Question about hormones

[Adrilynn]

So, I got my estradiol yesterday but, not my spironolactone. It wasn't on the generic list at Walmart so there it would be about $45. At Walgreen's it would be about $35 with a Walgreen's card. I don't have the money for it at the moment but I think I can take the estradiol alone for a couple of days and be fine. If I'm not mistaken the spiro just blocks testosterone to let the estradiol work right? Because sometimes if there is too much estrogen the body will combat it by making more testosterone. But luckily mine is already lower than low without hormones and at 21 mine is only 290 ng/ml. Plus I'm going to drink spearmint tea and other natural anti androgens to help until I can get it. I think I should be ok right? For a little while at least. Plus my doctor prescribed me both in half the normal dose but twice a day to spread it out. I think that should help too right? 

[Dena]

It is possible to transition on estrogen as I did, but it's not as effective. I think you are better off checking with your doctor before altering the dosage or waiting until you have all you need before you start. Estrogen will not shut down the T factories and without doing that, you will only have limited effect from the estrogen. The blockers can greatly reduce the transgender discomfort you feel because that is cased by the presences of T in your system.

I don't think estrogen only is going to make much difference at first without the Spiro. It sure didn't with me.

[AnonyMs]

I started a bit like that. Not as effective, but sure felt good. Won't do any harm anyway.

[Adrilynn]

Oh alright,  I'm not planning on doing this forever,  just until I get the money for the spiro. Just wanted to make sure it wouldn't hurt anything. Like I said my testosterone is naturally really low. I'm 21 years old and its only at 290 when the normal range for men 18-40 is 350-1200. Also, I can already pass as a female without hormones or makeup.  I just put on an outfit and no stranger so far has been able to tell the difference.

[KayXo]

If I'm not mistaken the spiro just blocks testosterone to let the estradiol work right?

Not exactly. It also reduces testosterone and can even slightly increase estradiol (and progesterone) levels, but, it seems, not to a significant degree. The important thing to remember...it reduces AND blocks androgens, most notably testosterone and the more potent androgen, dihydrotestosterone (DHT). It also apparently seems to reduce conversion of T to DHT.

Because sometimes if there is too much estrogen the body will combat it by making more testosterone.

Incorrect. More E= less T. E does NOT, ever, convert to T but the opposite is true. E also appears to exert anti-androgenic effects within the body, like downregulating androgen receptors, increasing aromatase activity (increased conversion of T to E) and reducing conversion of T to DHT by inhibiting alpha reductase activity.

The idea that the body "combats" too much estrogen with increased T has absolutely no scientific basis and is nonsense.

Plus my doctor prescribed me both in half the normal dose but twice a day to spread it out. I think that should help too right?

Spiro doesn't last long in the body, hence the usual recommendation to take it twice daily plus the fact that Spiro taken all at once can have stronger diuretic effects which can be annoying (having to pee a lot) and can impact electrolytes too strongly.

It is possible to transition on estrogen as I did, but it's not as effective.

I disagree. Estrogen alone can sufficiently suppress/inhibit T and be enough for effective feminization. This has been observed and confirmed, time and time again, by several transwomen who end up with T levels under 20 ng/dl, sometimes, even under 10 ng/dl. It is true that orally, high doses may be required, hence slightly increasing risk of clotting (although disputable) but if taken non-orally, even high doses do not appear to influence clotting to any significant degree, based on studies and what we observe in pregnant women.

I don't think estrogen only is going to make much difference at first without the Spiro. It sure didn't with me.

It may not have with you because you weren't taking a high enough dose which might have been justified were you taking non bio-identical estrogens which affect clotting to a greater degree.

[Adrilynn]

Thanks for the information Kay, but to be quite honest I know you're probably just trying to help. However,  the way you came across as condenscending. Especially when you say something like what I said was "utter nonsense".

[RedheadWhovian]

I would say wait till you can afford the spiro, to ensure healthy and proper results, but that's just me.

[KayXo]

Thanks for the information Kay, but to be quite honest I know you're probably just trying to help. However,  the way you came across as condenscending. Especially when you say something like what I said was "utter nonsense".

Adrilynn,

I honestly didn't mean it as condescending, you have to believe me, I truly just want to help but I agree, what I wrote wasn't right and I apologize. It's just that I get so frustrated with all the of the myths that are being passed down and I have, several times, come across this assertion hence the reason why I wrote what I wrote. I was angry at the lies being propagated which have no basis in science and which harm people like us. That's all.

Take care,
Kay

[ChasingAlice]

My doctor said that high doses of E alone will work. I trust the Endo.

Is not confirmed yet,  but I will probably need shots,  not pills. I was also told that high doses of E will improve my cardiovascular system. 

[SanaRinomi]

XD My E receptors in my body must be gaping then! I have high concentrations of T and yet 8 Days on a low dose, pill HRT that I take once per night and I'm already starting to develop what others have said to take a month!

[Rachel]

Try Walmart for spiro.