Trans in the Workplace: It’s Not Just About Gender

[Shana A]

Trans in the Workplace: It's Not Just About Gender

August 1, 2011 by Kyla Bender-Baird

http://msmagazine.com/blog/blog/2011/08/01/trans-in-the-workplace-it%E2%80%99s-not-just-about-gender/

Chris is a straight white man in his early 20s living in Maryland. Chris is also transgender. In October 2007, he left his job at a local amusement park because he could no longer put up with the severe homophobic harassment and transphobic dress codes he was forced to endure.

From the beginning, the pay was poor and Chris hated the job, but he stayed because he needed the work. His wife was also able to find a job there so that they could carpool together and save on gas. He put in long hours to make up for the low hourly wage. He even put up with being forced to wear the female uniform, even though this caused him great anxiety as a trans man.

[Ann Onymous]

For others I spoke with, having a strong educational background provided a buffer from workplace discrimination. Several people also pointed to their professional, high-skill jobs as part of the reason they were able to avoid discrimination as a transgender person.

Perhaps the most telling and poignant element of the article...and it seems to generally lend credence to the old saying that those who fail to plan have planned to fail. 

Further, with people coming out as transsexual earlier and earlier in the present era, there is NO reason for people to be entering the workforce without a proper college background that PREPARED them for decent employment...

[LordKAT]

Further, with people coming out as transsexual earlier and earlier in the present era, there is NO reason for people to be entering the workforce without a proper college background that PREPARED them for decent employment...

Other than a lack of funds

[Ann Onymous]

Other than a lack of funds

Unless someone had a drug conviction, student loans continue to remain available...which brings us back to there being no rational excuse for not pursuing the college education...

[tekla]

there being no rational excuse for not pursuing the college education

Oh I can think of bunches, including that tons and tons of college degrees really don't offer any employment anymore.  They are really expensive.  College degrees for a lot of people don't train them to do anything they are ever going to need to do.

Now, if you dropped the college part of that, and just stuck with education (and I know you really meant that, you just didn't type it out that way) to include trade and professional education and training, apprenticeship work and education - ya know, constant life-long learning, then I'm good with that.

[kate durcal]

there being no rational excuse for not pursuing the college education

Oh I can think of bunches, including that tons and tons of college degrees really don't offer any employment anymore.  They are really expensive.  College degrees for a lot of people don't train them to do anything they are ever going to need to do.

Now, if you dropped the college part of that, and just stuck with education (and I know you really meant that, you just didn't type it out that way) to include trade and professional education and training, apprenticeship work and education - ya know, constant life-long learning, then I'm good with that.

Get an engineering and/or hard sciences degree and you are guarantied to get a job

Kate D

[Anatta]

Kia Ora,

When you look at the whole picture...Sadly for some trans-youth, because of their effeminate/masculine nature, continuous bullying does tend to stunt their education opportunities...

Metta Zenda

[tekla]

Get an engineering and/or hard sciences degree and you are guarantied to get a job
Not true.  Depends on the specific discipline and the school.  Most hard science degrees really require advanced degrees to do anything other than teach HS.  Lots of unemployed automotive engineers around, we haven't hired aerospace engineers for decades now.  And that's hard academic work that not all are cut out for.  For a lot of people an apprenticeship work and education will pay them much more money over their life (with less debt to carry) than a college degree will.

"No reason" is a pretty absolute statement.
It is harsh, but so too is just about every employment situation.  Trans or not, it's very hard to find any work in 2011 without skills.

Sadly for some trans-youth, because of their effeminate/masculine nature, continuous bullying does tend to stunt their education opportunities...
Oddly enough, for others, it motivated and propelled them to even greater accomplishment - it's not a one-size-fits-all excuse.

[cynthialee]

Some of us are so damaged by GID that we are incappable of dealing with people long enough to get a degree.

And even if you do there is no gaurenty that you will be able to be find work in your field.

But to blame the victim is just plain mean.

Not every one of us is cappable of being in a white collar environment. Personaly it would drive me bonkers.
Hows about we concentrate our disdain for the society that dislikes us so much it makes our lives miserable, instead of bashing people who are not as capable as some others.

[Ann Onymous]

Hows about we concentrate our disdain for the society that dislikes us so much it makes our lives miserable, instead of bashing people who are not as capable as some others.

Why should there be disdain given that there are a significant number of transsexual persons who live perfectly normal lives and have no problem with securing and maintaining employment? 

Not everyone wants to play the 'poor me' card and blame society for their station in life...

[kate durcal]

Tekla,

If by time you are declaring your engineering type you have not done a survey of the hiring prospect in that field, or if knowing the prospects you still forge ahead, then you are a donkey and deserve to unemployed. Yes, even in engineering and sciences, in order to secure your future you have to seek advance degrees.

Cynthia Lee,

You argument of the "I have GID" reminds me of the "Oh, it is because I am Hispanic" narrative.

By the time we are eighteen year old or so, we all,GID-affected, black-affected, even the poor WASPs, have to get off our lazy asses, stop playing video games, turning tricks, make a plan, endure the sacrifices, work.

Stop using GID as a crouch, take responsibility for your action.

Kate D

[Arch]

I regularly teach students who cannot figure out how well they are doing in my class. They know how many points each assignment is worth. They know how many points they got on each assignment. They know what letter grade they got on each assignment. They know the course grading scale (what percent is an A, a B, and so on). And they still cannot do the arithmetic. I realize that such problems are a small part of math as a field, but I am never surprised when such a student tells me that he or she is retaking precalculus after failing it the first time.

I seriously doubt these students' ability to earn a bachelor's degree in engineering, let alone an advanced science degree. And most people are not interested in engineering. Otherwise, we would likely have a lot more people graduating with engineering degrees. Instead, many of these would-be engineers wind up being culled out in lower-division courses because they just don't have what it takes to do well.

On the other hand, the master plumber in my old neighborhood made more than my ex, an engineer. Granted, the plumber was older than my ex by about fifteen years at that time, and my ex hadn't topped out in his field yet--he was pretty much caught up by the time I moved out. But the plumber made a very comfortable living doing what he liked to do. He had his own business and a nice house in a very nice neighborhood. And no university degree.

[Randi]

I have been a plumber for many years but do not have the Masters license. There is a great deal of geometry involved in it and you also have to know the nature, heat tolerance, & or stress tolerance of various metals, plastics, and other building materials. If this man has that license you can be assured that he has done his homework and well deserves the wage he gets in return for the service he provides his customers.

If I had my time in college to do over I would persue my degree in Engineering. You can go just about anywhere with one of those.

Where I am now, I am at the bottom of the Admin totem pole trying to work my way up from the bottom again. NAFTA took my job away and left me with what ever I could nail down-and I have stayed there. Some days I think I am crazy for staying but it is a J O B and I can explore my feminity without fear of just getting tossed out with the trash! In many ways I have much to be thankful for.

Randi

[cynthialee]

Seriously?
You don't know the first thing about my life.
Don't make assumptions.

And I stand on what I said.
Some of us are pretty damaged by the entire GID thing. If you are able to get past it better than others fine and great. But do not denigrate those who are not as capable as you are.

[MarinaM]

"After waiting, earning a bachelor's degree and moving into a professional career requiring a special skill set, Tori was able to transition with minimal trouble."

...

[kate durcal]

Seriously?
You don't know the first thing about my life.
Don't make assumptions.

And I stand on what I said.
Some of us are pretty damaged by the entire GID thing. If you are able to get past it better than others fine and great. But do not denigrate those who are not as capable as you are.

I am not single out, but I can say: "Oh, so damge by GID, but that does not seem to stop you or other from getting boob or vags"

Forget about GID and degrees, there is all kind of people with many disabilities or handicaps who overcome them by shear will and hardwork and  excel in waht ever and make a decent living. Like they said in the post above, real state agents, salesmand, plumers, eletricians, etc

Do not buy the excuses

Kate D

[Korlee]

I am not single out, but I can say: "Oh, so damge by GID, but that does not seem to stop you or other from getting boob or vags"

Forget about GID and degrees, there is all kind of people with many disabilities or handicaps who overcome them by shear will and hardwork and  excel in waht ever and make a decent living. Like they said in the post above, real state agents, salesmand, plumers, eletricians, etc

Do not buy the excuses

Kate D

You and Ann seem to have it in your heads that everyone is exactly the same.  That each person born without an arm or some other BS all has a miracle talent deep within that makes them superman/woman that lets them overcome all of it.  After all each person grew up in the same schools, got beaten daily the same ways, raped the same way, spoken to by their parents the same exact way, has the exact same brain function as the person next to them, had the same kinda money, the same community to live in, or whatever other BS you want to pull out of your hat to say.

The simple fact is for every one -superjerk- out there that overcomes amazing odds?  There are ten more just like him/her with her/his disability that struggle each day just to get out of bed.  They do not have the brain type or skill to write with stub hands, swim without limbs, move fluidly without sight, yada yada.  No two people are even remotely the same.  Sometimes despite a miracle workers best efforts there are walls that can't be overcome for some people.  It means jack that you don't believe it because of one -superjerk- because that person could just be I dunno a -statistical anomaly-, had the right conditions to excel, the right community, support network, whatever that the next 99 people lacked.

Heck, the same is true for the plumber example.  The world can't be full of amazing plumbers! Also some areas don't even care if you are amazing they still pay you crap either way.  Lets not get into area politics or office politics that can steamroll even the best of people.  No matter how hard they try and or fight.  It can also only take one single mistake to ruin a persons reputation where they can never get work in that area again.

It just boggles my mind how you are trying to simplify life into some BS little cube.  That the ridiculous idea that one person can do something means everyone can!  The sheer disgusting truth is life isn't that damn beautiful!  Life is a disgusting horrid thing where there are an endless amount of lives where people get the shaft and it is no fault of their own.  The main thing that holds most people together to live is just that small light of joy they had five minutes ago before the five days of garbage. 

You have no idea what each person has went through, what their limits are, what they are good at, nada zip nothing.  Sometimes they themselves do not even know and with the endless possibilities out there?  They may never know even if they searched their whole life.  Nothing is as simple as you are making it out to be and it disgusts me you just claim all these people are nothing but losers making -excuses- so they feel better with failure.

Life is a struggle and sometimes only one goal at a time AT BEST is open to people.  Only someone who has been coddled can say what you have said with a straight face.

[LordKAT]

Unless someone had a drug conviction, student loans continue to remain available...which brings us back to there being no rational excuse for not pursuing the college education...

Not true, no drug conviction, cannot get student loan to cover what I need for a bachelors degree. Nice try though.

[Shana A]

A reminder from admin; please keep discussion civil and pertaining to the original topic. No personal attacks!

Z

[Ann Onymous]

Not true, no drug conviction, cannot get student loan to cover what I need for a bachelors degree. Nice try though.

Those were the only bars I have EVER seen to some being denied for Stafford loans (and this thread would be the first occasion where I saw a Stafford denied for someone without a drug conviction).  And pretty much outside of a drug conviction, all one needed to do other than be willing to attend an accredited school was to have a pulse and be able to electronically sign the app. 

I also know people who are still taking out upwards of $80K this year alone for law school (lesser amounts for some in other grad programs).  Loans still exist.  And as long as lending exists for educational and trade pursuits, there is NO rational reason not to pursue the very training that enhances ones ability to be hired in a job that pays the bills (and then some). 

And no, I was NOT someone who was 'coddled.'  I had nothing given to me.  Admittedly I should have had my education without out of pocket expense but I got stupid and drank the scholarship away (living on a college campus at the age of 17 when the drinking age was 18 was NOT a wise thing to have done).  Consequently, everything in my career came out of my pocket in one form or another, as has housing and vehicles.  Were there places in the career where I could have played a 'life isn't fair' card?  Sure.  But I didn't and by having CHOSEN to persevere, I got to where I am today...