...and it's killing me.

I feel so tired; utter physical and emotional exhaustion......

Somebody who is very special to me and I have decided that we....need to go our separate ways.

I keep crying...

And it's killing me. She seems to be holding up through it all much better than I am, but I have not witnessed the tears that she has cried, or is still crying............

Oh hell.......................I have cried alot and hard in this Shop, lately.

My head hurts....

We both agreed to the necessity and we still very much love each other. I am essentially in a full-blown grieving phase and it would seem that this has driven the present nominal stress level to possibly a dangerous point....

But I am not at all referring to self-destruction; I can say that at this point that this will never occur.

The danger here is to the mind and what could potentially occur to it, secondary to very high psychic stress.

It occurred to me that i would not have been able to endure stresses of this magnitude, if I were still living in the former pseudo-male existence and role. Given the nominal stress of trying to live that way, these current stressors would have done it.

"Why??" I would ask...a relevant and appropriate query for so many seeming imponderables.

"How much more pain and agony will I taste, before the nominal state of being and existence is that of inner peace, a semblance of tranquility and the absence at least, of sorrow and grief?"

10 years for us...wonderful years and I...almost cannot believe it is about to terminate...

If only my mind was properly aligned with the body....but it just isn't and that simply cannot be successfully denied.

I have tried, repeatedly to nought, to no effect,

A desperate exercise in futility and the resisted knowledge of what the inevitabilities would be...

And here they are......

My head sure does hurt.....i wonder what the limits are....

i just so much would like to dissociate from the pain, from reality....

That has happened transiently in the past, ironically perhaps in therapy...the third time was the worst and longest....

i retreated into my mind, where it was warm and dark and i was protected from it all...

i didn't want to come out....

Statistically, almost no mariages survive transition. It's dire but true. I know you're in the psychological "grief" stage right now - I remember breakinging up with my girlfriend during transition. But, I think what kept me going was thinking about what I'd be gaining. I was free to date men freely and explore my androphillic tendancies.

Bri

Ps- Why do you think your head is anyways hurting? This is more classically a sign of mental repression in relation to transsexualism.

i don't know

maybe its a function of stress and fatigue and tension and hormonal leveling secondary to the change in administration and high stress at work and grieving

i am not sure....i wonder how long that the average period of grief typically is....

there is so much that i just don't understand nor see any logic in

perhaps this is in itself inducing stress: trying to understand and find logic in things that simply defy such analyses and hard conclusions...

so many have told me that i think too much. i wonder what they mean

can you drive yourself crazy i wonder--?

we'll no longer be a couple, living together---------and i am trying to negotiate and resolve this reality

i will, but how long?

how long

In my opinion, I think you are searching for secondary feedback, although probably unknowingly. The question is if you will grow beyond this need.

Bri

i know what i have to do, insofar as she and i are concerned

its a way to analyze and reconcile

it was not my intent be a problem here

Quote from: Brianna on March 03, 2007, 06:01:02 PM
In my opinion, I think you are searching for secondary feedback, although probably unknowingly. The question is if you will grow beyond this need.

Bri

You know what's funny about this finalization of our parting?

I honestly feel a sense of liberation, of anticipation of the future. This i believe will actually increase as the grieving recedes into the past....

it sure is an odd thing to experience, however and this is the first time that I have ever experienced actual grief.

I have no doubt about the improvement that the future will bring, but this is really odd to experience.

Parting is hard.  Grieving is hard.

Sometimes both are needed to bring happiness and fulfillment to all parties.

Robyn

So i hate to ask this question but...
If soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married and have children?
Ricki

Quote from: Ricki on March 03, 2007, 10:09:47 PM
If soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married and have children?

Because many of us simply weren't aware of our options at the time - especially us older, "secondary" (lol...) transsexuals

There wasn't much else TO do - except make the best of the life we were given, trying to carve out some sort of female life *within* male social roles and expectations.

Yea, THAT worked out well

Kate

Quote from: Ricki on March 03, 2007, 10:09:47 PM
So i hate to ask this question but...
If soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married and have children?
Ricki

In my case: I'm 50.5 years old. As I said to her and to my therapist to the effect that,

"If I knew about my TS before before we married, we would have never married [or even initiated a relationship]."

"I wouldn't have done that to you."

We married in 1997; I finally understood that I was TS in 2005.

Quote from: Ricki on March 03, 2007, 10:09:47 PM
If soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married and have children?

Obviously this is a question that many of us have had to deal with.  Spouse asks me this all the time.  I keep answering her the best way I know how and she still seems to go back to it.  I guess her lack of understanding is, well, understandable.  The desire to transition is so huge, so catastophic in so many ways, especially to our spouses, that it would seem inconceivable to me too that someone could deny that to themselves.

The thing is, I didn't have a desire to transition.  I wanted to live with it, I thought it was my job during this lifetime, I was SUPPOSED to deal with the situation and learn through it (and I did!) but the conceppt of actually changing my life and living as the female that I felt myself to be never entered the picture.

Until, of course, I finally reached my limit of endurance and was eventually opened to the idea that a successful transition could be possible.

So, when she asks me, "Why did you marry me when you knew all this about yourself?"  I simply answer that it's, "because you're the one I fell in love with."

hugs & smiles
helen

Quote from: Ricki on March 03, 2007, 10:09:47 PM
So i hate to ask this question but...
If soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married and have children?
Ricki

Several times, I went to my church leaders with "my problem".  They asked me if I had had any homosexual encounters.  I answered that I did not like men.  After breathing a sigh of relief (as in "we haven't lost him yet), they advised me to attend church, get married, and have a family. Then, those feelings would go away.  Had I not listened to them, I would not have gotten married. I really thought that it was a bad idea. Had I known what I know now......

Cindi

Quote from: Cindi Jones on March 04, 2007, 10:14:31 PM

Quote from: Ricki on March 03, 2007, 10:09:47 PM
So i hate to ask this question but...
If soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married and have children?
Ricki

Several times, I went to my church leaders with "my problem".

The only time in all of my life that I actually did this, was only recently and then, the response was entirely expected and 'therapeutically impotent'.

This is not a moral nor a spiritual issue and accordingly cannot be remediated nor 'cured' by cognitive nor spiritual therapeutic modalities.

They asked me if I had had any homosexual encounters. I answered that I did not like men.

They would have been rather shocked by my answer to such a query. This would have proven to be somewhat amusing.

After breathing a sigh of relief (as in "we haven't lost him yet), they advised me to attend church, get married, and have a family. Then, those feelings would go away. 

...thereby affirming my low opinion of 'christian' counselors insofar as TS issues are concerned (anger over the rank injustice of it all).

When I had 'come out' to one of my brothers, he said to the effect,

"Have you seen a christian counselor about this?"

I responded, "I am not averse to doing so [knowing full well that such would be useless and ineffective], but such would not be able to explain why I experienced such vast improvement, secondary to HRT."

Had I not listened to them, I would not have gotten married. I really thought that it was a bad idea. Had I known what I know now......

Cindi

The grave injustice of it all.

Why did we get married.  Not a bad question really and there are so many reasons.

Of course I knew something was wrong with me, but WHAT?  This just wasn't talked about at that time.  I was trying to do what was "expected" of me.  My mother told me that if I married, I would get "cured".  Ha!

I told my wife of my issues before we married, she even went out with me as a woman (and in the early 60's that was brave of her).  She accepted until later in life (after the kids).

If I had it to do over again I doubt that I would have married (of course that is hind sight).  I am not saying that I did not love (and still do in many ways) my wife, but I married for the wrong reasons (1.  Trying to show I was a man; 2.  Trying to please my mother (really a bad reason); and 3.  Not really understanding how severe my TS condition was).

Unfortunately  so many people tend to get hurt in these situations.

Sarah L.

Quote from: Brianna on March 03, 2007, 05:24:09 PM
I remember breakinging up with my girlfriend during transition. But, I think what kept me going was thinking about what I'd be gaining. I was free to date men freely and explore my androphillic tendancies.

That's how I looked at it as well.  It helped me get over the grieving much faster.

Quote from: rhonda13000 on March 03, 2007, 06:13:10 PM
I honestly feel a sense of liberation, of anticipation of the future. This i believe will actually increase as the grieving recedes into the past....

Exactly.

Quote from: Ricki on March 03, 2007, 10:09:47 PM
So i hate to ask this question but...
If soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married and have children?

Good question.  At the time, I was very into women and I thought this was something I could repress for the rest of my life.  I did tell my wife about how I felt inside prior to getting married though and she remembered.  As for children, my first child was unplanned and was born prior to marriage, but the second one was planned.  I'm glad I had children and do not regret doing so, as transition would have killed any chances of having additional children.  As for my marriage I also do not regret it since my wife has helped me grow so much as a person during those years.  I recently thanked her for that.  I do regret all the hurt I have caused people, but it was inevitable at the time I needed to transition.  I hoped my feelings would go away with marriage and it did help for a little while until things became "normal" once again.  Marriage didn't cure them and if anything it has irritated my feelings and made them swell to the point transition became necessary.

Quote from: rhonda13000 on March 04, 2007, 04:56:08 AM

Quote from: Ricki on March 03, 2007, 10:09:47 PM
So i hate to ask this question but...
If soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married and have children?
Ricki

We married in 1997; I finally understood that I was TS in 2005.

Same years for me too.

Melissa

Quote from: Ricki on March 03, 2007, 10:09:47 PM
So i hate to ask this question but...
If soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married and have children?
Ricki

Because we are all human beings and want to feel and be loved. Because procreation is natural to most regardless of TG issues. The better question Rickiis why did so many do so without being open from the beginning about themselves, even if they didn't understand it or have a name for it?
I suspect the answer to that is a lot of self doubt and fear.

I am one of the fortunate few who can say that as of this writing I am still married after going on 34 years.  We have managed to survive the hell of transition but only through a lot of talk and compromise and heart ache.

We were married in 1973 and at that time I don't think the word transsexul even existed   I certainly didn't know what was wrong with me and like many of the day, I felt that I was gay, and consequently in my case did every manner of masciline things to prove to myself that I wasn't, including marriage.

It is so unfortunate that our marriges don't survive but it's one of those tragedies that comes with the territory.  I know that doesn't make the situation any better, but it's a consequence that must be made perfectly clear to all those who begin this journey we refer to simply as Transition.

Steph

Interesting replies and i can see the point and validity in every one of them.
I honestly just never felt like being married or having kids, of course my fight flight is always to say maybe that has nothing to do with transsexualism and that is how my regular blocks were just layed?
Interesting.  Glad i asked.
Ricki

Are you guys saying getting married then coming out as TS are the kind of relationships that fail?

If I'm in a reltionship with someone who I've been with for 3 years but they know all about it does that put us in the statistic that most TS marriages don't last?

Quote from: Jack on March 12, 2007, 07:54:11 PM
Are you guys saying getting married then coming out as TS are the kind of relationships that fail?

If I'm in a reltionship with someone who I've been with for 3 years but they know all about it does that put us in the statistic that most TS marriages don't last?

I wouldn't think so. If they already know, it's completely different from finding out one, five, or several years into the marriage. My ex thought she was getting a husband. I'm sorry to disappoint her but if I knew then what I knew now, I wouldn't have done it.

Karen Lyn     

QuoteIf soo many of us knew (sort of knew about ts or something differentin the youngness of our lives) we were different or not right why did soo many get married...

We don't have children.

I told my wife before I married her and explained how I felt.

She asked me, "So, do you want to go to clubs dressed up and chase men, or what?"
to which I replied, no, not really, it's a lot deeper than that.

We talked about it for about a few days.  After that, it was more or less a taboo subject, we got married a few months later.

About a year of a spiraling downward depression ended me in Therapy and landed me here.
I was diagnosed with GID and my wife hit the roof.  A few months later it became a taboo subject that she won't discuss again.

My rational for marriage?
I don't want to be alone in life forever, and my wife is a pretty good friend, most of the time.
Transitioning is too damn hard for a myriad of reasons, including the fact that I would never pass, I'd be some 'freak in a dress'.  If things get worse, I can check out, and I can leave her with a pretty healthy life insurance claim.  I don't ever see me being happy in life, but I'd be much more miserable alone.  I can provide very well for her, and I can make her happy most of the time.

I even told her these things.
She knows I am prone to suicidal thoughts and she knows why.
She knows my view on our marriage.

Where has that rational actually lead us?

The theory was pretty sound, but it turns out that we are more roomates.
We are probably going to end up divorcing.  It's been something we have discussed lately.
The strange thing?  I'm not at all upset, and neither is she.
Our entire marriage has been kinda like.... roomates.

We were married late in 2003.

Jessica