I have just finished my first week of being on hormones. I have a few questions for others who are doing the same or have done the same. **I know many ofyou will say: Consult your doctor! I know this and agree it is wise to do so. But, there is some information that can only be found from others who have gone or are going through the same process.

About me:
Age 28
White
Thin build
Family has history of large breasts (mother sister, and grandmother had to have reductions)

Effects so far:
Breast tenderness = 0
Breast growth = 0
nipple tenderness = 0
Headaches = minor and not frequent
Cramps in my calf and thigh = minor but frequent

Questions:
1) Are the effects I have had so far normal?
2) For you, how long was it before you first started to feel breast tenderness?
3) How long before things went limp downstairs?
4) How long before you visually saw breast growth or nipple growth?

Thanks for the information! 
There arent any people I can really talk to about this except you all.

Hi,

Self-medicating can easily end your life.
..................
I got 1 size per year and tender immediately.

I felt they never grew any.

I eat a lot of protein and am not slight.

I think expecting noticable results in one week is a bit much to ask for.  You were correct when you said we would probably suggest asking your doctor about this issue.  Expectations should have been discussed with your doctor before they put you on hormones.

Sarah L.

Quote from: dlh1978 on April 17, 2007, 09:44:25 AM
1) Are the effects I have had so far normal?

Pretty much.  Not much usually happens in the first week.

Quote from: dlh1978 on April 17, 2007, 09:44:25 AM
2) For you, how long was it before you first started to feel breast tenderness?

It may have been within the first month.

Quote from: dlh1978 on April 17, 2007, 09:44:25 AM
3) How long before things went limp downstairs?

Well, mine was "limp" most of the time even before HRT, but even now after almost 15 months on HRT, it still has the ability to be unlimp, although it's just a bit more challenging.

Quote from: dlh1978 on April 17, 2007, 09:44:25 AM
4) How long before you visually saw breast growth or nipple growth?

I had some significant development during the first 3 months.  It continued to grow steadily until around 6 months, then seemed to slow way down.  After 1 year, I got my blood tested and my doctor had to increase my hormones to get the T levels down.

Quote from: dlh1978 on April 17, 2007, 09:44:25 AM
1) Are the effects I have had so far normal?

Everyone react differently. There really isn't a "normal"

Quote2) For you, how long was it before you first started to feel breast tenderness?

By the end of the first week they itched and hurt.

Quote3) How long before things went limp downstairs?

Dunno. Haven't tried to do anything with IT for well over a year.

The night/morning annoyance stopped within a month.

Quote4) How long before you visually saw breast growth or nipple growth?

Breast budding (just FELT them, not saw them) at around 3 weeks I think. Started seeing "puffiness" shortly thereafter. As Melissa said, they tend to grow in phases.

As for self-medicating, DON'T. Everyone thinks, "it can't happen to me!" Yea, well guess what? My liver enzyme levels have been steadily rising since starting HRT (eventually possibly indicating liver damage). It's not dangerous yet, but if they keep climbing for another year at this rate... I shudder to think what would happen if this wasn't being monitored by a doctor.

And if you're prone to blood clotting - something only your doctor and blood tests can reveal - you could die of an embolism or blood clot in the legs.

And then there's potassium poisoning...

And lack of sodium...

And an increase in sugar levels...

And...

HRT is scary stuff.

~Kate~

Because I'm diabetic, I started on a low dose of Estradiol and spironolactone.  Breasts started to ache after a month, month and a half.  Night and moring annoyances didn't stop until the doctor allowed me to increase my spiro four months after I started.  Breast growth became apparent after about 2/3 months, but I had some breast tissue to begin with.

YMMV of course.  I started HRT in September of '06 and I'm about an A cup now.

There's a good article on HRT in our WIKI, check it out!

hugs & smiles
helen

Quote from: dlh1978 on April 17, 2007, 09:44:25 AM
I have just finished my first week of being on hormones. I have a few questions for others who are doing the same or have done the same. **I know many ofyou will say: Consult your doctor! I know this and agree it is wise to do so. But, there is some information that can only be found from others who have gone or are going through the same process.

About me:
Age 28
White
Thin build
Family has history of large breasts (mother sister, and grandmother had to have reductions)

Effects so far:
Breast tenderness = 0
Breast growth = 0
nipple tenderness = 0
Headaches = minor and not frequent
Cramps in my calf and thigh = minor but frequent

Questions:
1) Are the effects I have had so far normal?
2) For you, how long was it before you first started to feel breast tenderness?
3) How long before things went limp downstairs?
4) How long before you visually saw breast growth or nipple growth?

Thanks for the information! 
There arent any people I can really talk to about this except you all.

It has only been one week.  From everything I heard it varies from person to person, and many of the physical effects take several months and for the most part years.
How fast they act is completely dependant on your own personal body chemistry.

Also don't self medicate, it is very poor idea for a number of reasons.

Quote from: dlh1978 on April 17, 2007, 09:44:25 AM
**I know many ofyou will say: Consult your doctor! I know this and agree it is wise to do so. But, there is some information that can only be found from others who have gone or are going through the same process.

Wow, how did you know?  Exactly!  The best thing for you to do is to consult your physician.  Besides, people can only share their personal experiences and needless to say the effects of HRT depend mainly on genetics and the type of hormones dispensed.    If you're looking for general information, you may try this link in our wiki. 

tink

DON'T SELF MEDICATE, HRT SHOULD BE DONE ONLY WITH MEDICAL SUPERVISION. Now that that is said results are going to cary amongst the individuals, with the individuals body chemistry. Ack I sound like a broken record repeating the above. Results take time, think years total. As far as what happens when will depend on the dosages of what specific meds and the individuals bodies reaction to them.
     Here is something I don't remember the others asking. Where did the headaches and leg cramps start coming from? That should be looked into ASAP.
Rashelle

Leg cramps can come from dehydration.  Headaches too, I suppose.  Spironolactone is a diuretic so if the dosage is too high, or if the person doesn't drink enough fluids, dehydration can result.  Muscle pain and headaches can come as a result of liver damage too.

Spiro, while it is a diuretic, does not lower the potassium level in the blood so it can, and often does, rise.  Once again, how much it rises depends on the individual and the dosage.  Too much potassium in your blood stream will kill you.

If you have not yet seen a doctor, dlh, then I suggest you go to one very soon and ask them to write an order for blood tests.  You don't have to tell the doctor that you're taking hormones but it would be a very good idea that you did.  They can't treat you properly if they don't know what you are taking and their treatment, along with the unforseen reactions with HRT can damage or kill you too.  Your symptoms could be signs of something serious.  I hope they aren't though,

hugs & smiles
helen

General MtoF HRT time-line:

First 6 days - There should be no noticable effects.

Next 6 weeks - Breast tenderness.  Ouch!  Tanner stage 2 achieved.

Next 6 months - Breast development become noticable.  Tanner stage 3 achieved.

Next 6 years - Breasts develope to their full extent.  If you are lucky, Tanner stage 5 reached.

Quote from: HelenW on April 17, 2007, 09:33:22 PM
Leg cramps can come from dehydration.  Headaches too, I suppose.  Spironolactone is a diuretic so if the dosage is too high, or if the person doesn't drink enough fluids, dehydration can result.  Muscle pain and headaches can come as a result of liver damage too.

Spiro, while it is a diuretic, does not lower the potassium level in the blood so it can, and often does, rise.  Once again, how much it rises depends on the individual and the dosage.  Too much potassium in your blood stream will kill you.

Calcium and potassium oppose each other.  Too much potassium can sometimes cause effects that are the same as too little calcium.  Make sure you are getting enough calcium, and ask your doctor to check your electrolytes.

Lets see leg cramps can also be caused my sodium deficiency, potassium deficiency, dehydration, magnesium? deficiency, and one or two other things I can't think of at the moment. Sodium, potassium, and dehydration are all things that need to be watched with HRT. So a informed Dr. should be consulted. And by informed I mean that HRT should be under supervision.
Rashelle

Yes, and they can also be caused by blood clots, which is really dangerous.  Not to be ignored.

There are other dangers out there too. My blood tests showed one month that my calcium went up so high that I could have become pretty ill. My liver function is a bit different too and that had to be looked at (luckily, no worries).

My breasts could be noticed before I started HRT. However, they started showing change at the third week mark and slowly grew over the course of a few years. YMMV, consult a doc for a blood panel at the least.

It's very different for everyone.


When I started I was heavy, having still being injured from a bicycle accident.  In one year I went from a slender 31" waist at 192 lbs to a 44" waist at 315 lbs.   Realize too that I'm nearly 6'6" tall.

In the fourth week my nipples got very sensitive and stayed that way for about a month, then the sensitivity started to go away for a time then come back, usually in several week swings.  Now they are slightly sensitive and have been that way for about six months.

I did notice that once I started to exercise again and changed my diet to basically fruits and veggies with sushi every couple of days that changes were more pronounced and the sensitivity was increased again.

Smoking and poor diet will seriously inhibit the effects.

Now at one year of HRT (injections) I'm back down to a 31" waist and my bust is a small B.  My body fat is less than 4% at the moment.  I actually need to add some body fat in the future in order to get the fat placement around the hips and hopefully elsewhere to more feminize the physique, but I'm not too concerned with that for about another year yet.  My goal now is to cut muscle mass, especially in the legs, chest and arms to more of female level.  To illustrate it better - my thighs are still (after a year of cardio/aerobic (baiscally jogging ten miles a day) I still have 34" thighs and 23" calves.  My chest is still at 52".

So really you have to consider much more that breast development - you have to take the entire physique in at once and work on it from the very beginning.  the breasts will grow as they are genetically pre-disposed to and you won't know the full potential until around the third year of HRT.  So focus on the other things, creating the rest of the body, the voice, the walk, the stature and mannerisms.  Work on hair removal and hair length.  You have a lot to do and most of it is in your control.  Breast development is completely out of your control no matter what anyone tells you.

PS.

My HRT is carefully monitored by a Physician and Transgender Specialist and by an Endocrinologist.
The diet is monitored and prescribed by two other doctors, one a Nutrionalist and the other an Exercise Physiologist.

- The Mazzoni Center in Philadelphia, PA.
          Dr. Robert Winn
          Dr. Melanie "MO" Santiago

This is the greatest resource for the region.  It is an LGBT primary care facility with a Transgender Specialty.  Charges are on a sliding scale based on what you can afford - no one is turned away - ever.

Quote from: Lisbeth on April 18, 2007, 10:49:37 AM

Next 6 weeks - Breast tenderness.  Ouch!  Tanner stage 2 achieved.

But what a wonderful "ouch" it is.

I just wanted to give you all a progress report and update you on what has been happening. I had a few questions too.

I saw my doctor and he approved my regimen...although I got a lecture about self medicating, but he was glad I came in to make sure all my internal workings were all working ok. And they are. Everything is spiffy. Turns out my worries about all the side effects of HRT were causing side effect symptoms to manifest through a kind of hypochondria paranoia. But now, the symptoms have all gone away...thank goodness. I am breathing much easier now. Doc said the progesterone was useless and to just stick to the Spiro + Estrogen I have been taking. I have not had any bad side effects from the progesterone, and have heard so much that it really does help in better female development. Any of you have positive words to say about it from experience?

Progress has been VERY surprising. I have been on hormones now for 3 weeks. I wasn't expecting to see or feel results until after maybe 2 or three months. My nipples have been very sore and perky 24-7 ever since day 4. Now they are no longer standing up on top but rather have changed to cone shape perkiness with the areola raised too. Small bumps around the outer rim of the areola have perked up too...will these be permanent? I have notices the areola has spread outward just a smidgen. Today I felt a hard lump (small) under each nipple...is this the breast bud? Does this mean actual breast growth should start very soon?

I have a scar under my left breast/chest area. It is from a long time ago and is causing the left breast area to push outward and upward more. It's making it hard to determine real growth from what might be just scar tissue in the way. My right breast area is still the same as before starting hormones...flat. Although today it seems a bit fuller just a tad. I am worried that this might cause one breast to develop significantly different in size / appearance. It's amazing how starting hormones can make you inspect your body inch for inch every day looking for signs of change. Have to keep reminding myself that this is for the long haul and to be patient...as changes will manifest slowly. Then again, hopefully the early tenderness in my nipples and lump under them is a good sign of fast development.

Down stairs, well...all is limp and not responding to stimulation. The testes have been clinging up tight like when you're very cold. I am wondering if any of you experienced this so early on.

Mentally I have been a lot calmer and mellow...perhaps from the hormones perhaps not. It's nice anyways.

I have been trying sugaring using a product from the body shop. It works fantastic! It was painful but it worked very well. I sugared my chest and abdomen 3 weeks ago and there has been zero hair growth since. Hopefully this is a positive effect of the hormones.

I am waiting on laser until a few more months, but looking forward to it.

Thank you all for your words of advice and support!

- Ivy

Quote from: Lisbeth on April 18, 2007, 10:49:37 AM
Next 6 months - Breast development become noticable.  Tanner stage 3 achieved.
Next 6 years - Breasts develope to their full extent.  If you are lucky, Tanner stage 5 reached.[br

I left out Tanner state 4 because alot of people skip over it, I didn't.  Deb made up a little song about it, too.  I guess it's one of her ways of dealing with things she doesn't like.  It goes to the tune of There's a Hole in the Middle of the Sea.  It's actually a pretty good description of Tanner stage 4.

There's a bump in the middle of a bump
There's a bump in the middle of the bump
There's a bump on a bump and bump on a bump
There's a bump on a bump on a bump

Quote from: dlh1978 on May 02, 2007, 12:53:55 PM
Doc said the progesterone was useless and to just stick to the Spiro + Estrogen I have been taking. I have not had any bad side effects from the progesterone, and have heard so much that it really does help in better female development. Any of you have positive words to say about it from experience?

He is correct.  You won't need it for a couple of years.

Quote from: dlh1978 on May 02, 2007, 12:53:55 PM
My nipples have been very sore and perky 24-7 ever since day 4. Now they are no longer standing up on top but rather have changed to cone shape perkiness with the areola raised too. Small bumps around the outer rim of the areola have perked up too...will these be permanent? I have notices the areola has spread outward just a smidgen. Today I felt a hard lump (small) under each nipple...is this the breast bud? Does this mean actual breast growth should start very soon?

The little bumps are called Montgomery glands, and they are permanent.  Yes, the hard lumps are breast buds, and that is where the pain is coming from.  Be patient.  Everything will come in it's own time.

Progesterone is usefull for breast maturation and
in GG's it "added" by the body years after the
breasts have started to grow  when their menstruations start.
It rounds the breasts up (meaning more sideway branching of the milk making apparatus :-)

So, in first 6 months, kind of a waste of money since progesterone needs breast
tissue to work on and you've got so few.
After 6 months, its usefullness depends on how much breast tissue you have,
if you have significant tissue, you could start it or you
could add it 2 years in and it would have the same effect
(actually more effect since you'd have more breast tissue) and
you'd save money. Since we are in a hurry :-), most add it sooner than later.

In Montreal, the official goverrnment "program" (tm), were they treat A LOT of TS,  now uses progesterone (not sure if it was always the case), so they must find that its of some use. In general, they are conservative in their treatment since the  state pays for the meds and if they thought it was useless they'd cut it in an instant! There are actual studies indicating the usefullness of progesterone in breast devellopment so I don't know why some doctors are still stating the opposite, strange.

Quote from: Lisbeth on June 01, 2007, 05:03:22 PM

Quote from: dlh1978 on May 02, 2007, 12:53:55 PM
My nipples have been very sore and perky 24-7 ever since day 4. Now they are no longer standing up on top but rather have changed to cone shape perkiness with the areola raised too. Small bumps around the outer rim of the areola have perked up too...will these be permanent? I have notices the areola has spread outward just a smidgen. Today I felt a hard lump (small) under each nipple...is this the breast bud? Does this mean actual breast growth should start very soon?

The little bumps are called Montgomery glands, and they are permanent.  Yes, the hard lumps are breast buds, and that is where the pain is coming from.  Be patient.  Everything will come in it's own time.

The things I learn.  I was born with all the "correct" female apparatus, took girls' health class and you know what?  I never knew that those little bumps were supposed to be there!  I just decided I was too embarrassed to go to a doctor and get felt up to ask about them and that if they killed me, they killed me and seeing as how I noticed them 6 years ago and they hadn't changed much (or really at all) they probably weren't going to kill me.

You'd think they'd teach a girls' health class these facts!