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GOP leaders who adore ayn rand sociopath writer of "Atlas Shrugged" who adored a

Started by Amazon D, November 20, 2011, 04:10:19 PM

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Amazon D

GOP leaders who adore ayn rand sociopath writer of "Atlas Shrugged" who adored a serial killer for not caring about anyone but himself!! Ayn Rand thinks people should only care for themselves.. get rich screw the poor..


Ayn Rand Admired Serial Killer William Hickman

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The Truth About GOP Hero Ayn Rand
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http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/04/19/968385/-Hero-or-Monster:-Ayn-Rand-and-William-Hickman

So I was listening to the Thom Hartmann Show this morning in which he did a horrific segment on William Hickman, a cold blooded child murderer, whom Ayn Rand idolized. In her journal circa 1928, Ayn Rand quoted the statement, "What is good for me is right," a credo attributed to a prominent murderer,  William Edward Hickman. "The best and strongest expression of a real man's psychology I have heard," she wrote.
etc etc


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William Buckley on Ayn Rand & Atlas Shrugged
I'm an Amazon womyn + very butch + respecting MWMF since 1999 unless invited. + I AM A HIPPIE

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SarahM777

Please forgive me if this sounds a bit off the wall but who is Ayn Rynd? And what was so special about what she wrote?
Answers are easy. It's asking the right questions which is hard.

Be positive in the fact that there is always one person in a worse situation then you.

The Fourth Doctor
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tekla

Yeah, one of the more annoying things about teaching college was the fact that many of the smarter students seemed to pass through and AnyRand semester at some point.  I could only hope that it happened for most of them during the summer so I didn't have to hear about it.  I'm still kind of fond of her essey on Apollo and Dionysus, she's wrong about most of it, but it's kinda of charming none-the-less.  As for her personal life - never met your heroes.
FIGHT APATHY!, or don't...
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Cindy Stephens

Ayn Rand was a writer with pretensions of economic insight.  She has taken on a cult-like status among some wings of the Republican party.  The old chairman of the Federal Reserve Board, Allen Greenspan, made a point of making her his special guest at his swearing in ceremony.   She has some clout.  Her books (very boring novels) present the idea that by being "selfish" and doing only what is best for yourself, then you actually are being economically efficient.  This results in, supposedly, more for everyone.  You may see references to, "who is john gault?" on bumper stickers. Here in Tampa there is a subdivision whose street names are taken from her different novels.  Ayn Rand hated all religions and the idea of altruism.  This presents an immense quandary for many conservatives who love her hate of government and taxes, but hate the idea of being unable to oppress people like us through official government edict. If you can pick and choose from her ideas (none original to her) then she can be seductive.  Kind of like, " at least the trains ran on time under Mussolini, just too bad about all of the dead people."
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SarahM777

Thank you Cindy,

I do appreciate you taking the time. Until 5 years ago I had never heard of her but lately it seemed like her name was coming more often and I was just wondering.

Answers are easy. It's asking the right questions which is hard.

Be positive in the fact that there is always one person in a worse situation then you.

The Fourth Doctor
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tekla

you can pick and choose from her ideas (none original to her) then she can be seductive

That's pretty much true about everything.  There are no really 'new' ideas, just different arrangements of them.

The Bible asks pretty much straight out "Am I my brother's keeper?" and answers, 'yes'.  Ayn would disagree.  Ayn would say - in a crypto-Moscow-type Russian accent - 'not for a minute, not for a second.  I'm looking out for number one baby, and number one ain't you - or anyone else.  Hell, none of you are even number two.  Master of my own ship I am.  I owe nuttin' to nobody and I'm nobodies' sweetheart either.'  And she wasn't.

I always gave her a bit of slack heaving grown up in Russia during the Revolution and resulting fallout, but the US in the 1950 was not going to have a Russian-style Proletariat revolution -NO WAY - so she was really barking up the wrong tree.

I read a quote about Newt Gingrich the other day: "Newt Gingrich is what stupid people think smart people sound like".  Ayn's 'writing' reminds me a lot of that statement.  It's what unskilled people (philosophy noobies) think that real smart arguments look like.  It sets an amazingly high standard for being pedantic and didactic at the same time, (one I never hope to see surpassed) while the phrase turgid prose and/or 'two-dimensional cardboard characters' doesn't begin to describe it. 

A famous internet type quote goes:
There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.
FIGHT APATHY!, or don't...
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SarahM777

Thank you Tekla for boiling that down.

Quote from: tekla on November 25, 2011, 10:41:52 AM

A famous internet type quote goes:
There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.

Does this mean that if I read the Lord of the Rings to much that I may have a lifelong obsession with it's unbelievable heroes, and it will lead to me to have an emotionally crippled adulthood and I will be unable to deal with the real world? And I really liked that book. 

(Just kidding) ;)
Answers are easy. It's asking the right questions which is hard.

Be positive in the fact that there is always one person in a worse situation then you.

The Fourth Doctor
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gennee

Did you that know that Rand sought public assistance in her later years? This was something that in previous years chastised those who sought it. Pretty hypocritical if you ask me.
Be who you are.
Make a difference by being a difference.   :)

Blog: www.difecta.blogspot.com
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Jamie D

Quote from: gennee on April 22, 2012, 03:53:54 PM
Did you that know that Rand sought public assistance in her later years? This was something that in previous years chastised those who sought it. Pretty hypocritical if you ask me.

Misleading, at best, Gennee.

Rand paid into Social Security and she collected her benefits when she was old enough.
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peky

I am not a GOP lady but I do subscribe to the philosophies advocating reason, individualism, and capitalism -which is what Ms Rand advocated later on her life- They may be the lesser of many evils. What else is out there? Marxism?? Fascism?

BTW the "Atlas Shrugged" was titled by Ms Rand a "fictional novel"
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Semiopathy

All I want to say on this topic is, if you want to understand Ayn Rand's philosophy, start at the base.  Philosophy is hierarchical.  Eschew her views on aesthetics, politics, and ethics.  Start at the base, at metaphysics (what is the nature of the world?) and epistemology (how do I know it?).  Did God create the world and everything in it, including humans?  Is there only one reality, or are there many realities?  Do I create my reality, or does it exist independent of my consciousness?  Is there such a thing as an afterlife?  And how do you know these things, through divine revelation, because society tells you what is true and false, or through a process of independent reasoning?

Ayn would say, things are what they are; A is A.  Only this world exists, and it exists wether you are aware of it existing or not. There is no heaven waiting for you when you die, nor are there other realities to be concerned with.  Contradictions do not exist; if you think you have found one, check your premises, for it is evidence of an error in reasoning.  She viewed reason and logic as absolute, as man's only means of knowledge, as against divine revelation (faith) or emotions.  For instance: if you are held at gunpoint, you might experience the emotion of fear, but ONLY if you recognize it as a gun and that it is a threat to your life.  A blind man or a primitive savage will not feel fear in this case.  The blind man can't see the gun, and the savage has no knowledge of what a gun can do.

Your view on the higher branches of philosophy - ethics, politics, and aesthetics- will vary greatly depending on your view of metaphysics and epistemology.
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peky

Quote from: Semiopathy on April 23, 2012, 04:24:00 PM
All I want to say on this topic is, if you want to understand Ayn Rand's philosophy, start at the base.  Philosophy is hierarchical.  Eschew her views on aesthetics, politics, and ethics.  Start at the base, at metaphysics (what is the nature of the world?) and epistemology (how do I know it?).  Did God create the world and everything in it, including humans?  Is there only one reality, or are there many realities?  Do I create my reality, or does it exist independent of my consciousness?  Is there such a thing as an afterlife?  And how do you know these things, through divine revelation, because society tells you what is true and false, or through a process of independent reasoning?

Ayn would say, things are what they are; A is A.  Only this world exists, and it exists wether you are aware of it existing or not. There is no heaven waiting for you when you die, nor are there other realities to be concerned with.  Contradictions do not exist; if you think you have found one, check your premises, for it is evidence of an error in reasoning.  She viewed reason and logic as absolute, as man's only means of knowledge, as against divine revelation (faith) or emotions.  For instance: if you are held at gunpoint, you might experience the emotion of fear, but ONLY if you recognize it as a gun and that it is a threat to your life.  A blind man or a primitive savage will not feel fear in this case.  The blind man can't see the gun, and the savage has no knowledge of what a gun can do.

Your view on the higher branches of philosophy - ethics, politics, and aesthetics- will vary greatly depending on your view of metaphysics and epistemology.

As with any philosphy or faith, take what you want. live what is not neded or wanted; make your own philosphy, your own faith, your own destiny
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justmeinoz

"Don't ask me, it was on fire when I lay down on it"
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