' woman, because they had something that I never understood. I didn't belong to them and I still don't, and at the same time I don't belong to men. I could feel jealousy for that too.

Like I have writen before, ....in the beginning, I knew no gender bounds. When the world created night and day, male and female gender was thrust upon me...is where the real problem began.

I learn and continue to learn about being androgyne and the many facets from reading others experiences and posts. I only myself try to post when I can and input my own variations. Sometimes I like to post big. Sometimes small posts

Quote from: Ken/Kendra on March 01, 2007, 06:23:47 PM
Sometimes I like to post big. Sometimes small posts

Damn how is t possible that I never seem to manage small posts