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The Men We Were: Do we hate them forever?

Started by sysm29, December 22, 2011, 02:26:51 AM

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Constance

I don't and can't hate my male self. He gave me two great kids and 23 years of marriage. While that marriage is ending, I still have a great friend in my soon-to-be-ex-wife.

I tried to fit in and fulfill my roles as son, brother, boyfriend, husband, father, uncle. I think I've done a decent job at some of those roles, and a not-so-decent job at others. I think father was probably the one I fulfilled the best.

And I agree with Axélle on this one. The idea of being able to embrace and comfort my male self and tell the poor bastard to not hate himself so much that he tried his best is a comforting concept. I might incorporate something along those lines in my baptism ceremony when my legal transition is done.

As Connie was always a part of my past as David, David will always be a part of me as Connie. I have a complicated relationship with my male past, but I can't say I hate it.

Joanna

Quote from: Axélle on December 22, 2011, 05:29:14 AM
No! I would NEVER want to hate him, but rather hug and comfort him. Really would.
This was one sad, valiant person that tried soooooo, so hard.
I have tears in my eyes when I say that. Just one misgendered person that didn't really cut it in the male world, much as she tried.
I'd do better as a hard nosed bitch in the same environment these days - pretty sure, when I say that.

Ditto for me.  I will always love Jamie as he was a lovely but lost soul.  He is part of who I am today and dont hate him.  I never want to be him again but he was special.

xx
Hey come and check me out here!!........
http://www.youtube.com/user/JennaArriving1 ;D
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Amazon D

Remember you were under the influence of testosterone which is a drug that was floating thru your body with no way to control it. That other person wasn't the real you. That was a drugged up person. If your free from T then you can be free to be yourself.. Then and only then can you know the new you.
I'm an Amazon womyn + very butch + respecting MWMF since 1999 unless invited. + I AM A HIPPIE

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0451

If I could speak of my male side as a separate person, then I don't hate my male self at all.  My male self was and is a pretty chill dude when the situation is right (though he was rather awkward for a long time growing up).  But I kinda feel like "he" is a face I put on when I'm around other people.  I mean yeah, he's there when I'm alone too, but it's far less pronounced.  When I'm alone I'm just myself, neither ultra femme or masculine.  And I guess "he" had some bad features as well- a nasty temper for one. 

But overall, I don't want to have a bonfire and burn all my male stuff or completely forget about my male self.  Despite some of his negative attributes, he had a lot of good things too, and he is a part of me.  I don't want to throw out the baby with the bathwater.  And I don't want to forget where I came from either.
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Mahsa Tezani

Quote from: Amazon D on December 22, 2011, 01:21:19 PM
Remember you were under the influence of testosterone which is a drug that was floating thru your body with no way to control it. That other person wasn't the real you. That was a drugged up person. If your free from T then you can be free to be yourself.. Then and only then can you know the new you.

I disagree. I think having both "T" and "E" is benificial.

I think being trans is more about duality...Not so much being one or the other. Because one is impossible, and the other isn't real.

I laugh at all the 'true selves" stuff. My trans side is as manufactured as my male side...It's just an issue of comfort for me, really.
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0451

Mahsa, would you say your trans side is more "real" than the male side, even if she is manufactured?  I mean I guess it's an interesting question on how one defines real.  Is what you are born with the ultimate definition of "real" or is it what you personally feel internally the more real part of the duality?  Are they both real in a sense as two sides of a coin?  I suppose it really does vary from person to person.
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Mahsa Tezani

Quote from: 0451 on December 22, 2011, 03:34:43 PM
Mahsa, would you say your trans side is more "real" than the male side, even if she is manufactured?  I mean I guess it's an interesting question on how one defines real.  Is what you are born with the ultimate definition of "real" or is it what you personally feel internally the more real part of the duality?  Are they both real in a sense as two sides of a coin?  I suppose it really does vary from person to person.

I think most of my trans personality comes more from my emulation of females I know, rather than having a genuine personality.

My boy personality was 100% Buddy Cole(Kids in the Hall character)

Therefore, neither side of me is real...
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Constance

My true self is something to laugh about? I guess I've been bitten by the disco shark.

Jeneva

Quote from: Mahsa the disco shark on December 22, 2011, 03:28:16 PM
I laugh at all the 'true selves" stuff. My trans side is as manufactured as my male side...It's just an issue of comfort for me, really.

Did you not just YET AGAIN say your way is the only way?  That may be true for you, but to apply it to all others is saying you know them better than themselves.  You may define yourself however you want, but you don't have the right to define the rest of us.

We HAVE to quit being so divisive, the only way we will ever be taken seriously is if we can stand together.
Blessed Be!

Jeneva Caroline Samples
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Joelene9

  I do not hate my male side.  I did my best not to deride him nor do the things in the past I saw the other men do that I would regret.  Most of the derision of my male side including threats of emasculation, came from others. 
  Joelene
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Jen61

I am the same, my body was always manly in a tomboy kind of way. I never developed a husky physic, yet I was strong and with a lot of stamina (still I am).

I never saw myself as a male, just sort of being forced to perform as one. Yes, the male indoctrination has paid and will continue to pay some dividends in the 'security" and "assertive" departments, yet the pain of the forced labor remains.

Jen61
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Mahsa Tezani

Quote from: Jeneva on December 22, 2011, 04:11:56 PM
Did you not just YET AGAIN say your way is the only way?  That may be true for you, but to apply it to all others is saying you know them better than themselves.  You may define yourself however you want, but you don't have the right to define the rest of us.

We HAVE to quit being so divisive, the only way we will ever be taken seriously is if we can stand together.

I don't really care what you do.

I was just talking about my perspective of my self.
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V M

I don't hate the guy, I just love the gal much better  :)  She's much more relateable
The main things to remember in life are Love, Kindness, Understanding and Respect - Always make forward progress

Superficial fanny kissing friends are a dime a dozen, a TRUE FRIEND however is PRICELESS


- V M
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Constance

But Mahsa you did say, 'I laugh at all the 'true selves" stuff.' That seems to come across as a bit contemptuous. Or, am I missing something?

I feel that since beginning transition I am discovering and living my true self. Why is this something to laugh about?

fionabell

Nah. I was awesome. I love who i was. I was just too gentle and beautiful to be a man. If all men were like how I was then it'd be a better world.
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MsDazzler

For now, he is locked away in the closet as I try to forge a new identity as a woman - but he will be always a part of me
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Jen-Jen

Quote from: Siobhan on December 22, 2011, 03:03:01 AM
Hmm aren't you really still one and the same?of course the outside changes..but its not like 2 different people inside is it?I've always thought its more like I'm playing a part pretending to be normal to everyone else
to me there is two, kinda like this......

Quote from: Keaira on December 22, 2011, 04:05:39 AM
In a way... yes! I hate him. He kept me locked away and hidden from the world. Yet, He did his best to protect me from harm. He was a good man and I know that many people miss him. But, John couldn't stand to keep me locked up anymore. And so he gently took my hand, stepped aside and let me free.
There was a sad look in his eyes when he did so. For he knew that I would be taking a very hard path in life. He knew that we would lose family and friends. And it hurt us both dearly. But he also knew that I would go on with his strength and stubborn determination. And I would forever be myself.
That's my romantic way of looking at it. ^_^
just beautiful and very romantic! great description!

I love the Man I was. He is wonderful! I wasn't locked away, I chose to lock myself up and let him lead and protect me. He is a great man, the man every girl wants to marry,he is a real prince charming, he is loyal, faithful, strong,compassionate, a hopeless romantic, a good Samaritan always helps those in need. He is my night in shining armor. But just as John, he couldn't keep me locked up any longer. He took quite a few blows to his armor, he faced the dragon for me, fought it and it cost him his life! But as he died he told me he loved me and that he had set me up well in life and that I can do this! That he had taken all the pain and hardache for me! He cleared the way! I miss him severly!

May be im just crazy, but its what I feel/know.
Don't judge a book by its cover! My lifes been like a country song! True love, amazing grace, severe heartbreak, buckles, boots n spurs! I 've been thrown off the bull a couple times, I keep getting up and dusting myself off! Can't give up on my happily ever after!
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Assoluta

As being male became familiar to me, and was the way that would keep people, in particular my family, happy. On reflection, it now feels like a separate entity, a close twin brother who I knew everything and anything about, as much as I knew about myself. I knew the only way I could find resolution was to part with this male part of my psychology, and it was this that many people did not understand. Many people would suggest that I could still do masculine things and that it didn't mean I had to be a typical woman, but this was not the crux of the matter at all. It was about letting go of that deep rooted psychology of who I used to be, and it was 'him' that was scared of transition, scared of dying, and yes, he had to die. Over several painful years I had to deconstruct him as my true self grew, it was as if he had taken care of me, would take care of me until he was gone and was wishing me well in my future, and was sad that he would never see it. I had to bereave him, grieve for him, and I cried on many nights over him. It may sound peculiar to talk about myself in the third person, but it is one way to illustrate how my limited human mind was able to come to terms with my gender. But was it a case of a complete loss of the male psychology and the transition into a female psychology? It wasn't, and I realised that the spirit of my old male self still exists within me as a memory, and that deep male psychology still swims around as a part of me from a distance, but how 'he' had been in his former form, as the dominant force, and being who I was, that part had to die.

What I have to say though also is that post op, even though my memories of course have not change, I think my perception of them has and now the memories of being physically male and embracing that psychology feel so distant that sometimes I question whether it happened at all. I can't "feel it" the way I used to but I can still remember, but from a more detached perspective as if it was the memory of a close friend.
It takes balls to go through SRS!

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Naturally Blonde

I have always been me, I never see myself as having been two people, I'm just me. I also haven't changed much at all and my persona and mindset is exactely the same as it has always been. I've always worn androgenous clothes and had long hair before transition. Conforming to a male stereotype lifestyle wasn't one of my strong points.
Living in the real world, not a fantasy
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GinaDouglas

We all walked a different road to get here.  So we all have our own processes to go through to reconcile our pasts.  In time, I think we all get more distance, a better perspective on who we were.  Hate the sin, love the sinner.  That's where I found peace with my past.
It's easier to change your sex and gender in Iran, than it is in the United States.  Way easier.

Please read my novel, Dragonfly and the Pack of Three, available on Amazon - and encourage your local library to buy it too! We need realistic portrayals of trans people in literature, for all our sakes
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