So, as I've said a few times,
I'm far enough into my transition that I've entered that gray area where some people have no idea what my gender is, and where about 60% of the people I encounter think I'm a male, and the other 40% or less, assume that I'm a female (Usually a pretty butch female) usually, this don't really cause any problems, it does however cause people I'm around some uneasiness when they're "Corrected" and told that I'm a "Girl,"

Truthfully, I'm dreading the idea of going into a public bathroom, but that's not exactly what this post is about.

It's about dressing rooms.

I've got an interview tomorrow, and I'll be going to buy a suit tonight because the attendant said "Business wear" I refuse to wear the female equivalent of a suit, and will be going into the interview presenting myself as a male.  However, frankly, the act of buying a suit has me scared because I know that I'll have to go try it on because I've never purchased a suit before and don't know what size I will need. I'm worried because some dressing rooms have attendants who check to see what you're carrying and how many items you have. Typically, dressing rooms are separated by gender, and I'm worried about going into either of them. I'm even worried to go into the girl's dressing rooms because I'm afraid that people will 'Mistake' me for a male and will freak out and think that I'm a pervert or something. Not to mention, yes, I'm worried about going to the men's side and people not believing that I'm a guy. I mean, technically, I could get in trouble for going to the male's side, and if I go to the girl's and there's any doubt, I could whip out my ID and prove to them that I've got a vag down there, but still >____O;

Any of you guys feel this worried about going to the dressing rooms. I know that bathrooms are worrisome, but there doesn't seem to be much fear of the dressing room. Maybe I'm just worrying myself to death over nothing?

Just go to a store that caters only to men.  Ie: Macy's Mens, Men's Wearhouse, Express Men (who also carry very small sizes that fit me great).  There's only one dressing room then, so even if they did think you were a super butch female, you can't get in "trouble" for using the only available dressing room.  This is what I usually do, although if I go to Target or another store with two dressing rooms, I usually use the men's anyway.  Just be confident and nobody will give you a hard time. 

Edit:  Also, be prepared to spend a lot... Suits, ties and the like tend to be awful pricey (ties especially, they can run from $25-$50 depending on the store and whether they're having a sale).  That surprised me the first time I went to get one.  Especially since the only place that has my size is Express Men and their stuff is WICKED expensive.  But good quality, so I felt it was worth it.

i have less trouble with the idea of using male dressing rooms.  going into a male bathroom freaks me out.  i want to use the guys' so badly but more often than not i chicken out.  i don't know what it is.  i mean it doesn't help that often there's only one or two stalls or that my first experience using a male bathroom (sainsbury's, with only one stall) it was disgusting.  blocked.  stank.  couldn't walk out and go into the girls'.  traumatic!

dressing rooms seem pretty simple in comparison.

Thanks you two,
I really appreciate your comments.

I didn't even think of that Malcolm,
And that's another thing that's got me worried.
I'm a pretty small guy too, dainty shoulders and all that >__O;
And in most dress shirts and such, even the smalls are usually too big.
Express has great clothes, but ugh, so expensive.

Gah, measurements,
That's one thing that I didn't even think of, thanks Bev!

Walmart would be great price-wise but if you're small like me their clothes will literally hang off you.  Express would be your best bet.  Their extra small is exactly to my measurements.  Expensive, yes, I almost had a tiny stroke when I saw my total.  But just get something in a neutral color that you'll be able to use for any occasion, and get your tie elsewhere! JC Penney has affordable ties.

DO NOT BUY A WALL MART SUIT!  If they even sell them.  Malcolm is right.  They are expensive.  (PS, the really good Italian ties are like $90)  Cheap suits look cheap, they wear cheap - just don't go there.  Suits are also something that are made to be altered.  It's highly doubtful that you could walk in and walk out with a good fitting suit.  The pants at the very least will require hems.  But usually they take in (or let out), the jacket too.  And your never going to be taking more than one suit at a time into the dressing room.  Where you are going to have problems is when the tailor starts to fuss with the suit while it's on you.  That, and asking which way you 'dress'.

The entire point of a suit is that it's tailored to your frame.  And go with standard business colors, like charcoal gray. 

Ooops, and thanks to you too, Schism.
I haven't used a male bathroom yet,
I go into ours at my work to clean it at the end of the day.
But since I work in a craft-store, the male restroom barely gets used so it's usually cleaner.


Totally off topic, but I will mention that women restrooms seem dirtier to me ._.;
And it's just gross when you go into one and there's blood on the floor.
Seriously girls, if you're going to drip all over the place, have the decency to clean it up.
I'm sick of mopping up mensie blood x____X;;


And Bev, hmmm, I suppose that could be a valid option,
But it seems to me that most Walmarts here are separated and have attendants by them.
And thanks for those tips, those will definitely help!

Malcolm, as much as I'd love to get a suit there,
I'm way too poor, I already have to dip into my school money just to buy it.
I'm justifying it because I'm taking a Communication class, and the teacher wants us to wear suits during presentations and what not,
But over $200 for the coat alone just isn't in the cards right now. And no kidding about those ties, $50...geeze, I'd rather get a $10 one from Walmart xD

Also, thanks to you too Tekla.
Don't know if I'll really have time to get it fitted though.
I wish that the interview wasn't so soon, but it was the only time and day they had available.

If Express is definitely out of the cards, then your best bet would be somewhere like JC Penney.  They usually have an attendant who will do measurements right there for you.  It'll probably fit big but unfortunately there isn't anywhere else that sells extra small suits for men that I know of.  If you have short arms and legs, you might fit a boys size too which would be wayyyy cheaper.

I find that slim ties look much better on people with smaller frames like me.

Also, what kind of interview is it? I find for most of the ones I've been on, a dress shirt and tie and nice pants and shoes has been more than sufficient.

EDIT: Sorry, just read that you need a suit for class too.  My bad.

Here's the deal.  If you are a professional woman you are going to have to have several suits.  Professional men tend to have 2 (one is on them, the other in the cleaners) with five shirts - you can get through a year like that.  In the long run it's cheaper.  Myself I always (3 times in my life now, and hopefully never again) always bought a suit and then got a second pair of matching pants, so that was even as the pants have to be cleaned far more often than the jacket.  And be prepared for 'sticker shock' - a cheap standard suit is going to run $400, good ones start at about $700.  That's at Macy type places, JC might have them for much less (suits, not the same brand).


I will mention that women restrooms seem dirtier to me ._.;
10-4 on that.  I ran maintenance crews in clubs and theaters, the woman's rooms almost always more messy.  And the richer the women, the worst they looked.  Men were pretty much the same across the board.

Thanks Malcolm, I'm browsing the JCP site right now. I know they're not the best suits, but when I get a better job, I plan on buying a better one. This just kind of needs to be something decent enough to get me through a few months xD And I'll definitely look at the boys sizes while I'm there. I usually have to shop in the 'Youth' department at most stores, or risk looking like a little kid who got into their dad's closet.

Slim ties, got it, didn't think of that either x__X;

Well, it's for Aflak, so it'll be an office job. She said 'Business attire' which I'm assuming is code for, "Where a suit, or don't come in,"
Hahaa, no worries!


Thanks again, Tekla!
Uggh, that's so much x__X
Crazy that they can charge so much for one outfit.

Hah! Finally someone who knows my pain of cleaning women bathrooms!

Hey, it is what it is.  And clothing is expensive.  And since they know that girls are buying clothing like they are breathing they can keep it cheap, but since guys only buy it on rare occasions they soak you for it.  But it evens out.  Good suits last and last and if you look at being able to use it for a decade, and if it's $900, then it's less than $100 a year (hell, most professional women spend that in a year on nylons alone).

It's not going to be possible to get all this on your first suit being an overnight deal, but keep it in mind as you watch and pay attention to what people in the real world are wearing and how they are wearing it.

First, you are 100% correct in assuming that 'Business wear' translates to 'suit' and not 'sport coat, Dockers and open shirt'.  A suit is a basic business uniform in the US.  And like all uniforms, the point is to be, well, uniform.  The same.  Indistinguishable at a distance.  Next one just like the last one.  Blend in, as opposed to standing out.  At that level your work and charming personality is supposed to make you stand out, not your suit.  Dressing to 'stand out' is poseur nation stuff anyway.  Not 'standing out' however is not to say that you can't look/be 'outstanding'.  And the right suit, worn correctly - can be outstanding.

Properly done, a good suit can do several things.  It can cover up and conceal a big pile of body mistakes, and they can also give an optical illusion that actually corrects some of those things.  For example (but not limited to): wide hips, big gut, sloping shoulders, height (some patterns make people look taller, some shorter, stripes for example).  You want to work with your salesperson (find a good one) and choose the right color, cut and fabric.

You want to get the lapels with the 'classic' measurements, not this years trendy 'wider or narrower' than classic, you want the standard business color suit which tends to be shades of gray and deep blues, for some people (and this has to do with their coloring) deep browns.  But unless it's some color-theory deal I'd even avoid the browns.  Black is out.  Black is for a) funeral attendants and morticians b) waiters c) ushers d) tuxes e)all of the above.  Really, black suits scream 'service industry' not business.  Gray is also easier to keep clean.

Stripes or no stripes depends on the effect you are going for.  I can live with chalk stripes (though not on me), but not pinstripes.

No vest.  3 piece suits went out a long time ago and haven't made a comeback.  Far too 'banker.'

This is my preference, but I'll state it go with suspenders.  Much better to wear with a suit than a belt, creates a better line, keeps the trousers at the exact right height.  And get simple one color suspenders, they stand out enough on their own without drawing more attention to them.

Tie - the tie is the deal.  In terms of a suit, wearing a suit - being a 'suit kinda guy' all of your creativeness, your statement to the world, your boldness, good taste, fashion sense and all that comes down to the tie.  That's why good ones are expensive.  Nothing looks cheaper than a cheap tie.  (Think Animal House: Nice tie!  Is that a clip-on?  Boon, come check this out.  Ninety percent rayon!  Very nice.)  If you are facing a choice of buying 3 $10 ties or one $30 tie - buy the one $30 tie.  Ties are like a secret guy cult - inner temple kind of stuff - its' a real 'cut of your jib' kind of flag to fly, it's also something the ladies notice too.  For sure on that.  The right tie really brings the look together.  Having one or two of the 'right' ones is far better than a collection of the on-sale at the K-Mart Fashion Barn ones.  {Here, I'll tell you one of my best secrets.  Dry cleaners often sell stuff that no one has ever claimed, and lot of those things are ties.  I've found some awesome picks for like 70% less than the "non-used, but still looks the same tie" at Macy's or Bloomies.  Hell, it's just been cleaned.  OK, there you go, check out dry cleaners}

- Macys' might be expensive but sometimes you get what you pay for, and part of the deal in Macy's is that they will be more than happy to help you find the perfect suit and get it tailored right - and they don't care who you are.  When you start to pay $700 for some clothing they (damn well better) treat you very differently.  Macy's also hires people who know something about what they are doing.  It's a huge help.

Oh yeah, a suit and that whole look is like a prom dress or a LBD cocktail dress - it takes time and practice to learn how to wear it right.  Wear it well.  So once you have your first one, you can use it for that - a training suit.  Create and invent excuses to wear it.  The more you wear it the more comfortable you feel in it, and that's the secret - you can't look uncomfortable (even if you are), and you can't look 'restricted' (even if you are).  But if you wear it enough you'll be able to ignore that stuff and you will look better in it at that point.



PS - don't forget the 'right' shoes.  The 'wrong' shoes are always a dead give-a-way.  You know that's how a lot of big city clubs rate the guys when they are deciding who to let in.  The shoes.  It's easy to go out and buy a trendy ->-bleeped-<-, but most guys won't have the cruel shoes to go with it.  It's a Bouncer trick

Quote from: GentlemanRDP on February 29, 2012, 09:59:40 AM
I'm a pretty small guy too, dainty shoulders and all that >__O;
And in most dress shirts and such, even the smalls are usually too big.

Try the boy's department if you have a tiny frame, I know a few GG's that buy their jeans from the boys department because they are built like pencils and women's jeans don't fit their boyish frames. I often take articles from the women's department to a men's department dressing room so that I don't get the "pervert" treatment since I'm genetic male. No-one should care, they just want to make the sale. I've been into women's departments and let a saleswoman know what I was looking for, they often enjoy helping and hand other items over the dressing room door for me to try. Just be you and don't let your own fears intimidate you.

Listen to the suit advice, but don't fret too much about getting a fancy one now. But don't expect this suit to look or wear well.

As for the changing rooms, just go into the men's. No one looks twice, and people care even less than with bathrooms. You're just walking down a corridor and going into a cubicle to try on something. I know it can be scary, but once you've done it a few times you'll forget what the fuss ever was. I've been using male changing rooms for a long time now, even when I was still presenting as female (admittedly butch), and I never encountered strange looks or trouble. Good luck!

I'll second most of the advice here.

Avoid Wal-mart's suites. I got my first one from there to have one and it looked terrible, didn't fit right. After one interview I was told I would do better on the next phase if I purchased a fitted suit. So I did some homework and found the guide I used to buy my second suit on Hudson's Guide for FTM's at http://www.ftmguide.org/suits.html. It has a lot of great info. I went to Men's Warehouse, bought their cheapest one (~$260 all totaled).

On the bright side, I love my new suit. I wear it for all my interviews and I'm 100% sure I pass in it. A good, fitted suit can do wonders for your confidence, even if you can only afford the cheapest one in the store.

I just bought my first suit as well, and I can attest that it really build your confidence! I only paid about 300 bucks for a shirt, tie, and suit from Kohls. Dunno if you have one of those by you, but it's similar to JC Penneys. They also have a website. Good luck man, hope you find a great suit!

Once on HRT, I've never been nervous about using the men's bathroom or dressing room. It just hasn't been too much of a problem for me.

I've used the guy's dressing room a few times and I have never had any problems. To me, I feel like guys really don't care about other people in the dressing room. They are there to do their business and then leave, kinda similar to the bathroom.

Back when when I was first starting to be open about my conscious desire to pass I was trying on Jeans in the mens dressing room at Macy's while my mom waited outside and she shouted my female name into the room when I was taking too long. I was scared ->-bleeped-<-less of what people were gonna do. I thought I got a weird look but who knows, nothing happened. These days I feel like people tend to be concerned with their own buying and selling of clothes, and let everyone else do they're own thing. You say you've been on T a while, how deep is your voice? A simple "I'm a dude." would shut anyone up if your voice passes. There's all sorts of androgynous looking guys out there these days, like that one male model.

For suits I'd advise figuring your sizes and brand preference and going to ebay or craigslist. Even if you screw up once or twice 'cause you can't try it on, it'll still be cheaper and better for the environment than buying new.

Per the thread title I have much more comfort in men's dressing rooms than men's bathrooms.

As far as ties go, I would suggest TJ Maxx/Marshalls (if you're in the US) as they tend to have a great selection of ties for $10-15 each. Mostly name brands too. Many of them are tacky but I can usually find a few in the bunch that are nice. Definitely worth sifting through them to save $20-30 per tie.

As far as dressing rooms vs bathrooms, I've always had a harder time with bathrooms... I still get nervous in them because I don't stp