I've talked to guys who had sex with post ops and they told me it didn't feel 'comfortable' around their penis, even when wearing a condom.

They told me the neovagina is 'positioned higher' than a natural one plus it felt like a 'dry hand around their penis' and getting too narrow in the end of the neo vagina canal.

They had no reason to lie about it, especially not about the neo vagina dryness.

The girls had surgery with dr Suporn and in Germany with Frau Krege and in Holland too.

So...can anyone let her light shine over this?

I think lube should take care of vaginal dryness, maybe some premarin vaginal cream?

For SOME Post op woman, were stealth so nobody knows about our past or anything. Now depending on who your surgeon was  A LOT Of men wouldn't be able to tell AT ALL. I've talked with MANY girls who said men loved it and they couldn't tell a difference. i ALSO Talked with TWO MEN (one didn't know till AFTER sex she was post op, the other one knew) They both said it was just like being with a genetic girl but BETTER Cause it's a tad tighter. Lube will help a lot, I get wet and have multiple orgasms. again YMMV.

Quote from: Tinkerbell on September 10, 2012, 03:44:49 PM
For SOME Post op woman, were stealth so nobody knows about our past or anything. Now depending on who your surgeon was  A LOT Of men wouldn't be able to tell AT ALL. I've talked with MANY girls who said men loved it and they couldn't tell a difference. i ALSO Talked with TWO MEN (one didn't know till AFTER sex she was post op, the other one knew) They both said it was just like being with a genetic girl but BETTER Cause it's a tad tighter. Lube will help a lot, I get wet and have multiple orgasms. again YMMV.

But those guys told me they felt the difference between bio vaginal musculature and walls  and neo vagina walls.
They also told me a neovagina doesn't 'open' and the lips don't swell when aroused whereas a bio vagina does. They found 'not opening' and not swelling a bit confusing.

If a guy knows the woman he was with has a "neo-vagina" (neo means new).  Then he will come up with "differences" between it and other women's vaginas but the fact is that all vaginae are different, some are more dry, some are more tight, some are positioned higher, some are positioned lower.

Those guys are full of themselves.

Its great that trans women are trying to educate men on the difference though (not)

There is no doubt in my mind that there are plenty of trans women who don't know how to care for their vaginae and don't know how to prepare for sex.

No ones ever mentioned this to me

Well, I have been with a lot of women, and women know vagina much better than men do. I've had people go down on me who did not know. I get really wet, my panties end up soaked. My vulva is positioned where a vulva should be and gets swollen when arroused.

I've had my fingers, tongue and previous penis in rather a few vaginas myself and I have to say they are all very different. Some very dry, some that dripped all over me. They  come in a variety of smells, flavors and tightness. They also change a lot through a woman's life - things like childbirth and menopause can have quite an effect.

Seriously, comfortable? Sticking your penis in a dry vagina must of been totally uncomfortable for those poor women. Of course that is not going to be comfortable. Did the guys use a lot of foreplay to get them aroused enough to be wet? Did they think to use some lube?

Quote from: Tinkerbell on September 10, 2012, 03:44:49 PM
For SOME Post op woman, were stealth so nobody knows about our past or anything. Now depending on who your surgeon was  A LOT Of men wouldn't be able to tell AT ALL. I've talked with MANY girls who said men loved it and they couldn't tell a difference. i ALSO Talked with TWO MEN (one didn't know till AFTER sex she was post op, the other one knew) They both said it was just like being with a genetic girl but BETTER Cause it's a tad tighter.

Thats very true, I know when I was dating my fiancé, he certainly couldn't tell the difference and he had other girl friends before me, he didn't know my history till we got engaged, he is now my husband, Iv often asked him how I compare to other women ''best pussy he has ever had'' well he would say that, probably says that to all the girls lol

Quote from: Ave on September 10, 2012, 03:22:52 PM
I think lube should take care of vaginal dryness, maybe some premarin vaginal cream?

I sometimes will use lube if Im a little dry, but good fore play by hubby gets me wet, very fullfilling for me as a woman just seeing that big smile on his face afterwards.

Quote from: Noey Noonesson on September 11, 2012, 04:35:56 PM
If a guy knows the woman he was with has a "neo-vagina" (neo means new).  Then he will come up with "differences" between it and other women's vaginas but the fact is that all vaginae are different, some are more dry, some are more tight, some are positioned higher, some are positioned lower.

Those guys are full of themselves.

Its great that trans women are trying to educate men on the difference though (not)

Very true, those guys are certainly very full of themselves, they know nothing about women or just being a woman, so called experts on women who see themselves as nothing but ''super studs''

Quote from: Dahlia on September 10, 2012, 03:10:55 PM
They had no reason to lie about it, especially not about the neo vagina dryness.

Maybe they just weren't man enough to make them wet. Oh snap! 

Of course, I kid. Vaginas are like penises in the sense that they come in all different forms and functionality. Not all mens' penises work, not all of them are very big, and some can be close to as wrinkly as Newt Gingrich's face. These guys shouldn't expect every vagina to be the same. Biology isn't perfect.

Quote from: Bella on September 14, 2012, 09:35:37 PM
[clipped]
As for the swelling: oh believe you me it swells up plenty! You can DEFINITELY tell if I'm aroused or not. This all sounds  very peculiar to me. Positioned higher? My vaginal entrance is positioned exactly where it's "supposed to", a desirably "low" position I guess, a few cm above my anus.

Also I agree with DianaP: "Biology isn't perfect."

Hah! Perfect or not so "perfect" - there is really only one entry point for the vaginal introitus as it has to pass below the pubic bone. (So much for too high!?!).
It is actually a "predefined entry point" and one can even feel it in male plumbing ... a soft-ish dent behind the scrotum.

I have to agree that these 'findings' all sound like a lot of bogus...
Axélle
PS: in fairness... with a neo-vj, actually the vulva/labia, tend to have a slightly higher position compared to most bio-vulva, maybe this was what was meant... I actually think so. It is one of the reasons for labiaplasty/revision following SRS. (I had)

Quote from: Abracadabra on September 15, 2012, 01:41:16 AM

PS: in fairness... with a neo-vj, actually the vulva/labia, tend to have a slightly higher position compared to most bio-vulva, maybe this was what was meant... I actually think so. It is one of the reasons for labiaplasty/revision following SRS. (I had)

Ye, this is what they meant.

Quote from: Bella on September 14, 2012, 09:35:37 PM
Doesn't get wet and doesn't swell? Lol. I guess it varies though. I'm quite a sexual person, and I wear thin panty liners every day in case I get aroused and start dripping. As for the swelling: oh believe you me it swells up plenty! You can DEFINITELY tell if I'm aroused or not.

Scrotal sac tissue doesn't swell when a cisguy is aroused...in fact it's even contracting prior to orgasm...so how come neo labia majora do swell in your case?

Quote from: Dahlia on September 15, 2012, 05:46:35 AM
Ehm, from what I'm reading so far....it's the post op MTF's who are full of themselves...and 'so called experts on (cis)women'...

Im certainly not full of myself, you originally started this thread by asking

Quote from: Dahlia on September 10, 2012, 03:10:55 PM

So...can anyone let her light shine over this?

Well I can only let my light shine over my own experience, my husband certainly has no complaints, we all have different experiences as well as the guys you'v talked to.
Pauline

Quote from: Dahlia on September 15, 2012, 05:46:35 AM
Ehm, from what I'm reading so far....it's the post op MTF's who are full of themselves...and 'so called experts on (cis)women'...

Look you asked a question and we answered your question. Don't compare what some morons who probably ALREADY Knew from the jump those woman were post op and just ran their mouths. If you really want an answer to YOUR Question find a post op woman and you have sex with her to find out. then go find a ciswoman and you compare. Don't get an attitude when all we did was answer your question. I think you just started this whole question to rile up a pre-op or non-op VS Post op.

Quote from: Tinkerbell on September 15, 2012, 03:46:17 PM

Look you asked a question and we answered your question. Don't compare what some morons who probably ALREADY Knew from the jump those woman were post op and just ran their mouths. If you really want an answer to YOUR Question find a post op woman and you have sex with her to find out. then go find a ciswoman and you compare. Don't get an attitude when all we did was answer your question. I think you just started this whole question to rile up a pre-op or non-op VS Post op.

I'm NOT into women/mtf and I've NEVER had sex with a woman... that's why I'm asking this question in the first place.

It's a bit prejudiced to think all MTF are lesbian or bi, don't you think so?

A post op MTF friend of mine met a guy, had later in the night sex with him without telling him about her status and the first thing he said when he penetrated her pre lubed vagina was 'this isn't a normal pussy'...

Quote from: Dahlia on September 15, 2012, 05:00:14 PM
I'm NOT into women/mtf and I've NEVER had sex with a woman... that's why I'm asking this question in the first place.

It's a bit prejudiced to think all MTF are lesbian or bi, don't you think so?

A post op MTF friend of mine met a guy, had later in the night sex with him without telling him about her status and the first thing he said when he penetrated her pre lubed vagina was 'this isn't a normal pussy'...

Had to come out of retirement to respond O_o ...

Assuming this is a true story he said what he said because he already suspected she was trans for one reason or another or heard a rumor she was trans.

There is no such thing as a "normal" pussy.

Using this sort of story as evidence that neo-vaginae don't pass is bad science.  I will agree that some doctors do better work than others, I don't recommend 'any' North American doctors, but even still... bad science.

This sort of "evidence" is only used to forward a pre-existing agenda, fear-mongering, or for making a statement that trans women are not real women.  It is effective in that it perpetuates false fears because your target audience is vulnerable.  If this is something you need to work out for yourself then please do.  Using it to debase trans women and their experiences will have no positive outcome.

You asked a question, you got some answers.  Now you are arguing, saying that trans women are delusional and that your stories are science fact.

I have already explained that men don't tell women their vaginae are "wrong".  Is that so difficult to believe?  They only say those sorts of things when they already believe the woman they are with is trans, because she is not passing or because someone outed her or started a rumor.

We have enough hurdles to overcome without bad science used to destroy confidence.

Before I transitioned, when I was young.. I tried to be normal and I had sex with maybe 12 women.  I also tried being somewhat O_o lesbian with a few after transition and in all that time I never noticed any outer labia swelling in any of them.  I have also watched 15,000 cubic tons of porn and I never saw any outer labia swelling there either.  Outer labia are basically just skin and fat that surrounds the sexual organs, nothing amazing there.

Stay on track please ladies.

Just a remind.

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Quote from: Noey Noonesson on September 15, 2012, 08:30:41 PM
Before I transitioned, when I was young.. I tried to be normal and I had sex with maybe 12 women.  I also tried being somewhat O_o lesbian with a few after transition and in all that time I never noticed any outer labia swelling in any of them.  I have also watched 15,000 cubic tons of porn and I never saw any outer labia swelling there either.  Outer labia are basically just skin and fat that surrounds the sexual organs, nothing amazing there.

Of course, just THIS.
Once again in fairness to say labia minora (in bio-vj) DO SWELL, and as we heard also in neo-vj *)... so yet another mixed-up idea as with vagina and vulva?
It sounds just like that to me.

Guys often cannot tell this stuff apart
Who wants to blame them... since they of course ALSO do not have any hormones... (hum, according to many of them at least )

I also fully agree with a well founded suspicion that the comment "this isn't a normal vagina" if it happened like this in the first place... something I question... there had to be some sort of 'pre-cursor'...

I have had sex with at least one hysterectomised woman, lo and behold... there is no cervix to be 'fingered'! Not a "normal" vagina then either, right? And due to hysterectomy... quite dry to boot.
How absolutely mind-blindingly crude would one have to be to draw attention to this?!

Said enough I guess, take care,
Axélle
*) as mine (inner labia) are still puffy from labiaplasty, I cannot speak for myself here...