The Devil made me do it, but the Lord forgave me!

[Elizabeth]

Hi everyone,

During my life, so far, I have come in contact with this phenomenon many times, mostly from born again Christians and mostly family members. It's a pretty sweet deal. You can wrong people, steal from them, lie to them, lie about them, physically attack them, make false accusations against them, never apologize, never ask for redemption from the person you wronged and still get a clean slate, from which one can become self-righteous.

How? Simple, just ask a mythical figure to forgive you. You need not say it out loud, you need not ask the people you wronged for forgiveness, you need never take responsibility. Just ask a mythical figure for forgiveness and you are on your way to life everlasting as a self-righteous Christian.

You may now tell those you wronged that they need to find God so they can live forever too. I mean since they are angry you wronged them and never apologized, they are going to hell. The devil certainly controls them. And since you are going to heaven and they are not, you may critisize them and disassociate yourself with them, because they have not asked the mythical being for forgiveness.

It's no wonder so many people opt into this system. No responsibility, live forever, be able to act superior to those you have wronged while being able to avoid them and never actually be sorry for wronging them. Know how to get promoted? Join your bosses church. Works every time.

Love always,
Elizabeth

[Julie Marie]

Reminds me of a neighbor.  He was one of the meanest people you'd ever want to meet but every Sunday there he was at church, praying, singing. chatting with the priest and being told what an asset he was to the church.  Then he'd go home and yell at his wife and kids, kick the dog around and threaten the neighborhood kids.

Once my sister (a church elder) said something very mean to my mother.  We were all appalled that she would act so mean.  When my mother said she was owed an apology my sister replied in a very snotty fashion, "Love means never having to say you're sorry."  The entire family was speechless.

I wonder why I became cynical about religious fanatics. 

Julie

[David W. Shelton]

There are some very basic truths that I've learned in life. One of those is that the Christian walk is as much about personal responsibility and accountability as it is about grace.

God's forgiveness from sin does not absolve us of the consequences of our actions. His grace will carry us through, though. Sadly, some just don't get it. They think that if they've been miserable >-bleeped-<s their entire life that if they just "come to Jesus" and everything will be just fine. So, instead of being miserable >-bleeped-<s, all of the sudden they turn into something far worse: religious >-bleeped-<s.

Redeemed? No. More like a mask. It's a religious masquerade that is nothing more and nothing less than turning everything good and holy into the vile and profane. Alas, the masks are so good that the wearer thinks they've fooled everyone, including themselves.

Chrisitanity is about transparency, openness, being genuine, and being real. "Submit yourselves to another" is referencing genuine relationships where it's safe to say, "I'm screwed up" and know that you'll never be beaten down or crushed by those who love you. Unfortunately, Christians do shoot their wounded. Maybe it's time to stop letting these kind of masquerading fools wreck the name of what is true, what is good, and what is noble.

In short, God is looking for spiritual fruit, not religious nuts.

[Suzy]

There are some very basic truths that I've learned in life. One of those is that the Christian walk is as much about personal responsibility and accountability as it is about grace.

David you are so right about this.  Put another way, the Bible knows nothing of the modern idea of confession without repentance.  The Hebrew idea of repentance was to turn around.  The Greek is even better.  It is the same word we generally translate as "metamorphosis," which means to be changed in form.  Christianity is all about life being lived in covenant connection with one another.  This necessarily implies certain ways of relating to others.  While I don't believe we "earn" grace, the kind of situation that Elizabeth describes is foreign to authentic Christianity.  Unfortunately, it is not unknown to christendom in general.

In short, God is looking for spiritual fruit, not religious nuts.

Well in one sense I consider myself a religious nut.  Leonard Sweet described the church as:
Never
Underestimate
The
Spirit

Peace,
Kristi

[David W. Shelton]

Well, I guess I'm just a cracked nut! 

[Suzy]

Put us together and we're a bunch of mixed nuts. 

Kristi

[Lori]

Well, I guess I'm just a cracked nut! 

I am actually enjoying your posts and if all religious nuts were as nutty as you I believe you could convert a great following.

[Elizabeth]

Hi everyone,

Thanks for all the nice responses, I am sure we all know people like this. I don't mean to disparage all Christians, as I have known many who were good, kind, decent and spiritual people. I am talking of those who think forgiveness is an escape clause instead of a shot at redemption. Those who are more concerned about asking for forgiveness than actually feeling any remorse for their actions. As if an all powerful god would not know what they really think and feel. I just don't get it.

Love always,
Elizabeth

[Cindi Jones]

Yes, Elizabeth, there are a lot of really decent people in this world. And you don't really need to look all that hard to find them. We tend to rant about those who are most visible and outrageous.

Cindi

[rhonda13000]

Hi everyone,

During my life, so far, I have come in contact with this phenomenon many times, mostly from born again Christians and mostly family members. It's a pretty sweet deal. You can wrong people, steal from them, lie to them, lie about them, physically attack them, make false accusations against them, never apologize, never ask for redemption from the person you wronged and still get a clean slate, from which one can become self-righteous.

How? Simple, just ask a mythical figure to forgive you. You need not say it out loud, you need not ask the people you wronged for forgiveness, you need never take responsibility. Just ask a mythical figure for forgiveness and you are on your way to life everlasting as a self-righteous Christian.

You may now tell those you wronged that they need to find God so they can live forever too. I mean since they are angry you wronged them and never apologized, they are going to hell. The devil certainly controls them. And since you are going to heaven and they are not, you may critisize them and disassociate yourself with them, because they have not asked the mythical being for forgiveness.

In the reality that people make a conscious choice to conveniently ignore, it doesn't work that way and they are only reveling in a pitiful morass of self-delusion.