Susan's Place Logo

News:

Please be sure to review The Site terms of service, and rules to live by

Main Menu

Audacity in Toilets

Started by Clive, September 07, 2011, 05:52:13 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Clive

I was out last Saturday night with my friends from work, and really had it hammered home to me how audacious some people can be when they encounter something that confuses them.

I avoid public toilets when I can, but it got to the point that I really needed to visit the loo or wet my pants, so I slipped discreetly into the Ladies', dashed into the nearest cubicle and had my wee.  Mid-flow, I could hear girls outside the cubicle in a heated debate about my gender:

'Oh my God, has a boy gone in there?'

'Was it a boy?'

'Could it be a boy?'

'It looked like a boy.'

'What should we do?'

'I don't know.  I just don't know.'

I could hear new people entering the loos and being sucked into the debate.  I briefly considered staying in the cubicle for the rest of the night, but it was rather unpleasant in there, so I decided to buck up and exited, crossing quietly to the sink to wash my hands.  As I turned on the tap, a girl approached me and said,

'Excuse me, are you a boy?'

I thought about launching into a monologue about my gender confusion and attempting a definition of the term 'transgender,' but the possibility of being beaten over the head with a sequined handbag seemed high, so I played it safe and said,

'No.  I'm a girl.'

'Oh,' she said.  'That's all right then.'

What I really should have said, and desperately wish I had now, was 'Oh, well fine.  Glad it's all right with you.  I didn't realise you'd been appointed Guardian of the Toilet, Defender of Gender-Specific Space and Lord of All Sex-Appropriate Restroom Facilities.'  That would've been good.  I'll use that next time.

Unbelievably, she then asked,

'But you must be a lesbian, then?'

In hindsight, what I would've been a really good thing to say, was,

'I fail to see the relevance of your question.  You do realise that lesbians urinate in the same way as heterosexual women?'

Instead I just fled.

It's ridiculous, though.

I'm meant to believe that this woman thought a young man had entered the women's toilets, walked through a crowd of women squirting hairspray and arguing about their boyfriends, used a cubicle, came back out into the crowd of women and all this time didn't realise that he wasn't in the men's room?

No.  No no no.  There's no way she could've believed that.  She immediately knew that I was in some way Queer, and she didn't like it, and decided to make a scene about it.

It just gets on my nerves that occasionally, women in public toilets don't think, 'This might be my problem.  It's something I don't quite understand - but perhaps I need to adapt my thinking slightly to cater to this new situation.'  They automatically think, 'How dare this person not conform to my idea of how things are?!  It's just not fair.  I must challenge them!'

Why can't we all just GET ALONG???! ::)
'And I thank you for those items that you sent me:
The monkey and the plywood violin.
I practiced every night, now I'm ready,
First we take Manhattan, then we take Berlin.'

First We Take Manhattan, Leonard Cohen

(Avatar by sherlockiangirl)
  •  

Sharky

Sounds like you should start using the men's room.
  •  

~RoadToTrista~

  •  

Wil Najera

if i passed that well, i'd be using the mens room.
~wiLeeuhm~
  •  

Preston

The thing that pisses me off most about this is not only did it concern them enough to debate about it, but the woman had the gall to then say, "Oh, well you must be a lesbian, right?" What the hell? That has absolutely NOTHING to do with ANYTHING. I'm getting to the point in my transition where I might start using men's restrooms and situations like this frighten me.
I'm sorry this happened, Clive. Next time that happens let'em have it!!  ;)
  •  

Arch

Quote from: Preston on September 08, 2011, 01:25:39 AM
The thing that pisses me off most about this is not only did it concern them enough to debate about it, but the woman had the gall to then say, "Oh, well you must be a lesbian, right?" What the hell? That has absolutely NOTHING to do with ANYTHING.

Sounds like she was trying to embarrass him.
"The hammer is my penis." --Captain Hammer

"When all you have is a hammer . . ." --Anonymous carpenter
  •  

Cindy

She sounds a total bitch.
And Clive I think the writing is on the wall and it says. You look like a guy, You act like a guy. You are a guy. So use the guys toilets. :laugh:

Good luck in future encounters.
Cindy
  •  

insideontheoutside

People never cease to amaze me. Seriously wonder how multiple people could think any of that was appropriate.

I was at a roadside rest stop once and I usually use the women's toilet at those because the men's can get creepy and I was by myself, so I go in and there's a line (of course, my luck) so I'm standing there trying to not stick out like a sore thumb and this old lady turns around and does a double take. I had my sun glasses on and I heard her kind of whisper to who she was with, but I couldn't hear all of it. Next thing I know, she turns around and says real loud, "Maybe you should take those sun glasses off so you can see you're in the wrong restroom". At that point EVERYONE in the line turns around. I really didn't know what to do or say because I'm just kind of once again shocked at the balls on old ladies, so I just go, "Oh" and walk out. I sucked it up and went into the men's toilet (which was beyond foul) and just ducked into a stall.

Still, I look pretty andro - I mean if I was some big dude with a beard and I walked right into the women's toilets it might be a little different for someone to pipe up and say something, but if gender might be a question it might be best to keep your mouth shut.
"Let's conspire to ignite all the souls that would die just to feel alive."
  •  

Kayla

Yeah, seriously what everyone else said. But don't be afraid to use the mens restroom. Every guy in there is so afraid of looking gay that they don't look anyone in the face and almost never say anything.
  •  

rexyrex

yeah if u pass as a male in the lady loos they talk, but i think it best if u start using the mens, they dont use to loo to talk in there they just go in do their thing then out, no eye contact or any talking ..... i kinda had the same problem long time ago.
Started Testosterone: 2013
Top surgery: 2014
Bottom surgery: 2016
  •  

Nathan90

It depends a bit on where you are/live and the time of day. But even if you don't pass that well, if you just walk into the men's room and go straight for the stalls, very likely nobody will give you a second glance. If they do and ask you about it (if it's really confronting, then I guess it was the wrong place/time of day) just tell them the girls toilet has a line and you need to take a leak very bad. Even if there's a line, it'll always be a shorter wait.

I was prepared to use that excuse at an event I attented this summer. Especially if I'd run into someone that knows me as a girl, but nobody payed any attention so I didn't need to.

Another option would be (if it's not 'safe' to use the men's room) is to stand in the ladies line anyway and when someone asks, just act embarrassed and shy (which won't be too difficult since you'll probably feel like this a bit anyway) and tell them the stall in the men's room is broken (or maybe not there) and that you're pee-shy. Even if they have someone to ask, you'll be gone so they won't confront you with it.

But apart from that, I know very well what you mean. The girls at school are killing me with their giggles and voiced disbelief when I walk in. And especially (like your discussion going on) the conversations and laughs when you closed the door. As if the bloody thing is soundproof..
Instead of waiting for the storm to pass, learn to dance in the rain
  •  

Clive

Thanks folks :)  Good to hear encouragement about using the Mens' - I am a bit apprehensive though, as although I do frequently get read as a boy in the Ladies' I'm still a little new to passing and self-conscious about whether I pass well enough - though a lot of what you're saying about men's room etiquette and people not really looking at you is reassuring.  My main concern would be explaining to my friends why I'm using the Mens' - I'm not really out to them yet, although I have been dropping subtle hints to one of my best mates at work and I'm sure he must sense the direction I'm heading in, lol.  Also, there'd be the risk of encountering someone who knows me as a woman - I live in a fairly small and close-knit town and as I work in one of the main social 'hot spots' I frequently see people I know on nights out - I'm not sure whether I'm quite ready to explain myself to that many people.

But it's definitely something to think about. 
'And I thank you for those items that you sent me:
The monkey and the plywood violin.
I practiced every night, now I'm ready,
First we take Manhattan, then we take Berlin.'

First We Take Manhattan, Leonard Cohen

(Avatar by sherlockiangirl)
  •  

Nathan90

You can easily explain it to friends, tell them you're sick of the girls acting all childish if you enter 'their' restroom and that you're tired of explaining. My boyfriend and I (both ftm) told our friends that before we came out to them, they understood completely.
Instead of waiting for the storm to pass, learn to dance in the rain
  •  

mm

That is my fear meeting someone in the men's that knows me that I am not completely out too.  I try to use the men's room in areas where I have little chance of meeting someone I know but you never know.
  •  

Jasper

~Jasper~
  •  

nogoodnik

Quote from: Clive on September 08, 2011, 05:01:27 PM
My main concern would be explaining to my friends why I'm using the Mens' - I'm not really out to them yet
[...]
Also, there'd be the risk of encountering someone who knows me as a woman

This is my worry at the moment. I'm not out to more than a couple of people, and I don't even bind on a daily basis... but I've already had enough toilet awkwardness that I'm considering switching to using the Men's... but then I don't want a different variety of toilet awkwardness. I don't really pass consistently as either male or female at the moment.

Just this past week I had one woman in the Women's turn to me accusingly and look me up and down then sort of narrow her eyes at me like she was just barely "allowing" me to use the Women's toilet.

Then two days later I was heading to the bathroom and some middle aged man sort of held the Men's room door for me (it's a huge heavy door that opens outwards and could have slammed on me if I was going in there, so not as weird as it sounds) and I just shook my head awkwardly then headed down the other fork in the corridor... but then I was too nervous to go in the Women's in case he was looking, so I went around another corner into a sort of broom closet full of buckets, waited a few seconds, and then left the entire building to find another toilet...... yeah, I'm ridiculous, but I don't deal well with unexpected social awkwardness and I was getting kind of panicky.

Thankfully I haven't yet had any outright comments like this thread is supposed to be about... but yeah, obviously not fitting in in the Women's anymore, but worried about being seen entering/leaving the Men's by people who know me!
  •  

Cindy

" but worried about being seen entering/leaving the Men's by people who know me!

Nik,
This is the core of being yourself.
Cindy
  •  

Taka

using the mens' room should be safe for anyone, even the obviously female, and can easily be explained by urgency and a long line on the other side. no need to out yourself as transsexual even if you meet someone you know, and people who don't know you wouldn't dare ask your reasons
  •  

nogoodnik

Quote from: Cindy James on September 15, 2011, 03:18:14 AM
" but worried about being seen entering/leaving the Men's by people who know me!

Nik,
This is the core of being yourself.
Cindy

That is true!

I'm mainly worried about people who aren't so much friends as unpleasant gossips who know me who I don't want to give any more ammunition to... e.g. a couple of years ago my ex's sister started a rumour around town that I had AIDS, based on nothing, but a lot of people believed it and possibly still some do. I can't imagine the ridiculous spin she'd put on something like seeing me going into the Men's room, even though there are valid reasons even a cis woman might do that at some point.

That said... sooner or later (hopefully sooner) I will be coming out and they'll all know anyway... so perhaps if I look at it that way it won't seem as frightening.
  •  

N.Chaos

Quote from: Cindy James on September 08, 2011, 02:32:43 AM
She sounds a total bitch.
And Clive I think the writing is on the wall and it says. You look like a guy, You act like a guy. You are a guy. So use the guys toilets. :laugh:

Good luck in future encounters.
Cindy

^ Cindy speaks the truth.

Agreeing with Arch, too. The girl sounds like she's just one of those types.

I understand why you'd be pissed off though, I had something similar happen back in high school and it had me upset for quite a while.
  •