I've noticed something strange lately, and was curious to see what people think. Recently, I've begun to take seriously my transgender feelings and possible transsexual identity (mtf). I've experimented with infrequent "female days", in which I go about my usual activities - shopping, going to the library, etc - but dressed as female. I seem to pass enough not to draw attention (if can keep my mouth shut!), which has been empowering. Meanwhile, I spend more time meditating upon this emerging female self, playing around with improving my voice, that sort of thing.

Now here's the strange part. In the past, I've frequently been recognised as a woman from behind - I'm slim with long hair - but never from the front. In all those cases, whenever I turned around, there was an immediate apology for the "mistake". But now, after several weeks of this transgender exploration, I've found myself frequently being taken for female from the front... while dressed 100% male, and pretty much identical in appearance to before! It's more than just a quick false impression; some people have even kept extended eye contact and still believed me to be a woman. (In one case, even with very obvious stubble.)

So what's going on? Is it just the result of my plucked (but not particularly shaped) eyebrows - the one thing I can't take on and off? Or does "thinking female" promote a kind of subliminal "feminine" social signal that can influence other people's gender judgments? Is it part of that intangible quality we usually call "confidence"? I'd love to know if anyone has any similar experiences.

Quote from: Stranger on August 19, 2012, 04:36:03 PM
So what's going on? Is it just the result of my plucked (but not particularly shaped) eyebrows - the one thing I can't take on and off? Or does "thinking female" promote a kind of subliminal "feminine" social signal that can influence other people's gender judgments? Is it part of that intangible quality we usually call "confidence"? I'd love to know if anyone has any similar experiences.

Being who I am, I'm inclined to think that you're obviously androgynous enough for a difference in eyebrows to make the difference, and I would like to think that that's all there is to it. It's also possible that your "thinking female" caused an emergence of feminine mannerisms, which further contributed to the plausibility of femaleness for you.

However, I grudgingly admit that there may be an unmeasurable factor that plays its part. Whether it's some subliminal social signal, or simple confidence, it can't be said for certain. It would make sense for those to contribute, but since most people don't consciously pay attention to those sorts of things, I'm inclined to believe that an attempt to recognize them as a strong force in passing is more an act of vanity than one of objectivity.

You're lucky to be androgynous like that. I seem to share the gift, and it's got its moments, for sure.

Quote from: Kelly J. P. on August 19, 2012, 04:46:44 PM
It's also possible that your "thinking female" caused an emergence of feminine mannerisms, which further contributed to the plausibility of femaleness for you.

That crossed my mind too. I don't go out of my way to "catch" my feminine mannerisms anymore, regardless of how I'm dressed. There was one case where I was doing something distinctively male - moving furniture - and still was mistaken, but the fact that I was also struggling to carry it might have had something to do with it!

QuoteHowever, I grudgingly admit that there may be an unmeasurable factor that plays its part. Whether it's some subliminal social signal, or simple confidence, it can't be said for certain. It would make sense for those to contribute, but since most people don't consciously pay attention to those sorts of things, I'm inclined to believe that an attempt to recognize them as a strong force in passing is more an act of vanity than one of objectivity.

I certainly don't want to suggest some kind of numinous ray of feminity, carefully cultivated by proper mindfulness... that would definitely be vainglorious. The most likely situation is as you say - the result of some androgyny, amplified by a small physical change, combined with a reduction in inhibition... yet I'm still intrigued by the possibilities, because, honestly, I don't myself see a drastic physical difference, and so it's hard to shake the feeling of unintentionally doing something subtle but significant.

But yes, it's certainly not a helpful concept in regards to the idea of passing. I'm not really "passing" anyhow... just getting reactions that seem disproportionate to any external changes.

 What I do like about this forum is the relative abundance of displayed intelligence. I have no sources for it, but I remember reading, when I was younger, that LGBT people tend to be more intelligent, on average, with the "T" being on top of that figurative pyramid.

That could be natural selection at work, with suicides shifting the numbers, or it could just be that the survey, or whatever, didn't have an appropriate sample group. However, in my experience, it has seemed to hold true.

Thank you.

I'm not sure you're actually passing...

As attitudes towards trans people get somewhat better, people become less likely to have a strong negative response to a visibly trans woman, or to misgender her. They could know 100% that you're trans, but refer to you as female because that's what you're trying to present as.

When I first began presenting female I didn't get any strange looks or comments.  Actually one time some guy said that he knew I was trans but that I looked good.  Okay.. that happened two times that I can remember out of hundreds of hours of being out in public.  What I found was that for the most part people don't notice because they are consumed with their own lives.  They really only see the path in front of them for the most part, a little sliver of the world.  On the other hand someone who is presenting female for the first time tends to be on Hyper Alert, constantly scanning everyone and everything.

I remember one time on the way to a gender support meeting there was this person in front of me in a van.  She was frantically scanning every direction while driving.  I knew immediately she was on her way to the same gender meeting even though I could only see the back of her head and perhaps her eyes darting around in the rear view mirror.

Quote from: Stealthy on August 20, 2012, 06:39:55 AM
I'm not sure you're actually passing...

As attitudes towards trans people get somewhat better, people become less likely to have a strong negative response to a visibly trans woman, or to misgender her. They could know 100% that you're trans, but refer to you as female because that's what you're trying to present as.

I agree in principle, though in these cases I've not been presenting as female. I didn't mean to imply that I'm totally passing as female while dressed as male: anyone who looked me up and down properly is never going to think I'm female (minus the odd moments hinted above, where people seemed to continue their impression after eye contact. Probably they figured it out but were embarrassed.)

Generally, it seems more that people who are probably not paying super-close attention are assuming "female": things like a street vendor saying "miss, would you be interested in x", getting a "hello girls" when with a female friend, and a man telling his child not to get in the way of the "lady". This never used to happen. This isn't passing by any means, because it could hardly be anything but temporary (and ultimately embarrassing when they finally figure it out, so I usually scurry away). But it's unprecedented, and makes it seem like my attempts to pass as female at other times are somehow spilling over into my "regular" life... as Kelly J. P. thoughtfully pointed out above, though, I'm probably not giving enough credit to the small but enduring physical changes I've made, like plucking my brows.

Still, you are very right to suggest that quite a bit of what seems like "passing" is just politeness and acceptance. This is especially true in certain cities where it's generally acceptable for men to look feminine without TS even being a factor - depending on the culture, people might just see a boy in makeup and girl's clothes and not think much of it. I personally don't assume trans even when I see a man in a skirt or makeup. I have a few friends involved in various art and music scenes who include women's clothing in their wardrobes, without identifying as cross-dressers or transgender.

Quote from: Noey Noonesson on August 20, 2012, 07:11:54 AM
They really only see the path in front of them for the most part, a little sliver of the world.  On the other hand someone who is presenting female for the first time tends to be on Hyper Alert, constantly scanning everyone and everything.

I find this to be very true. According to friends who accompany me when I go out dressed-as-female, the average reaction is that people don't react: their eyes are glazed over, and they just don't make any attempt to gender me one way or another.  Which is nice, I guess!

Stranger,

I think I know a little of what you are experiencing.

When I go out wearing female clothing now (always wearing only casually feminine clothing so as to blend in as much as possible), I find myself sort of naturally walking a little differently, interacting with people and surroundings differently, and being treated differently. It's very subtle, but gives me a very nice tickle inside, a sort of a feminine buzz which I believe gets picked up on by people around me. It's something of a virtuous circle: I feel feminine, get treated as a woman, feel more feminine, rinse and repeat.

I often go around unnoticed because, as has been pointed out, people tend to be too into their own thing to notice anyone else unless something jumps out and catches their attention. When I do get noticed, I assume that people read me (I'm not really passable), but they always still treat me differently -- somehow more gently -- than I typically experience as a man. And, yes, this does happen occasionally even when I'm not wearing feminine clothing.

On a recent trip to buy women's glasses (wearing my girl jeans, mid-heels, and a white striped blouse), the saleswoman was a little unsure how to proceed at first, but within a couple of moments, after I said something which made her laugh, she was willing to actively treat me like any other female customer. It was a delightful experience, very affirming of my ability to carry on with transitioning.

So, perhaps what you are experiencing is your inner feminine buzz getting out and affecting people, which is certainly a wonderful thing.

Lora
http://translora.wordpress.com

That's because of something that I call "Vibing".

Subconsciously your posture, mannerism, facial expressions may be changing thus making your vibe leans towards female and since you're probably relatively physically androgynous you're getting gendered female more often. My guess is that you smile a lot more too. Walk around with a frown on your face you'll get sir'd systematically.

You probably don't live up to close scrutiny, but your vibe can easily get you gendered female at first glance by strangers.