You can call me Calvin; I'm male-identified, male assigned at birth... and don't identify with my penis.

I've done a lot of soul-searching, and I know that I'm not MtF-- I have no desire to be physically and socially female, and would never want to medically transition. However... I often find myself wishing either that I could get SRS, or that I'd been born physically female and had FtM therapy-- testosterone and top surgery, specifically. My ideal physique is decidedly male, with one exception: genitally. That said... I have no idea what I am. MTFTM? MT(FTM)? I know labels aren't the be-all and end-all, but... it feels like I'm the only person who has this problem, and as if there's no term or identity for me.

I identify as a heterosexual male, and have had romantic relationships with both transwomen and genetic women. I've never actually taken any of these relationships to a sexual level, however, much to the chagrin of at least one of my exes; I feel this hesitance on my part is due to my peculiar form of dysphoria. I feel like if I were using a prosthetic penis rather than the equipment attached to me, I wouldn't have any problems with that, and it would actually more feel natural and right to me.

I can elaborate more if needed... it's confusing even to me, so that's perfectly understandable. I can also get rid of this thread and move to another section of the forum that's more appropriate... Maybe? Unless that's something an admin has to do. I'm still pretty new around here, so I'm not sure about all of the user privileges, etc.

*hugs* I'm not sure really, Hmm I'd just like to ask some questions I guess, based on your post I would ask if it's something specific to how you view your "stuff", do you feel inadequate or simply not attached to it? Is it possible you would wish to not have one becasue then you wouldn't feel like you don't "measure up" or that you honestly feel like it shouldn't be there in the first place?

It's kind of a jumbled mix of feelings, with regard to the penis itself. I'm okay with using it to masturbate, though... there is a caveat to that. When it comes down to it, I just don't like the idea of using it in a sexual contact with another person present.

The caveat to using it asexually is... I have to imagine I don't have it, paradoxical as that is. The only way I can find relief is to imagine myself as a man with a vagina. The penis usually becomes some form of prosthetic in these imaginings-- often a feeldoe or other double-ended toy, so it makes sense that I'm having sensations, etc...

I'm sorry if this is getting into TMI territory. I don't mean to gross out or alienate anyone.

*hugs* It's alright, This probably will be moved to Sexuality though x3 I dunno.

I can understand your feelings to an extent, I don't even look at it when I do/did that, and pretended I had female parts (can you tell I'm not good with saying the words lol), however in my case I did have the extra baggage of gender confusion.

I'm not sure about your life, so I can't really say either way. I don't want to dismiss your problems, however at present I think there really isn't much for you to do about them beyond trying to make peace with them. Sometimes what starts out as a mild or small problem grows larger becasue we think over it constantly.

I mean ultimately you already labeled yourself in your first post, You identify as heterosexual male. Is it that you feel like these emotions you have question that?

*hugs more* You will really only find your answer within you, but hopefully we can help =P

Quote from: SourCandy on June 28, 2012, 01:42:19 PMI mean ultimately you already labeled yourself in your first post, You identify as heterosexual male. Is it that you feel like these emotions you have question that?

*hugs more* You will really only find your answer within you, but hopefully we can help =P

I guess to me, my identity feels kind of ridiculous... as if it's so out there that no girl would ever actually accept it.

It seems like feeling and identifying this way will only lead people to think I'm a MtF butch lesbian or such, which I'm just not. :/

I see, It's quite a complex. I can see why you feel the way you do, but ultimately my only advice can be to not let one small emotion control who you are. You are much more than your sexual parts, I know it's causing problems personally and sexually, but try to not let it dictate who you are or how you see yourself, becasue everyone has something about themselves they hated at one point and wished was different.

*hugs* I wish I could help more .-.

Thank you... I mean, at least you're taking me seriously? 
What I feared most is that coming out as... well, whatever I am, would make me a laughingstock, even in a trans* community.

Quote from: ElusiveAppellation on June 28, 2012, 02:10:56 PM
Thank you... I mean, at least you're taking me seriously? 
What I feared most is that coming out as... well, whatever I am, would make me a laughingstock, even in a trans* community.

*hugs* Don't worry, There are many people in the world and on this forum and others who have no clue how they fit into the spectrum of terms. I hope you manage to find an answer and hopefully that answer leads to you being happy.

E. A., a lot of people at Susan's can really relate to your story.

Like you, I don't see transitioning, and pleasuring myself is a lot easier when I imagine my organ is a clitoris. I identify with women a lot of the time but I'm 100% straight and am only attracted to women.

Welcome to Susan's. Consider visiting the Androgyne boards - a lot of different combinations of identity there.

Thank you, agfrommd. I helps to know there are others who've had similar experiences.

It's odd... although I would never transition, because I don't identify as female, I'd jump at the chance for SRS.
And I know labels become useless after a point, but if I did have the body I envision, my identity as a heterosexual male does seem like it might not hold anymore... since I'm pretty sure I would actually want some level of attention given to my vulva and vagina, up to and including getting penetrated. The thing is, currently, I have no desire to receive anally, and I doubt I'd want to in either case. So far, in whatever sensual dealings I've had (largely in the form of roleplaying/cybersex), I've only felt comfortable as the dominant, usuallly penetrative, partner.

I get to wondering whether 'lesbian' labelled acts (ex. tribadism) would destroy a genetic girl or post-op transwoman's image of me as male, and the even more complicated case of having this anatomy and using it to interact with a pre/non-op transwoman. Would it make her dysphoric? If it didn't, would we both have to be doing mental gymnastics to make it work?

 Theory is wonderful, but practicality is better.

You want a vagina, but the "catch" is that you are a heterosexual male. So you're a guy with vagina-envy. Perhaps there are more politically correct labels, but that one seems accurate, no?

Now, with the label bit done... I'm reminded of something Jack Sparrow said. Something about what a man can do, and what a man can't do. You want a vagina, but is it possible? Feasible? Finding a surgeon that would give you one without doing to MtF process (which you clearly don't want) would be a very difficult quest, and such a person would not be likely, given their lack of adherence to global medical standards, to be very skilled. The result would be sub-par, in all likelihood.

And if you were to find such a person, it would also be likely to be far more expensive than any of the usual doctors.

I can't recommend working around the system for those reasons, but working within the system is also a no-go.

You can accept that your father was a pirate and a good man, or you cannot. That is, unless you find some third option (one that isn't DIY), you should just accept yourself for who you are - perhaps try to use your penis, because for all I know... what you are experiencing could be performance anxiety. If that doesn't work, then... seeing as how your options seem to be nil, you may just have to be asexual, or find a method to pretend your penis is a vagina during sex and a partner who will be happy to help... or work past your dysphoria, somehow.

If you are truly experiencing dysphoric feelings about your penis, then there may be things under the surface that need to be dealt with. If not, however, then... I can only wish you the best of luck. It would be difficult to work with such a thing, especially in the world of today.

Sometimes, I try to perform an informal cost-benefit analysis of transitioning with the intent of de-transitioning.
I think the duplicity that would have to be involved for such a scheme to work would be unconscionable, though.

Eh. I've been effectively asexual so far, and I'm not really in a rush to change that, given the drama that inevitably accompanies relationships. I suppose I'm more demisexual, or gray-A, and I tend to experience romantic attraction a lot more than I do sexual attraction.

It might be relevant to add that if sexual orientation is being used to refer to anatomy, and romantic attraction is being used to mean personality and gender identity, I'm actually heteroromantic and pansexual, I guess, since I don't really have a preference, when it comes to *ahem* parts.
Then again, it might not be relevant after all, given the obstacles, which aren't going anywhere.

 Not super-relevant, but outstanding, unique, and wonderful qualities anyway.

A lot of transfolk, particularly transmen, are waiting to see how the relevant medical technology improves before doing anything irreversible. I suppose in my case, I'm also waiting for reforms on the process of transitioning-- specifically with regard to gatekeeping. It seems that only those with feminine identities, who complete psychological and hormonal therapy, are eligible for SRS.

I guess to me, it seems like there's a question of an individual's autonomy, their being able to do as they wish, so long as they are not harming others or interfering with the autonomy of others. I think there have to be measures to ensure that people don't have massive post-transition or post-op regrets, certainly. But I don't think it's fair to say that only people who are female-identified can undergo vaginoplasty, or that only people who are male-identified can undergo metoidioplasty/phalloplasty.

Maybe you're MTW- male-to-whatever. And if you don't like the penis and decide to get rid of it, then you would have a nicely androgynous body. You don't have to be a binary.

This is very true... I guess I view myself as MTM in a way? The second 'M' is just a different kind of male, I guess.