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Will I need ffs?

Started by Stephanie_b, March 26, 2012, 12:08:15 PM

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Stephanie_b

I'm stuck with an avatar pic because I don't know how to attach pics with my phone...

I think that ffs will be required to pass...I hope the hormones will help a lot!
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Bird

Hi Steph!

HRT will change you a lot. Though I understand the desire to pass ASAP, it is best to let HRT work, let your hair grown and learn how to dress for your body type. Being a woman is very challenging.

HRT changes us a lot. I remember I desired to get full FFS before, but these days, I wonder if I will do any FFS at all.
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Beverley

From that photo you do not need ffs but a smile, longer hair and thinner eyebrows would make a BIG difference.

Many on here seem to think that perfection and beauty are needed to pass. Look at Donatella Versace. She passes but she has many features that FFS sets out to correct - high hairline, narrow eye, low eyebrows, poor definition around the mouth, larger then average nose (quite a fleshy one IMO). http://www.hellomagazine.com/profiles/donatella-versace/

Susan Boyle is another example http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_Boyle

Passing is about being perceived and accepted as female and a lot of it is in gesture, posture, voice and appearance. I would at least give the hormones time to work as they will make a lot of difference as will laser hair removal. Remember that most people you pass in the street cannot remember if you are black or white or male or female. Fine differences in facial features will be lost on most people.

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Stephanie_b

Quote from: Beverley on March 26, 2012, 12:27:50 PM
From that photo you do not need ffs but a smile, longer hair and thinner eyebrows would make a BIG difference.

Many on here seem to think that perfection and beauty are needed to pass. Look at Donatella Versace. She passes but she has many features that FFS sets out to correct - high hairline, narrow eye, low eyebrows, poor definition around the mouth, larger then average nose (quite a fleshy one IMO). http://www.hellomagazine.com/profiles/donatella-versace/

Susan Boyle is another example http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_Boyle

Passing is about being perceived and accepted as female and a lot of it is in gesture, posture, voice and appearance. I would at least give the hormones time to work as they will make a lot of difference as will laser hair removal. Remember that most people you pass in the street cannot remember if you are black or white or male or female. Fine differences in facial features will be lost on most people.

Thanks.  I am going to take another pic and smile in this one.  I get smile lines around my eyes though, and I need dental work.

I agree that the physical is only one aspect of passing, but I can't help it; I want to be pretty!  Lol, if possible.   ^-^
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luna nyan

Let the HRT do its thing for a while first before jumping to FFS.  We are all too keen on going under the knife and have a tendency to forget about the risks associated with surgery!
There are enough tricks with makeup and hair to make your presentation feminine enough once HRT has done its thing - I don't think you have a particularly heavy set facial bone structure.  (Hard to tell off one blurry photo though! :D)

Budget for it if you have to, and if you don't need it, you've saved up for a really nice holiday!

As far as dental is concerned - if you've got holes in your teeth get them dealt with quickly before it becomes too expensive!
Drifting down the river of life...
My 4+ years non-transitioning HRT experience
Ask me anything!  I promise you I know absolutely everything about nothing! :D
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sonopoly

I think that you already look quite female and with several months on hormones you should look very feminine.  Your nose is on the large side, but large noses aren't an exclusively male characteristic.  I would get on hormones for at least a year before you make a final decision.  I've seen some get FFS and look less attractive than they did before.  Listen to people who are objective.  I think people think that FFS is always better, but this is not the case. You are already very pretty.
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Amazon D

Sure you will pass as a guy after you take T shots.. oh change your name it sounds feminine. FFS most FTMs never get that. The T will change yo and make you look male after a yr or so.
I'm an Amazon womyn + very butch + respecting MWMF since 1999 unless invited. + I AM A HIPPIE

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sonopoly

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A

Quote from: sonopoly on March 26, 2012, 07:03:23 PM
She's an mtf, amazon...
Just had to quote the fail. Funny.

Anyway, Stephanie_b:

1. The picture has too low a quality for us to ever hope to tell you reliable advice.
2. Deciding on FFS before hormones is pointless. The effects HRT have on the face are vastly "random" (not quite random, but rather a genetic lottery), and no matter the starting point (except maybe in very extreme cases on both sides of the passing spectrum), it's hazardous to plan on FFS before seeing those.
3. And to begin with, FFS is not a good idea to be performed until about a year on HRT (or more), no matter the need, since tissue movements can still happen in the face and look weird with surgery.
A's Transition Journal
Last update: June 11th, 2012
No more updates
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Stephanie_b

Quote from: Amazon D on March 26, 2012, 06:38:05 PM
Sure you will pass as a guy after you take T shots.. oh change your name it sounds feminine. FFS most FTMs never get that. The T will change yo and make you look male after a yr or so.

Hahaha, I love you!  Well thanks so much, but I am mtf like was said.

As has been mentioned, the photo is blury; was set on beauty shot on my phone.  I haven't been able to get on this site much today...usually its not available on my phone.

I will be posting a better, clearer photo instead.  I am not very photogenic though; I appear quite different in person than I do in the photos (I look better).    :)
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Stephanie_b

Quote from: sonopoly on March 26, 2012, 06:08:57 PM
I think that you already look quite female and with several months on hormones you should look very feminine.  Your nose is on the large side, but large noses aren't an exclusively male characteristic.  I would get on hormones for at least a year before you make a final decision.  I've seen some get FFS and look less attractive than they did before.  Listen to people who are objective.  I think people think that FFS is always better, but this is not the case. You are already very pretty.

Awww, thank you very much!  Also yes my nose is on the bigger side unfortunately.  It looks a little smaller on profile shots, larger straight on.
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Alainaluvsu

Quote from: A on March 26, 2012, 07:35:51 PM
3. And to begin with, FFS is not a good idea to be performed until about a year on HRT (or more), no matter the need, since tissue movements can still happen in the face and look weird with surgery.

I'd go so far as to say no less than 2 years of HRT should be required before FFS. It takes quite a while for the face to round out completely. But A is pretty spot on with everything she said.
To dream of the person you would like to be is to waste the person you are.



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Stephanie_b

Quote from: Alainaluvsu on March 26, 2012, 09:42:20 PM
I'd go so far as to say no less than 2 years of HRT should be required before FFS. It takes quite a while for the face to round out completely. But A is pretty spot on with everything she said.

I tend to agree with you and what a said.  I probably will never come up with the money for ffs anyway.  I was just curious if people think that my starting point is okay, or not so good.

Guess time will tell

Also unfortunately a fee days ago my phone fell out of my pocket, while I was jogging.  Somehow I managed to stomp on it full force!
The lens has cracks in it now...will probably never take good shots again.   :embarrassed:
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Stephe

Quote from: Alainaluvsu on March 26, 2012, 09:42:20 PM
I'd go so far as to say no less than 2 years of HRT should be required before FFS. It takes quite a while for the face to round out completely. But A is pretty spot on with everything she said.

I agree but :P

Your nose and chin will not change from HRT and if either of those is extra manly, I don't see any problem with addressing them earilier. I had just my nose done 6 months into HRT and have no regrets. I would agree though on "full boat" FFS, wait and see what HRT does.
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supremecatoverlord

Quote from: Amazon D on March 26, 2012, 06:38:05 PM
Sure you will pass as a guy after you take T shots.. oh change your name it sounds feminine. FFS most FTMs never get that. The T will change yo and make you look male after a yr or so.

Why would a FTM even ask about facial feminization surgery?

xD
Meow.



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King Malachite

You appear to have a female-like face already.  With HRT that should do the trick.
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Zarania

Quote from: Stephanie_b on March 26, 2012, 12:08:15 PM
I'm stuck with an avatar pic because I don't know how to attach pics with my phone...

I think that ffs will be required to pass...I hope the hormones will help a lot!

No, you'll be perfectly fine after HRT.

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Lexy711

Quote from: Stephe on March 27, 2012, 12:05:11 PM
I agree but :P

Your nose and chin will not change from HRT and if either of those is extra manly, I don't see any problem with addressing them earilier. I had just my nose done 6 months into HRT and have no regrets. I would agree though on "full boat" FFS, wait and see what HRT does.

Amen to this, people should know that there are certain feature on the face that HRT cannot change. Like if you have a strong masculine square jawline, there is no way HRT can take your jawbone away. Or let's just say you have butt chin like a lot of men have, I don't think HRT can change that into a pointed chin either so sooner or later you will need to seek the help of FFS
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A

Stephe and Lexy711, yes, there is an influence when resorting to FFS before HRT has done its work. The fat AROUND the areas to be changed is the problem. That, and the muscles in the face that do change. They attach to bones, and if they change after the bones have been altered, it can yield unexpected results in time. And in some cases, just fat movement changes the way we see the same nose or chin entirely. It's still big, but it doesn't appear manly anymore.

And yes, HRT can actually do something for noses and even chins. A large part of the nose is cartillage, which can be affected (though definitely not as much as skin or fat) by HRT. On the chin, there is also a little layer of fat/thick skin that can be reconfigured, possibly rendering less visible any butt-chin effect; the muscles of the jaw nearby, too, can change. Anecdotal evidence of subjects under 25 have also (unscientifically) seen reports of bone changes.

Plus, I think most people getting their nose and chin worked on will probably have other bits to do.

For all these reasons and even more, probably, I still think that in every case, the more you wait, the better it is. And even if you're right, I think that whilst whether or not it is harmful not to wait is discutable, everyone agrees that waiting can in no way hurt, right?
A's Transition Journal
Last update: June 11th, 2012
No more updates
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~RoadToTrista~

Listen, in my time on Susan's I've seen that most mtf's have their looks drastically improve over a period of months to years with HRT. I mean before I thought that was the best that their faces were going to get but then, DAMN. You need to give it a couple years before deciding FFS, it might just be a waste of money. Plus your face looks fine now anyway.
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