Hey guys,
I really need to get some conversation going with others who have travelled the road I'm currently on (partners or those who've transitioned).

My partner is in the process of FTM transition (pre-op, pre-T) and I am a queer, female-born-but-happiest-to-live-outside-of-gender expectations person.  We are 31 and 28.  When we were first together I suspected that my partner had some gender exploration to do (days after our first date I asked about pronoun preferences because I just had a feeling...) and sure enough after a few months within the beauty and safety of this incredible relationship of ours, my sweetheart began to unravel his gender puzzle.  Although from right after our first time having sex, my partner was really communicative about having some big barriers around sex (a lot of anxiety, avoidance and "stuff" around it from a past of having a lot of inauthentic, pressured sex), we did make love every couple of weeks or so and when it did happen it was STUNNING.  Neither of us have ever felt so safe and close and loving with another person.  But as time went on after those first few months and we got to the point where he began slowly discovering his identity as a trans guy, his ability to engage with me sexually dropped off like a stone into water.  This is the love of my life (and his transition has no bearing on my certainty about this) and I truly, honestly support and understand the space that he needs to navigate this incredibly complex inner journey.  He has my total support in needing not to engage sexually.  My mind understands this.  His body doesn't feel like it's his, he has so much to figure out for himself, let alone trying to figure out what his relationship to sex looks like and how to then share that with me... And I work on my own stuff as best I can because I want to avoid creating an environment of expectation or pressure.  Frankly, I've learned some new things about myself sexually since if I'm really turned on I have to just take care of that myself.
But it's the intimacy.  The sharing of that deeply personal, vulnerable kind of love that I hold for him.  I can f^%& myself.  I can't make love with my soulmate with myself.  And I'm really struggling with some of the emotions that come along with this.
My partner has recently really been able to articulate to me that this has NOTHING to do with a lack of attraction or even a lack of desire, but that it's so much about his body and gender-related stuff.  We had sex once in February and before that the last time was the end of October.  I'm feeling really alone.  We cuddle a lot, there is so much affection between us, but I desperately miss even just enjoying passionate kisses or sexually-infused body contact.  To my surprise, as someone who has very little history mustering any sexual attraction toward men, I am SO turned on by his authentic self and am perfectly happy to want him like a man - not trying to hang on to loving him like a woman (though I really dislike all the binary ideas and labelling, but I'm just trying to make my point).  I will continue to support this process by keeping free of expectations of him and holding absolute space for the truth of his process with sex.  I also hold space for my own side of this and the understanding that my experience is real.  We do have a dialogue about where things are at because there is a lot of passion between us and this is not a "dead" topic.  What I recognize I need is some understanding, active support outside of just reminding myself that he means it when he tells me, basically, "it's not you, it's me".  I need to talk with others who have been through this and seen the other side.  Thanks so much <3

Hello,
I've only been on this site for a day, so I hope that my response is OK. I am a gay male spouse of an FTM who is currently on T but has not had any surgeries yet. There is, of course, no magic panacea for such things as sex in a relationship, especially a relationship that's undergoing a noticeable change. Think of more, pardon the term, traditional straight couples. When there are big changes in the relationship (new jobs, new kids, illness, etc.), sex if often one of the first things pushed off to the side. Bottom line for most people, it's a luxury, not a need. However, in a committed ongoing relationship, the importance factor should be addressed. It may not be fair to yourself to ignore what you think is important sexually (or perhaps in terms of emotional and physical intimacy, rather than just sex) because your partner is undergoing a transition. Although they are going through a big change, that doesn't mean  you're not part of the equation, and just shouldering the burden and suffering in silence may cause some damage to the long term relationship.

One other thing I would take into consideration is your age. You give no indication in your post how old you or your partner are, and that may be an important factor. If you're 20 and sex just ain't happening, that could be a real problem. If you're a little older, maybe it's just not as much on your partner's radar? Also, if there's a gap in your ages, it may be worth addressing.

Anywho, I don't know if this is of any use, but I wish you well in your relationship, and for your happiness in general. Cheers!

This sounds a bit like one of the 'Lesbian Bed Death' chapters in some of the books I have been reading to get up to speed on being  Lesbian after so many years of trying to be a straight guy.  My ID has changed, but being with a man just has no  appeal at all.
Maybe you can use some of those ideas, like drawing up a contract to have sex of some sort on set days.  The idea is that once you get back into it on a regular basis, you realise you actually like it and start having it more frequently.
If you can get him to try it, something like that might work.  Hope it does, that way at least one of us will be getting some. 

Karen.

Joe, thanks for your input.  I'm 31 and my partner is 28.  I like the analogy of other significant life changes that can happen in a relationship and likening it to this.  That makes some sense to me.  I know that my partner has an interest in having sex with me, but I know that he is feeling so out of place in his body (being pre-T and pre-op) and is thick in the process of working on reconciling that.  We do have a dialogue about sex and I don't feel like I'm suffering in silence.  My partner is very aware of my side of this journey as I feel like my experience is also very important to hold space for.  One of the things we really appreciate about our relationship is our ability to communicate.  This isn't a subject we talk about all the time (because that would really create a hard environment for both of us!) but every 2-3 weeks, it seems, we do have some level of dialogue about where things are at.  There is definitely a lot of passion between us but his experience requires a very inward focus and as I said, so much sorting out about body and gender really doesn't leave much space for the physical letting go that happens when you make love.  I think it's just one of the really hard bits of this where we both have equally real experiences and needs and they're not aligned with each other.  That's why I just really need to connect with folks who have been through this and have hopefully come out the other side to find a healthy relationship with sex again

Karen, thanks for your post.  I've definitely been in relationships where the sex has just sort of fallen by the wayside and when the girlfriend and I would agree to just "giving it a try" more often, we'd get into it and get back into the habit, so to speak.  I know that in this case, the whole scene is so completely different.  I think the 'Lesbian Bed Death' phenomenon that people like to analyze also happens in het relationships and is really a matter of falling into a routine of over-familiarity.  Sex is very much a body/mind/spirit kind of event and when one of the participating members is having their world turned on end when it comes to their body & mind, it makes sense that there can be just no place from which to engage those things with their partner.  If we made a contract to have sex, it would be an experience that was brought by duty and guilt rather than by passion and love.  My partner has spent pretty much the entirety of his sexual experience before our relationship playing a role of some kind or doing it out of a sense of duty.  I'm not interested in being another person with whom that happens.  I could never have sex with him just for the sake of "getting some" when I know what the psychological/emotional cost of that would be right now. 

So folks, does this resonnate with anyone else?  How did you find your way back into your sex life?  Thanks <3

I went to a transgender support group last night. It was a very mixed group (mtf, ftm, non-binary, and SOs).

From what I understand, this is not so uncommon. You love the person you love and it doesn't matter re: gender. There were a few other people identifying as lesbian who seemed perfectly ok now that they were "straight". Love is love-- you love the person himself not some arbitrary label.

BTW, not that you aren't welcome here, but there is a Significant Other support subforum.

--Jay Jay

Thanks for your post.  I did have this posted in the SO forum but I think I may get more valuable feedback here.  I don't have any discomfort about loving my trans partner.  None of that is even remotely an issue.  What I really hope, though, is that folks who have experienced this halt in their sex lives during this process will speak to their experience a bit and perhaps talk with me more about how being within that process felt, how it began to chance, and (I hope) to report that they were able to fall into a healthy sex life with their partner.  Thanks so much for any contributions to this!!

I have merged the two posts so that all the responses are in one place.

I'm kinda jealous that you two had amazing, intimate experiences in the past. Still haven't gotten to that point myself. Every experience I've ever had has been miserable because of my inability to "be okay" with myself. For decades now I've convinced myself that I can't ever have that so I pretty much became my own self-fulfilling prophecy. I'm a few years older than you guys, but I really wish I could have found someone earlier on that I could truly connect with and feel comfortable with.

It's kinda sad that your partner has drawn back, when you've already had those experiences. Yes, having your mind evolve about your own gender can (and does) trip you up, but in your case, there shouldn't be that anxiety-ridden trauma to have to hurdle over again. You both already know how it CAN be. And you're fluid and open enough to roll with his changing identity. I envy having someone like that, right there, ready for you.

I can't really think of any good advice but to just maybe share this with him. It sounds like he's got nothing to worry about with being with you again. Maybe look at it as a rediscovery of self, or experiment with different things to bring back the comfort level on his end. 

Hi PedalHead, I'm more or less in the same situation, although reversed.I also hate labels, but for the purposes of explanation, I will use them. I am FTM in process of transition, starting hormones in July, and my girlfriend would be what you would call "a straight biological female". She is a less sexual person, (not because of how she's born or how I was born or anything just because) and I'm more of a sexual person. We haven't had extremely large gaps of no sex, but we don't have it as often as I would like. It's not because of how I am biologically or anything, she's just not as sexual as some people. When we do engage, it's amazing.  And we're like you in which we are affectionate though sometimes I do feel lonely. But what I've noticed is, we "get off" more on engaging on normal recreational things obviously outside of the bedroom. Try to ask him if you could possibly initiate a few more times than you do. She and I talk about it very frequently that way if I'm feeling a little down, she understands it's not her fault, but I am feeling the way I do. Communication is key because sometimes, unknown/unexpected resentment can build up. You don't have to push it, or force it, but in a way, just put your feelings out there. If anything, I would show him this post. He is very lucky to have a girl who is understanding with transition, sex, emotional etc. I've dated some major evil women lol, and meeting the girl I'm with now has completely changed. You must communicate your feelings though. And if you do, then I would just wait a bit. One other thing my girlfriend and I fight about would be pre- t. We are both anticipating it greatly because I might not be so, harsh on myself/self degrading when I feel fully charged with the testosterone I lack! Hormones could change his view on himself, surgery, maybe even just researching FTM transition things together. Just keep your head up and if you need anything, feel free to message me anytime! My girlfriend may even discuss her lack of sexual desire with you which may help you out in a way as well. Good luck!

Insideontheoutside and AlexanderReese thank you very very much for writing.  To be honest, I've been logging in a lot today really needing to hear from some folks who get where I'm coming from.

I would say that the hardest thing about this for me is that even though we do have our amazing shared experiences of the past and I know he understands the level of love and safety he has in me, it is a topic that is so hard to even discuss, let alone trying to figure out physically.  He told me the other night that when he can tell that I'm interested in something physical (because I touch him differently or plant more kisses on his skin or *whatever* gives me away) it feels like pressure.  I have explained many times so that he can keep hearing it, that I don't have expectations.  He doesn't "owe me" sex and he's not failing by not engaging with me like that.  I have also explained that this is really hard for me beacuse it feels like a rejection of this vulnerable and very deep kind of love and that I struggle with feeling unworthy of love, unattractive, unf*able... But it's really clear from both what he's said and how he reacts when the subject comes up, that just talking about it causes more defenses around the subject.  I would love to suggest that we try to engage in things like just enjoying kissing eachother passionately or finding pleasurable ways of engaging some light level of sexuality without involving triggering things like genital sex.  I think it would help to try dipping the toes in that pond, so to speak, with really clear boundaries around how that would/wouldn't progress.  But I can't even imagine how I could bring that up without him totally shutting down.  He has said having that experience (shared intimacy) is just not where he's at.  It's shifting and he's learning more about this in himself, but it's not shareable right now.  I don't know if showing him my original post will make a difference because everything I wrote is something I've said to him.  In November we saw a counsellor together - amazing transman who specializes in gender and sexuality - but it was WAAAYYY too early in the process to be there.  My partner had barely begun to scratch the surface of the gender journey.  I am trying to think of a way to ask him if we can go back again now that so much has fallen into place.  I'm also thinking of seeing this counsellor again on my own for some advice.  I want to believe that we'll some day find ourselves in a healthy, satisfying sexual relationship because in my own experience I have never felt so willing to be open and fun and deep and explorative.  I want to share that with my darling.  Keep the convo coming... I can't tell you how helpful it is to even just be able to talk about this openly.  *thank you so much*

No problem PedalHound! I know how it is just to need someone there to talk to.
Therapy may not be a bad option. My girlfriend and I are in a rough place and she keeps insisting that we go see my therapist to talk about them. (my therapist handles gender identity disorder and couples counseling) i tell her id prefer not to mix the two, but she feels very comfortable considering this therapist knows all about us already.
shes even welcome to call my therapist anytime SHE needs to talk to her lol not just me. and i told her if that's what she'd like to do thats fine.
i would just, not only let him read your original post but all of the replies as well. let him know you're trying. i have to say i went through a period where i felt very odd having sex with women when i was sort of, at the "beginning" so to say of my transition. i never let women touch me. or go under my clothes. but, with a long term serious relationship, it's been much easier to do so. im very shy even with clothes off! but i managed to let myself take a shower with my current girlfriend (lights off granted) but she loved that i trusted her enough to do that.
everything is different for everyone. he might like i said earlier, just need to start hormones, or need to explore/speak with a therapist before, even have surgery before he feels comfortable.
some people love sex more than they hate their parts (as ive heard plenty of times on here lol) and some people would rather have surgery to fulfill what they feel as if they need, even if it means, no actual sexual pleasure from it. don't blame yourself. dont shut down, dont feel hurt. just try to stick by his side because that will go very far in the end. where are you guys from? the states? out of the us? where i live, i have one of the BEST therapists ive ever  had. you may just need a realllly good couple/sex therapist.

I don't -quite- know if this is your boyfriend's case, but dysphoria surrounding my lower and upper areas will almost always make sex horrible for me, even in a "safe" space. When I've been with people in the past, I've felt gross and generally sickened at the thought of my own body and could not focus on anything else because I was caught up in a lot of self-loathing and discomfort. You guys have had good experiences in the past, and that's great! It's totes possible for your sex life to pick up again, but I think the best you can do now is sort of back away from the sex issue and let him know that you're open to listening to him if he needs that. He might feel "pressure" in the sense that you'll be disgusted with him as his transition progresses or leave him or only focus on parts of his body that he doesn't want to think about. Depression and dysphoria can really do horrible things to your self esteem and sex drive. :/

As much as it sucks, I'd give him time and let him come to you if/when he's ready to try again. If you let him know that you won't force him to do anything or that you're open to listening to his thoughts on the matter, he might feel better about trying again.

Hello, Pedal, and welcome to Susan's. I'm fairly new to the site myself however I can attest to the fact that this is an amazing place filled with people from all walks of life with an abundant amount of experience. I'm incredibly happy to see that you have joined us here and are obtaining helpful perspectives here already. 

I am a straight FTM who recently began transition; I'm on my third week on testosterone. I am fortunate to be on this journey with an amazingly supportive partner who has been by my side for the past six and a half years. Although I have just recently begun transition, this has not been the start of my journey. Like your partner, I too went through my own journey of self-discovery. Something that is so incredibly profound and personal that not many people can truly understand unless they have walked this path as well. However, it appears that you are doing everything you could with your love, support, encouragement and patience. Although I cannot speak for everyone, for me, my partner's support has been a blessing.

But the journey is not easy for either party. Although us guys do have our personal paths to travel, you as a partner have your very own path to thread. When my girlfriend and I first met I identified as stone butch... extremely stone. Which meant I had very rigid rules and boundaries when it came to physical contact and intimacy. Our sex life was good and very pleasurable, however the more I began to look inside the less our intimacy became in terms of physical intimacy. My sex drive plummeted, severely. Sex simply was not something that was on my mind and it had absolutely nothing to do with her or my attraction to her. She is an incredibly beautiful woman whom I've always desired. But like your partner tells you, it wasn't her - it was me. But although she was(is) incredibly understanding, it is still something that I knew was incredibly difficult on her. I think it may simply be human nature to feel that sense of loneliness, rejection, etc. We as human beings crave intimacy and having a lack of is going to undoubtedly effect us. I know that it was a very difficult blow for her because our attraction for one another is intense, always has been. But there was a point where there was no sexual intimacy for over six months at a time.

If you are interested I will ask her if she would mind me sharing her email with you and you could talk over this with her as well if you'd like to get her perspective since it seems you are now in the place she was. 

I like the suggestion that some people have made about maybe discussing the possibility of making out and sharing that form of intimacy without it going "all the way" because it may set him at ease. I know that when my girlfriend would get close and I got the sense that she wanted "more" it did make me uncomfortable which turned to guilt. It wasn't an easy journey to go through by any means but like you and your partner, it wasn't a matter of lack of love but simply due to my own personal struggle and growth.

If this is indeed the same situation then from my experience I would like to offer you one word of advice: hang in there. The more comfortable I became in my masculinity and gender identity, the more I was able to then turn to my comfort in my sexuality. First I had to accept myself for the man inside and try to somehow become comfortable with my body and it's parts. Although this part is different for every guy, for me it was about coming to terms with my body as a sexual vessel. We tend to genderize sexual organs but I came to a point where I was able to not see certain parts as female parts but simply sexual organs. And I began to grow more comfortable with my body and the sex picked up.

And... one more thing to keep in mind... if he does go through with transition and begin HRT then rest assured this will likely change. The first week after my initial injection things were normal in regards to my sex drive. My sex drive has never been something I called high or even 'normal' if there is such a term that can be applied to this. But this past week the hormones have certainly kicked in. My sex drive is through the roof and my selfless, considerate girlfriend has been kind enough to be there for me (chuckles). Even if it has meant two, or three, times a day. We were actually just joking about the fact that she is going to bed and looking forward to work tomorrow because she needs a break, lol.

So hang in there, Pedal. I respect you so very much for your dedication and obvious love you have for your partner. It is so very commendable. From a guy who has gone through this journey and is still going down a foreign path, you are doing everything right.

When my partner would bring up the topic we were able to talk about it openly. Maybe bringing it up to him with these ideas won't be such a bad idea, the biggest thing for me was to know that it wasn't her expressing unhappiness, unfulfilled needs or disappointment towards me. Because those things were always on the back of my mind, that feeling of guilt because I did feel bad that I could not meet those needs. However she was so incredibly understanding and reassured me that she understood. I was able to see it as the facts, that there was simply a physical need. And we talked about it when she needed to, we listened to each other and got through it step by step, day by day.

I hope this helps some.

- Nico

AlexanderReese, we're not in the US.  I do often wonder if things will feel less on hold once he starts T or gets top surgery.  We do sleep naked and there is a lot of contact with each other's bodies but the whole picture of sex is a different ball game.  I think I will probably go talk to that counsellor again on my own and just take it one step at a time.  That may be great for me and I may not need to ask my partner if he's ready to go together.  I'm glad for you that you're able to find trust with your girlfriend and start to build that intimacy there too.  The more I read on here, the more I appreciate hearing about supportive couples during this unique time in life!

Zerro, Thank you.  I know that your advice is very much in line with my partner's reality.  These are all things I know to be true for him (the benefit of me just not engaging or expecting any sexuality from him) and hearing it from you too is also helpful.  It de-personalizes it because you don't even know me!  My emotions can't take what you're saying personally and what I need to do is remove my heart from this, basically.  I need to believe in my heart all of the words my partner says to me (that I'm attractive, "hot", adored etc etc) and hearing it from YOU helps in some way to get just a little bit closer to helping my emotions believe it. I know the pressure he's talking about is feeling like/worrying that he's failing me or he's in the wrong because he's not able to get to that place with me and that he "should" be different.  I don't feel any of those things, but that's what happens with really sore subjects - we filter them through the lens of our own fears.  I know that's where my obstacle lies too.  I can hear all of his words, but I still filter it through my own fears and issues.  He's doing the same.  So his feeling pressured is a reflection of his fear of pressure.  I do believe he knows that his transition, his changing body, will not hurt *us*.  I am SO attracted to HIM.  I am attracted to his heart and soul, I'm attracted to his body now, and I'm attracted to the changes that I know will come.  Heck, he made a comment yesterday about "just wait till I'm on T! Then I'll show them..." in this funny fake tough-guy way and I blushed instantly and couldn't hide my smile.  He admitted to doing that because he knew he'd get that reaction.  Anyway, I'm on a tangent now

Nicolas, you were typing while I was writing the above two responses.  I went back to read the new reply and I wish I could reach through the screen and hug you.  I have tears streaming down my cheeks from... I'm not entirely certain... possibly just complete and utter relief.  Among the beautiful trans men I know and count as dear friends, there just hasn't been too much difficulty with sex in their lives.  I have felt so scared because there hasn't been anyone who could say to me, 'That sounds just like my story and for us it got better'.  Everyone is different and same stories can have different endings but given the circumstances and the feelings of loneliness and rejection that can manifest here, simply not feeling alone has done so much for my soul - in just minutes.  I can't thank you enough for taking the time to write all of that.  Yes, I would love it if your partner felt comfortable sharing her email address.  It would be fabulous to talk.  I can't even think of more to say except to express my gratitude.  I hope to hear from you guys soon <3

Quote from: PedalHound on June 19, 2012, 10:41:32 PM
Nicolas, you were typing while I was writing the above two responses.  I went back to read the new reply and I wish I could reach through the screen and hug you.  I have tears streaming down my cheeks from... I'm not entirely certain... possibly just complete and utter relief.  Among the beautiful trans men I know and count as dear friends, there just hasn't been too much difficulty with sex in their lives.  I have felt so scared because there hasn't been anyone who could say to me, 'That sounds just like my story and for us it got better'.  Everyone is different and same stories can have different endings but given the circumstances and the feelings of loneliness and rejection that can manifest here, simply not feeling alone has done so much for my soul - in just minutes.  I can't thank you enough for taking the time to write all of that.  Yes, I would love it if your partner felt comfortable sharing her email address.  It would be fabulous to talk.  I can't even think of more to say except to express my gratitude.  I hope to hear from you guys soon <3

She is curled up in bed sleeping right now but I have sent her the link and explained the post in email so by tomorrow I will get in touch with you and let you know. 

Thank you!! 

I also want to invite anyone else for whom this situation resonnates, to discuss or share.  It's amazing to have access to such a generous community of people!  I have a feeling this thread will be helpful to others too. 

hope things get better

It is amazing what community support can do. And I am so happy to see you finding a place to voice your thoughts and concerns.