"I knew you"....

[Jenntrans]

You know I have seen this on a lot of billboards signed by Jesus or God. "I knew you before I formed you in the womb". Does that not tell us that God or Christ did not know we were transgendered? Or does it mean people should transcend their common beliefs?

Just a legit question. I believe in God and Christ and don't think trans is a bad thing. Maybe we were meant to be?

[Roll]

I've always felt that being transgender, or rather the path to finding ourselves and our place in the world, is but a trial, fully intended for us to attempt to overcome.

[extraaction]

I've always felt that being transgender, or rather the path to finding ourselves and our place in the world, is but a trial, fully intended for us to attempt to overcome.

Those signatures were forged.  God doesnt design us, nature does.  She just watches.  A good portion of transgenders are the result of endocrine disrupting pollutants

[Roll]

Those signatures were forged.  God doesnt design us, nature does.  She just watches.  A good portion of transgenders are the result of endocrine disrupting pollutants

Keeping in mind this is the Christianity forum, and following the Christian view of God, that falls prey to the chain reaction/original mover issue in that even if you were to say nature designed us, because God designed nature, God in turn designed us, particularly given absolute knowledge and knowing how even what would seemingly be chaos would eventually turn out.

[Michelle_P]

Well, if I may make use of 12 years of religious training...  (Thank you, Jesuits!)

God does sometimes grant us gifts to use in our lives, if only we can recognize them. What we do with those gifts matters.

Recall the "Parable of the talents".  A man going on a journey calls his three servants together.  He entrusts 5 talents (a talent is about 80 pounds of silver, roughly 20 years wages at the time.) to one servant he sees as being very able, 2 talents to a capable servant, and one talent to the third servant.  Then, he leaves.  The servant with 5 talents invests them, and makes another 5 talents.  The servant with 2 talents invests them, and earns another 2 talents.  The third servant buries his talent, fearful of risking it.   The man returns after a long period and settles accounts with them.  The first servant returns 10 talents, the original 5 plus the investment gain, and the man praises him, granting him a high position.  The second servant returns 4 talents, the original 2 plus the gain, and the man praises and promotes him as well.  The third servant returns the original talent he buried.  The man decries his wicked and slothful ways, takes the one talent from him and gives it to the servant with the 10 talents.  "For to everyone who has will more be given, and he will have an abundance. But from the one who has not, even what he has will be taken away.  And cast the worthless servant into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

Now, when I was created, I had a family that was fairly well off, a good home, and I would develop with an intelligent and curious mind, the potential for a good education, as a white male.  I think God looked at this and thought "OK, this one has it pretty easy, and needs a special challenge to fully develop.  I think I'll give this one the soul of a woman and see what they do with that."  God caused my mother and doctor to use a new medication, DES, that made my brain ready to receive a female soul.

Now, having been granted this gift, and realizing what I have, what am I to do with it?  Shall I bury it, hiding it from the light, so at the end of my days I can only return this gift, unused and uninvested?   Or should I bring this gift into the light of day, use it to it's fullest extent, to let it grow and flourish, for the benefit of myself and those around me, so I may return this gift manyfold at the end of my days?

Now, there are those who would have me bury it, suffer in silence, for this gift makes them uncomfortable.  At The End Of Days, they may very well be cast into the outer darkness.  In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 

[Complete]

Well, if I may make use of 12 years of religious training...  (Thank you, Jesuits!)

God does sometimes grant us gifts to use in our lives, if only we can recognize them. What we do with those gifts matters.

Recall the "Parable of the talents".  A man going on a journey calls his three servants together.  He entrusts 5 talents (a talent is about 80 pounds of silver, roughly 20 years wages at the time.) to one servant he sees as being very able, 2 talents to a capable servant, and one talent to the third servant.  Then, he leaves.  The servant with 5 talents invests them, and makes another 5 talents.  The servant with 2 talents invests them, and earns another 2 talents.  The third servant buries his talent, fearful of risking it.   The man returns after a long period and settles accounts with them.  The first servant returns 10 talents, the original 5 plus the investment gain, and the man praises him, granting him a high position.  The second servant returns 4 talents, the original 2 plus the gain, and the man praises and promotes him as well.  The third servant returns the original talent he buried.  The man decries his wicked and slothful ways, takes the one talent from him and gives it to the servant with the 10 talents.  "For to everyone who has will more be given, and he will have an abundance. But from the one who has not, even what he has will be taken away.  And cast the worthless servant into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

Now, when I was created, I had a family that was fairly well off, a good home, and I would develop with an intelligent and curious mind, the potential for a good education, as a white male.  I think God looked at this and thought "OK, this one has it pretty easy, and needs a special challenge to fully develop.  I think I'll give this one the soul of a woman and see what they do with that."  God caused my mother and doctor to use a new medication, DES, that made my brain ready to receive a female soul.

Now, having been granted this gift, and realizing what I have, what am I to do with it?  Shall I bury it, hiding it from the light, so at the end of my days I can only return this gift, unused and uninvested?   Or should I bring this gift into the light of day, use it to it's fullest extent, to let it grow and flourish, for the benefit of myself and those around me, so I may return this gift manyfold at the end of my days?

Now, there are those who would have me bury it, suffer in silence, for this gift makes them uncomfortable.  At The End Of Days, they may very well be cast into the outer darkness.  In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

While l did not enjoy the privilege of maturing as a white male,  I did benefit greatly from a Jesuit education. I was also blessed with a strong body and a brilliant mind. Apparently, like you, l was also born with the soul of a woman. For me it truly came down to a test of my Faith. Despite all those long years of denial and frankly,  refusing to believe, it finally came down to the question, did I truly believe that voice in my head, that promise of eternal love.
When it finally came right down to it, l believed. I believed that if l followed that voice,  kept faith with that  promise,  It would all work out as God's Will.
So now,  that promise having been kept, what am I to do with my blessings? So far the best l have come up with is to bring one soul, in addition to my own, home to Jesus. I am still working on that. Anyone care to volunteer to be saved?

[Lady Sarah]

Well, if I may make use of 12 years of religious training...  (Thank you, Jesuits!)

God does sometimes grant us gifts to use in our lives, if only we can recognize them. What we do with those gifts matters.

Recall the "Parable of the talents".  A man going on a journey calls his three servants together.  He entrusts 5 talents (a talent is about 80 pounds of silver, roughly 20 years wages at the time.) to one servant he sees as being very able, 2 talents to a capable servant, and one talent to the third servant.  Then, he leaves.  The servant with 5 talents invests them, and makes another 5 talents.  The servant with 2 talents invests them, and earns another 2 talents.  The third servant buries his talent, fearful of risking it.   The man returns after a long period and settles accounts with them.  The first servant returns 10 talents, the original 5 plus the investment gain, and the man praises him, granting him a high position.  The second servant returns 4 talents, the original 2 plus the gain, and the man praises and promotes him as well.  The third servant returns the original talent he buried.  The man decries his wicked and slothful ways, takes the one talent from him and gives it to the servant with the 10 talents.  "For to everyone who has will more be given, and he will have an abundance. But from the one who has not, even what he has will be taken away.  And cast the worthless servant into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

Now, when I was created, I had a family that was fairly well off, a good home, and I would develop with an intelligent and curious mind, the potential for a good education, as a white male.  I think God looked at this and thought "OK, this one has it pretty easy, and needs a special challenge to fully develop.  I think I'll give this one the soul of a woman and see what they do with that."  God caused my mother and doctor to use a new medication, DES, that made my brain ready to receive a female soul.

Now, having been granted this gift, and realizing what I have, what am I to do with it?  Shall I bury it, hiding it from the light, so at the end of my days I can only return this gift, unused and uninvested?   Or should I bring this gift into the light of day, use it to it's fullest extent, to let it grow and flourish, for the benefit of myself and those around me, so I may return this gift manyfold at the end of my days?

Now, there are those who would have me bury it, suffer in silence, for this gift makes them uncomfortable.  At The End Of Days, they may very well be cast into the outer darkness.  In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Some times, we have no idea what to do when we are confused. This is when some of us pray to God for guidance. In my case, that guidance was given. If it had not been given, I would probably have been dead decades ago, and not by my own hand.
Bear in mind that I knew practically nothing about transitioning before my guidance was granted. There was no internet. There was no exposure to any of the whole thing until God showed me the way to be whom I was supposed to be.

[Jenntrans]

God does sometimes grant us gifts to use in our lives, if only we can recognize them. What we do with those gifts matters.

Who we truly are is a Devine Gift. What we do with them and how much we learn about not what we were born but rather Created takes a lot of work and a lot of courage. I do believe in an existence before and after our physical existences and who we were and who we are effects what and who we are in the physical world.

I am more Gnostic than Christian, not agnostic but actual Gnostic. I don't believe God or our Creator or whatever Name is neither male nor female but both in one existing in harmony. I do believe in Evolution but I also believe we were Created to Evolve. I do believe we were Created in God's own Image and that would make us the same both male and female. I do believe the physical world makes us decide one or the other or the natural world gives us one or the other characteristics. But we are realizing that what you see may not be the totality of it all. We are deeper. Eve ate from the Tree of Knowledge and thus we know ourselves better than any other physical animal in existence.

Yes I believe in reincarnation and do believe it is a Spiritual dynamic. Through Psychological studies of past life regressions and yes you may can even deem it Parapsychology, but there are some really good explanations for trans and LGBT as a whole. The thing that gets me is the consistency of the people that are regressed through hypnosis. One big one is that the subjects can't explain who or what God is other than God is nor can answer if God is Male or Female. Most say both.

To those that feel as if being trans is a curse, it isn't. Being the Son of God and the son of man, Christ was persecuted because he challenged the spiritual status quo and Crucified because he never gave in and or lied about who he was. Maybe there is a lesson there in which we may be persecuted but we can't be killed now because that is against the laws in most places. So the lesson would be to be who you are and embrace it. You will face persecution and hate but maybe we are supposed to overcome the fear and the pull of the physical world. Hey I was born a boy but I am not. I have no idea if the is a Heaven or Hell But I seriously doubt that I will burn in hell for eternity for embracing who I am and being true to myself. God Created me and maybe I asked for my situation or chose it even. I may have to pay for some things but I doubt I will spend an eternity in Hell though.

Regardless of if it is a sin or not, we were Created this way for some reason. I don't even or can't even try to explain why and the only thing I can say is from a belief in reincarnation that we have to experience both eventually to become whole.

I have no idea if any of what I wrote makes sense to anyone else but me. I hope it does resonate in others though. I hope it gives others hope. Mankind does not own God. Hell God don't even own us because he gave us all Freewill to choose how to live. Does any of this make sense or am I just insane? I really don't know but never feel bad about being who and what you are. Just be you. What will happen when I stop breathing I really don't know. No one has the definitive answer to that question but I think that is what Faith is all about.

I hope some of this makes sense though and gives someone a little hope because life an death is a total mystery.

[extraaction]

Keeping in mind this is the Christianity forum, and following the Christian view of God, that falls prey to the chain reaction/original mover issue in that even if you were to say nature designed us, because God designed nature, God in turn designed us, particularly given absolute knowledge and knowing how even what would seemingly be chaos would eventually turn out.

So everything is predestined?  Doesnt that negate free will?

[Roll]

So everything is predestined?  Doesnt that negate free will?

Predestination and foreknowledge are different. Knowledge of a choice someone will make does not negate the fact they made/will make/are making that choice out of free will. And that is even just dealing with a linear, human perception of time, which is illusory to begin with.

[extraaction]

Predestination and foreknowledge are different. Knowledge of a choice someone will make does not negate the fact they made/will make/are making that choice out of free will. And that is even just dealing with a linear, human perception of time, which is illusory to begin with.

Then why not just sort the wheat from the chaff based on the decisions they inevitably will make?  Isnt that just an exercise in futility?

[Roll]

Then why not just sort the wheat from the chaff based on the decisions they inevitably will make?  Isnt that just an exercise in futility?

Two ways to look at that.
1) We are limited by our perspective of what seems to be happening... Look at it instead from the position that all of time happens simultaneously. God would be above this human limitation of course, and thus to him, there is no waiting or inevitable, there simply is. Punishment (which is what I assume you refer to) is already happening as per the true nature of time, so there is no need to act beforehand--even more so because before does not even exist. In other words: He did sort/is sorting/will sort the wheat from the chaff, but it is something beyond our perception (as much everything is).
2) Simpler non-pseudo metaphysics answer: Because preemptively removing those who "fail" the great experiment of life will cause a ripple effect alter the parameters of that great experiment and void the experiment, meaning that none of it happened as he saw to begin with, which can't happen so he must not have done so, etc. etc. etc. Which is understandable he would not want it to be changed regardless, as we need the bad with the good in order to allow for the chain of events that brings us to our chance to make a choice to begin with. Sure, God could say "Oh hey, that guy is going to be a totalitarian dictator and kill a ton of people, might as well get rid of him now", but then what about the guy who found his worth by standing up to that dictator? What about the child who's experiences due to oppression went on to shape their kindness towards others? And since it wouldn't all be good, what about the guy who would be doing a pretty good job at life, only to show his true colors under the auspices of the dictator? Not allowing those events to play out, even with foreknowledge, would not be free will.

[extraaction]

Two ways to look at that.
1) We are limited by our perspective of what seems to be happening... Look at it instead from the position that all of time happens simultaneously. God would be above this human limitation of course, and thus to him, there is no waiting or inevitable, there simply is. Punishment (which is what I assume you refer to) is already happening as per the true nature of time, so there is no need to act beforehand--even more so because before does not even exist. In other words: He did sort/is sorting/will sort the wheat from the chaff, but it is something beyond our perception (as much everything is).
2) Simpler non-pseudo metaphysics answer: Because preemptively removing those who "fail" the great experiment of life will cause a ripple effect alter the parameters of that great experiment and void the experiment, meaning that none of it happened as he saw to begin with, which can't happen so he must not have done so, etc. etc. etc. Which is understandable he would not want it to be changed regardless, as we need the bad with the good in order to allow for the chain of events that brings us to our chance to make a choice to begin with. Sure, God could say "Oh hey, that guy is going to be a totalitarian dictator and kill a ton of people, might as well get rid of him now", but then what about the guy who found his worth by standing up to that dictator? What about the child who's experiences due to oppression went on to shape their kindness towards others? And since it wouldn't all be good, what about the guy who would be doing a pretty good job at life, only to show his true colors under the auspices of the dictator? Not allowing those events to play out, even with foreknowledge, would not be free will.

Not sure I agree, but Ive found our exchange to be very stimulating

[Jenntrans]

About predestination, I don't believe that even exist because of Freewill. But our destiny is decided by the decisions we make. That sounds complicated I know and kind of an "out" but... Spirituality is complicated more than simple. OK in a scientific sense, gravity distorts space and time but what is time outside of a gravitational environment in space? E=mc2 but what happens to time when there is no "m" to distort it? We perceive time according to the planet we live on. one revolution of the earth is one day or 24 hours and one rotation around the Sun is one year and we tend to measure things astronomically in light years according to our year on Earth. What happens if you can distort or warp space and time and go faster than the speed of light?

You know I investigate paranormal occurrences and maybe electromagnetic fields may distort space an time.  But High EMFs effect the body. Some people are susceptible to higher EMF fields. They get rashes and whatever and it will effect the mind too in the way of paranoid feelings, hallucinations and so on. But what if these hallucinations are not hallucinations but visions of another time? Einstein said that the past, present and future are all happening simultaneously. What if TIME is the answer to ghosts from the past and even shadow figures from the future. I have investigated both and I really don't have definitive answers, just my own theories such as the present is the reality and the past is memories and the future is dreams or fantasies. We can judge the past because of photos and what is a conscious memory but how can we perceive the future and what people will look like?

You know with all that said I believe it was Christ that said "with God all things are possible". Not some things but all things. Investigating the unknown has kind of given me a bigger view of the possibility of live in the Universe. It may be out of the spectrums that we can even begin to imagine or measure in our current technology.

So we know physics from our own world or planet which is Earth.  We do have the technology to learn about other planets in or solar system and around other stars but one technology we don't have is how to detect life outside of our spectrum of instruments or understanding. So what are angels and demons? We may believe in them or perceive them but one question is what are they? Maybe the demons are below our spectrum of physical senses but the angels are higher than our physical senses and the only way we can comprehend either is during psychological distress? So I am equating all this from a Christian point of view but Christianity is not the only religion.

I really don't know but I really wish science would delve itself into trying to answer these questions or mysteries. But much like common mankind even scientist get caught up in politics, narrow-mindedness and so on. They need funds for research so the political flavor of the day will give them the funds to support whoever is in charge and their ideology. That is sad to say but people will always sell out to the highest bidder. Some don't and are ridiculed by their peers but even Einstein believed in God but in a theoretical physicist's sort of way like most others do. How can any human alive explain God? I can't and even your highest priests nor anyone else can that is living and breathing now.

God gets really complicated and should be because reading a book won't help you, listening to someone else, even me and all the stuff I said won't help you. It is something that is inside you because if we were Created we were Created in the same Image of God.

So everyone please think about it and try to understand. We as humans on the Earth cannot survive physically outside of the planet. As spiritual beings and Intelligent Energy we may can if that is a possibility. One thing that keeps staying in my conscious is, "With God all things are possible." To me that means that we may have been Created Transgender or we are experiencing a different existence that gives us more internal knowledge and experience if you believe in reincarnation.

I just really don't know. All I know is me and my own experiences and no one is right or wrong as long as you don't hurt anyone else in the process. Hell none of this makes sense to me either. It is way complicated and shows an interaction with life that I can't even explain or comprehend but... Just dare to dream and learn meditation and look within.

I was born trans. I may be failing my lesson at life even. I don't think so though. Whatever reason I am trans whether it is physical or Spiritual but I had to follow it and see it through. But that is just me though. I have always been considered "gay" but I am not though. I was always a "sissy" and yes I acted like a girl. So to me whoever I was has been who I am and no more or less. To me it was harder to face critics and haters and suppress myself than it was to be open about it.

I really hope some of this makes sense.

[MaryT]

Then why not just sort the wheat from the chaff based on the decisions they inevitably will make?  Isnt that just an exercise in futility?

Unlike Einstein, I believe that God does throw dice.  Intelligent dice that choose (partly) how they fall.  God, whose omnipresence may include all of spacetime, may not have to distinguish between decisions that people have made and those that they inevitably will make.

And futility?  That presumes that unlike Job, we understand how God thinks.

[extraaction]

Unlike Einstein, I believe that God does throw dice.  Intelligent dice that choose (partly) how they fall.  God, whose omnipresence may include all of spacetime, may not have to distinguish between decisions that people have made and those that they inevitably will make.

And futility?  That presumes that unlike Job, we understand how God thinks.

Where does the bible say Job undetstood how god works or that god plays rigged gambling games with loaded dice to detetmibe the future/past/present

[Complete]

How is it that a discussion of and about our Christian beliefs has to be justified to atheists, non-believers and  self described insane alchemists ? I thought this was a support site. Where is the support for our own personal beliefs? Maybe non believers can start their own thread on the rewards of atheism or alchemy.

[Cindy]

 

Calm down please, if there are posts that require intervention from staff report them using the 'Report to Moderator' button.

[extraaction]

How is it that a discussion of and about our Christian beliefs has to be justified to atheists, non-believers and  self described insane alchemists ? I thought this was a support site. Where is the support for our own personal beliefs? Maybe non believers can start their own thread on the rewards of atheism or alchemy.

why can't non christians discuss the bible?  are we auto banned from a christian forum?  how does a christian ever expect to win over nonbelievers if they chase them away?

Justifying your beliefs is an faith strengthening exercise.  why all the hostility?

I am married to a Catholic.  We challange each others beliefs constantly, and we both grow in our spiritual paths every time we do.

[Brandon]

why can't non christians discuss the bible?  are we auto banned from a christian forum?  how does a christian ever expect to win over nonbelievers if they chase them away?

Justifying your beliefs is an faith strengthening exercise.  why all the hostility?

I am married to a Catholic.  We challange each others beliefs constantly, and we both grow in our spiritual paths every time we do.

Some of you guys tend to be real disrespectful about. Maybe that's why.