Are there any heroes and good guys in Game of Thrones? PS! May contain SPOILERS!

[Sebby Michelango]

(PS! This threads may contain spoilers. You can spoil so much you want to in this thread. I'm not against spoiling. I'm happy for replies anyway.)

I've heard many people talking about Game of Thrones and says it's a good series. There are also people who cheers at difference characters. I hasn't watched so much of the show, but I watched a bit of it. I've seen many of the people in the show are horrible to each other. (My definition: Killing, torturing, beating etc. Things that hurts)

So my questions is, are there any heroes and good guys in Game of Thrones or are most of them either villains or "stupid" bloody machines? I understand Game of Thrones universe are in the medieval time, including supernatural things and dragons. In the medieval people had difference ideology and knowledge, also how they though, but they still knew what's hurting and what's good. People had feeling then too. Game of Thrones is about people want to get the throne and get power. But there are always some people who aren't interested in power or richness in real life, but just want peace and kindness. I have no idea if there are some in the show, therefor I asked and made this thread.

Daenerys Targaryen (The blonde chick) has difference sides, If I understand that right. Her brother and father affected her probably. Anyway, Dany wanted to give freedom to many slaves. Something I sees as a good act. But she also kills people. Not that kind of killing where people dies quick, but in very horrible ways like crucifixion and feeding her dragons with people. I understand she want to punishment people if they are criminals and don't follow the law (blah...blah...), but how you punish people do matter. All execution is inhumane and wrong in my opinion. But some execution is worse. Crucifixion and stoning is example worse than beheading and shooting. In the medieval time they didn't have so many prison or capacity. So I understand that issue. But what I don't understand is when Dany decides to punishment people in a inhumane way. Punishment them is ok, if it's done in a humane way. Humane prison and rehabilitation is a good way to punishment people, but torturing is a big NO. If she had to kill people, she could at least do it in a more humane way. I don't see Dany as evil, but not pure good either. She's a normal person and is both; good and bad. She's also pretty much naive. She is kind in that way she want to free the slaves and she cared about the innocent. But in the another way, she is pretty much harsh.

We have also Ramsay Bolten and Joffrey. In my opinion they are mostly arrogant, selfish and sadistic. Some of the worst people in the show.

QUESTIONS:
- Are there any heroes and good guys in the show?
- Who do you think is kindest and who do you think is the most evil one? Tell your opinion in the comments.
- Which acts do you think is good and evil in Game of Thrones?

You can example tell me what you think about Danerys T, Ramsay, Joffrey, Jon Snow and other famous big characters.

[kk]

I've only read/watched about half of Thrones, and I've deduced that Tyrion is one of the few good characters.  Unlike most (if not all) of his family, he's actually trying to do the right thing, but politics and expectations force his hand and put him in crappy situations that lead to not awesome decisions.

I guess I'd say the Stark children are good guys too, if young and inexperienced and not sure of what they're doing.

Something I like about Thrones is all the gray areas.  Most of the characters have their reasons for doing whatever they're doing, and they're not always acting out of pure malice or evil-ness.

[FTMax]

I think the show and the books they are based on, if nothing else, show that nobody can truly be defined as 100% good or 100% evil, and that much of what we interpret as good/evil depends on circumstances and morals. So I think the answer to your question really depends on what you see as heroic. You can have the purest motivations but still end up doing terrible things to people. Conversely, you can do good things in the course of accomplishing a selfish goal.

For the time period they're based on, I don't think anything we see in the show is inhumane. Rehabilitation did not exist at that time. Prisons as we think of them now also did not exist. People who do wrong need to be punished for more than just being made to understand what they did wrong. Like capital punishment or life sentences today, torture and capital punishment back in medieval times were also used as a deterrent for other people who may have had ideas about doing the same things.

Jon Snow is probably as close as we get to a hero. He had no aspirations of power due to his parentage, has compassion for those who are worse off, views the wildlings as people unlike most characters, and he's generally honorable. AFAI can think of, none of his choices have resulted in any kind of mass death. Yet he experiences some temporary lapses of judgment.

Daenerys is a gray area. While her ultimate goal (retaking the Iron Throne) is a selfish one that will result in a lot of death, she also has noble goals like freeing slaves. The one critique I have of her is that her most violent responses (feeding the guy to a dragon, crucifying all those people) were not based in logic but in emotion. The guy didn't give her any information that she was looking for, and after killing him she's no closer to figuring out what's going on wish the assassins. She also had no way of knowing if any of the people she crucified had killed slaves, and now she's no closer to getting that information. In some ways, she's a great leader because she inspires people to follow her but in moments like these she demonstrates poor leadership qualities by not thinking through her decisions.

And I would say that Ramsay and Joffrey are the closest we get to true villains. Both are the result of being raised without boundaries and then given power. They're meant to demonstrate the idea that absolute power absolutely corrupts. Both learned from their fathers that when in charge, you can do whatever you like. For Joffrey, he knew he was always destined to have power. In the beginning of the series, he's charming and diplomatic, but you can see glimpses of what he'll ultimately become. All it took was his sudden thrust onto the throne for the switch to be turned on. With Ramsay, he's worse because he knows his grasp on power is tentative and he's trying to force it through fear.

That's my take on it anyway.

[Sebby Michelango]

Thanks for answers. Very interesting.

[Lucynewman]

Game of thrones is based on medieval history, especially the war of the roses. For anything bad that happens, worse things happened historically. There is a realism that just isn't present in most fantasy stories, and its dark side is a big part od what makes it so good. As others have said, all the good people have evil qualities and all the evil people have at least 1 good quality.

- Are there any heroes and good guys in the show?
Yes, but for the most part they die quick. Jon Snow, the Onion Knight, Brienne of Tarth, and Beric Donadarrion are about the only ones that last. Tyrion is good and heroic at times, but he frequents whores and has people murdered. But, I think that makes him more heroic than the others. By having the courage to get a little dirty, he actually accomplishes more good than most others.

- Who do you think is kindest and who do you think is the most evil one? Tell your opinion in the comments.
Aside from minor characters, Tyrion is the kindest, and a lot of the suffering he endures is because of that kind streak. Even a lot of what you would call the good guys are fair, but I wouldn't say kind. Varus has a bit of a kind streak. Ramsey is most evil. Joffery is a 2nd, because at least his momma loves him. Also, Ramsey isn't an idiot, so his cruelty is thwarted less.

- Which acts do you think is good and evil in Game of Thrones?
Most of what the starks do is good. Except Arya. Granted she is justified, but assassins are evil by definition. Many of the chivalric knights are good, but that's explored a little more in the books. Much of danys story arc is good, but her body count brings her down to neutral. The church is both, the leaders tend toward evil, but many of the rank and file are good. Evil is too long a list. A lot of it has justification, like Tywin bleeding the riverlands. But there is a lot of rape and murder all over. You'd have to consider the walkers evil, and even my favourite  (the dornish) are poison happy killers. But my favorite thing is how all the evil people with a fee exceptions have good qualities. I hated cersei in the books, but I'm a big fan in the show, tywin too, and they're pretty evil. Also you have characters like the hound. He's evil as **** but in his arc he is redeemed. You go from hating him, to respecting him, to loving him.

My favorite character is Ser Bronn of the Blackwater. A lot of his dialog is the same as the book, like "Bronn, if I asked you to kill a child would you do so without question?" "Without question? No. I'd ask how much." Bronn is a survivor. He comes from low birth, and if he was good he would have died long ago. He's one of the best fighters but only goes into fights he can win. Amazingly, despite being a black hearted murderous bastard, he has more honor than most of the Knights in the show. He doesnt live a lie, and he knows exactly who he is and accepts himself for what he is.

Also, I'm one of those book readers, but the show is the best adaptation ever. So many characters I didn't care for in the books that the show made me love. I can't even argue that the books are better in this case, they're just more sprawling. Throw shade all you want, but the show runners did a very good job, and after season 4 or so, it's the only story where show watchers can spoil it for book readers. Also the casting is SPOT ON. Many of the characters are played by the exact actors I pictured before the show came, like Ned n Robert.

I love a song of ice and fire, to the point of obsession. A huge part of that is how there aren't exactly heroes and villains in a traditional sense, just incredibly flawed people. Like how the 'hero of the story' is a mopey bastard that doesn't know anything.

Read the Dunk n Egg stories if you wanna see how far Westeros fell. Good stuff.