'Occupy' movement fizzles on May Day

[Jamie D]

Cleveland won't renew Occupy group's permit

CLEVELAND (AP) — Occupy protesters must ask serious questions about their open-arms policy in light of charges brought against five members accused of trying to blow up an Ohio bridge, a top Cleveland official said Wednesday.

The city declined to renew the group's downtown encampment permit on Wednesday, a denial planned before the bridge plot arrests were announced Monday, said Ken Silliman, chief of staff to Mayor Frank Jackson. The group, which remained by its encampment tent Wednesday night despite a 5 p.m. deadline to leave, can still gather at a spot across the street day or night. Police are monitoring, but no arrests have been made.

Occupy Seattle condemns violence from May Day protests

One day after vandals ravaged Seattle's May Day demonstrations, members of Occupy Seattle spoke out against the violent acts that took place. "Occupy Seattle did not endorse any kind of property damage," said Mark Taylor-Canfield, an organizer of the Occupy Seattle movement. Canfield said members of his group did not know about the plans of vandals, identified by Seattle Police as the "Black Bloc," because they were focused on keeping concerts and speeches at Westlake peaceful.

Oakland May Day protest triggers arrests and tear gas

OAKLAND, Calif. —

An Occupy Oakland May Day protest reeled out of control Tuesday as police fired tear gas into the unruly crowd and made several arrests.

Protesters began gathering around 9 a.m. in downtown Oakland and took to the streets, blocking traffic on several streets as they marched.

Around noon, several hundred protesters gathered in an intersection in front of City Hall where a confrontation with police began. In a matter minutes, tears gas was fired into the crowd as tension rose and riot-geared police began making arrests.

Occupy movement's May Day turnout seen as test for its future

Occupy Wall Street vows a day of demonstrations in New York and across the United States on Tuesday, in a crucial test of its staying power some eight months after emerging as a movement against corporate greed and economic inequality.

The "99 Percent" populist movement, which began as a 24-hour encampment in lower Manhattan last fall and spread to cities across the country, will join organized labor for a day of May 1 protests, in what it has called a "day without the 99 percent."

Dozens of actions are planned across the country, though there is some skepticism over how many people will turn out and whether it will spell Occupy's resurgence. The event was first billed as a "General Strike," but organized labor declined to sign on to that call....

But despite the anemic response to several recent events, observers say that Occupy Wall Street has already influenced political discourse in a year when U.S. voters will decide a presidential election. Democratic lawmakers and President Barack Obama have adopted some of the language of Occupy Wall Street.

Mitt Romney, the presumed Republican presidential nominee, has decried what he says is Occupy's message of divisiveness and envy.

[Jamie D]

Epic fail.

And a political loser.

[ToriJo]

Mitt Romney, the presumed Republican presidential nominee, has decried what he says is Occupy's message of divisiveness and envy.[/i]

Uh, isn't divisiveness and envy what politics is about these days?  For both incumbent parties, anyhow.  Wouldn't it be nice if the democrats and republicans spent just one day thinking, "Wow, there are things government needs to do.  Let's do one of them..." and then actually did their jobs?  I might think occupy has problems, but one of our country's politicians saying this is...well, "pot, meet kettle."

[Jamie D]

Uh, isn't divisiveness and envy what politics is about these days?  For both incumbent parties, anyhow. Wouldn't it be nice if the democrats and republicans spent just one day thinking, "Wow, there are things government needs to do.  Let's do one of them..." and then actually did their jobs?  I might think occupy has problems, but one of our country's politicians saying this is...well, "pot, meet kettle."

Therein lies the problem.  Government, especially the federal government, operates outside its limited role.  Government, where and when necessary, should be at the level closest to the people.

The "Occupy movement" was never "populist."  Instead, it melded elements of anarchists, socialists, Marxists, and trade unionists.

That's why you saw little political support for the senseless violence and mayhem of this week.

Occupy is dead.

[Jamie D]

May Day is the only event that transcends all divisions of religion, race, nationality or any other prejudice of the past amongst human beings. It is commemorated in all continents.

This year May Day falls at a time when the severe crises of capitalism have led to an unprecedented onslaught against the working classes of all countries. If the Keynesian model of capitalism with state intervention in the economy was a disaster for the oppressed masses, the consequences of the monetarist model of free market economics have been preposterous. The policies of deregulation, privatisation, restructuring, downsizing and liberalisation have wreaked havoc on workers' lives across the globe. In spite of a relative lull of the last two decades of mild reaction, there are now stirrings of a new resurgence of class struggle on a world scale. The Arab Spring, the worldwide Occupy movement, mass street protests in Russia, local strikes and uprisings in China, general strikes by millions of workers in Greece, Spain, Italy, Belgium, Portugal, France, Hungary, Romania, Britain, and beyond Europe in every continent, from India to Chile to Israel, all point to the beginning of new wave of revolutions.

Even the most ardent reformists now have to admit that capitalism is in a state of terminal decay. Astonishingly, an article in the mainstream British paper The Guardian last week said, "Communism is not just the carnival of mass protest when the system is brought to a halt; Communism is also, above all, a new form of organisation, discipline and hard work...Marx's key insight remains valid, today perhaps more than ever...We feel free because it lacks the very language to articulate our unfreedom...Today all the main terms we use to designate the present conflict — 'war on terror', 'democracy and freedom', 'human rights', etc, are false terms, mystifying our perception of the situation instead of allowing us to think about it." Forbidden terms make a comeback in the bourgeois media with a vengeance.

- In Defense of Marxism

It was no coincidence Occupy chose May Day for their failed demonstrations.  The Marxist/Socialist rhetoric is, at least, good for a laugh.

[justmeinoz]

Seems somehow appropriate. 
A bit like the Australian Communist Party folding because they couldn't get a quorum at their meetings.
"Whatever happened to the Revolution?  We all got stoned and it drifted away."  Skyhooks, 1972 I think.

Karen.

[Semiopathy]

Who would have guessed:  supporters of an ideology that has killed over 80 million people would be capable and willing to use such violence? 
I have heard support elsewhere for turning May Day into "Victims of Communism" day, just as we have a Holocaust Memorial Day.

[Jamie D]

Who would have guessed:  supporters of an ideology that has killed over 80 million people would be capable and willing to use such violence? 

I have heard support elsewhere for turning May Day into "Victims of Communism" day, just as we have a Holocaust Memorial Day.

In the Marxist/Socialist way of thinking, the needs and desires of the individual are secondary to the needs of the state.

[Sephirah]

In the Marxist/Socialist way of thinking, the needs and desires of the individual are secondary to the needs of the state.

Or, as Spock puts it: "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one."

Who knew Vulcans were Marxists.

[Jamie D]

Or, as Spock puts it: "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one."

Who knew Vulcans were Marxists.

True Vulcan egalitarianism.  But at the end of the film, The Search for Spock, what did we find out?

Spock: My father says that you have been my friend. You came back for me.
Kirk: You would have done the same for me.
Spock: Why would you do this?
Kirk: Because the needs of the one... outweigh the needs of the many.



(Why do I feel I'm in an episode of "The Big Bang Theory"?)

[Amazon D]

The 99% Declaration, a non-partisan grassroots effort to to get the money out of politics and restore representation for the 99% of Americans currently left out. We are seeking supporters, voters, and delegates to our July 4th convention in Philadelphia. Check us out and get involved! www.the99declararation.org .... We are seeking supporters, online voters, and delegates to our July 4th convention in Philadelphia. Check us out and get involved!

[peky]

True Vulcan egalitarianism.  But at the end of the film, The Search for Spock, what did we find out?

Spock: My father says that you have been my friend. You came back for me.
Kirk: You would have done the same for me.
Spock: Why would you do this?
Kirk: Because the needs of the one... outweigh the needs of the many.

About 30,000 children under the age of five died out of starvation, dehydration, or parastic disease, every day. I wish we could solve this injustice first.



(Why do I feel I'm in an episode of "The Big Bang Theory"?)

[Jamie D]

Peky wrote: "About 30,000 children under the age of five died out of starvation, dehydration, or parastic disease, every day. I wish we could solve this injustice first."

Though I agree with you in principle, that number, which has been printed on t-shirts and used for propaganda purposes, actually has no basis in fact.

It is usually credited to UNICEF.  That should be your first clue as to its validity. What is the provenance?

Whether you believe the numbers or not, the point is many, if not most of the despair occurs in countries with civil strife and authoritarian regimes, or outright anarchy.

The charitable western nations of the world feed hundreds of thousands every day.

[Jamie D]

The 99% Declaration, a non-partisan grassroots effort to to get the money out of politics and restore representation for the 99% of Americans currently left out. We are seeking supporters, voters, and delegates to our July 4th convention in Philadelphia. Check us out and get involved! www.the99declararation.org .... We are seeking supporters, online voters, and delegates to our July 4th convention in Philadelphia. Check us out and get involved!

There is nobody "left out"  My vote and your vote count as much as Ted Turner's or some Kennedy.

If you want to better control the money in politics, support instead instant disclosure laws with regard to donations and expenditures.

[justmeinoz]

99% ? I doubt that really. And they are a hell of a lot better off than a large part of the world's population too, just like most of the population of the Western (for want of a better word) world.  A sense of perspective needs to be applied I think.

Karen.

[Amazon D]

There is nobody "left out"  My vote and your vote count as much as Ted Turner's or some Kennedy.

If you want to better control the money in politics, support instead instant disclosure laws with regard to donations and expenditures.

to vote at www.the99declaration.org you have to register at the site... being registered to vote in your state doesn't allow you to vote at the site for delegates in your district.

[Semiopathy]

I support, completely, getting money out of politics.  Business, big or small, should not feel the need to throw away millions of dollars at politicians.  But with a mixed economy, where the government favors some businesses over others, it makes sense for a business to seek out those favors.  If business had nothing to gain from the government, then it would have nothing to gain from spending money to influence politics.  To get rid of money in politics completely would require a full separation of the state and economics.  Businesses would be forced to survive not on government handouts and political pull, but on their ability to provide quality goods and services that people would be willing to pay for.

[Carbon]

I think Marxists get too bad a rap. Think about all the stuff that was accomplished in the soviet union while the united states still had jim crow, incredibly strict gender roles, etc. People usually support Marxists because they want jobs, food, homes, and healthcare for themselves and their families and Marxists have gotten these things to the greatest number of people the most quickly.

I don't mind people being really critical of Marxists, but it bothers me when they ignore Marxists' achievements and then act like Winston Churchill, Woodrow Wilson, etc are heroes who could do no wrong. Winston Churchill was literally the head of a repressive empire!

[Jamie D]

I think Marxists get too bad a rap. Think about all the stuff that was accomplished in the soviet union while the united states still had jim crow, incredibly strict gender roles, etc. People usually support Marxists because they want jobs, food, homes, and healthcare for themselves and their families and Marxists have gotten these things to the greatest number of people the most quickly.

I don't mind people being really critical of Marxists, but it bothers me when they ignore Marxists' achievements and then act like Winston Churchill, Woodrow Wilson, etc are heroes who could do no wrong. Winston Churchill was literally the head of a repressive empire!

You've got to be kidding.  You are comparing racial discrimination to the tens of millions who died in the Stalinist purges?

[Carbon]

You've got to be kidding.  You are comparing racial discrimination to the tens of millions who died in the Stalinist purges?

No, I'm not. But honestly, I think the attempted genocide of native people, mexicans, and africans (the "tens of millions" is more documented here, too) is not on the same level as attempting to create a stable state through extreme force against dissidents, a state which also saved hundreds of millions of life. [edit: I was thinking about my post and I realized that "hundreds of million" is a giant exageration on my part. But tens of millions dying as a direct result of purges initiated by Josef Stalin is not realistic too or you wouldn't have seen the population increases. Why did I exagerate that much? No idea. Divide both our numbers by 10 and you'll get something more realistic.] The life expectancy in the USSR literally almost doubled, so there was death on a far more massive scale before Stalin.

If you read Stalin's writings you will see that he honestly believed there was no other way to safeguard the gains they had made in the lives of everyday people. IMO the Soviets were not able to create long term, functional society because they relied on that kind of force.

History is not black and white and the situation in the USA went far, far beyond "racial discrimination."