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Fear of Men

Started by pretty, October 13, 2012, 12:48:48 PM

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pretty

Does anybody else have this?

Ok I love my bf and trust him immensely but for people I have never met before I find it very hard to trust or be comfortable around men... do you think this is kind of a normal MTF thing or am I just crazy??  :-\ I do have a little general anxiety but usually I am mostly fine around other girls, but with guys I just feel like they are judging me a lot and that if I talk to them they are going to hurt me or something... I get really anxious interacting with them and just want to make an excuse to leave ASAP.

It feels like it must be because of growing up scared that boys would expect you to be "one of them" and having your femininity made fun of... but yeah so I wonder am I alone on that?? And does anyone have any ideas on how to fix it?  :-\

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Adam (birkin)

I think it's normal for anyone who has been victimized by guys. I'm a guy, and I felt the same way for a long while.

I fit in pretty well with the guys when I was in elementary school, and was often the only "girl" in any given group of boys. But when we all hit puberty I had a handful of men that I could trust, and the rest bullied me and ostracized me. I also didn't have a lot of involved or positive male role models in my life outside of school. So I began to associate exclusively with women, and it's been that way ever since. I'm starting to feel a little bit better about it now that I am on T, though, because I understand some of what's going on.
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Constance

I've always felt somewhat intimidated by males, whether boys in school or men nowadays. Hell, when I see a group of young men (perhaps high school age) I still feel a little nervous.

I think .caleb nailed it with: "I think it's normal for anyone who has been victimized by guys."

Shantel

Not fearful but somewhat disdainful having had to deal with a bunch of Neanderthals looking like walrus's with all that hair sticking out of their faces, food stuck in their moustaches stained by nicotine, a big wad of chew, blowing stinking breath that smells like sh** in my face, a mix of chew and last nights barf from too much booze. As they lean over and tell me about their great sexual exploits with women.
I go really??? :icon_yikes:
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pretty

Quote from: TessaM on October 13, 2012, 12:53:23 PM
When I was little I had the same feelings. Men scared me with their beards and attitude. The way they would generally comport themselves was disgusting to me, scary even. Maybe I was sub consciously being intimidated, iuno, but in my head men were "bad" and women were "good." All of my friends in preschool until the end of elementary school were girls.

As time progressed I kinda got over it. Put yourself in situations where youll have constant interaction with men, and youll see how nowadays most are more than acceptable  :laugh: Now I think of other things  >:-)

Are you in school? Im sure theres lots of guys there, try to befriend some with similar interests! They don't have to be the football stars, they can be the lady gaga monsters, painters, etc.

I am not in school now but when I was a yr or so ago it was kinda tough...

Actually I was in a night class once that only had 2 other girls in it and the other like 19 were guys. I think that just added to my anxiety because it was pre-transition and a lot of things they said about women especially during breaks, really bothered me and I got really avoidant because I was afraid they were gonna expect the same from me and because I was too afraid to bitch at them about it. But they would insult the female teacher behind her back and call her a slut and whore and demean her just because they didn't like the way she taught the class.

I know there are better guys than that out there but sometimes it feels like almost all guys think about is sex and that is all they can see in a woman, and even guys you thought weren't like that would surprise you if they said what they REALLY thought.

Lol Lady Gaga monsters, I love that, I guess I never met many guys like that.

Quote from: .caleb on October 13, 2012, 01:12:12 PM
I think it's normal for anyone who has been victimized by guys. I'm a guy, and I felt the same way for a long while.

I fit in pretty well with the guys when I was in elementary school, and was often the only "girl" in any given group of boys. But when we all hit puberty I had a handful of men that I could trust, and the rest bullied me and ostracized me. I also didn't have a lot of involved or positive male role models in my life outside of school. So I began to associate exclusively with women, and it's been that way ever since. I'm starting to feel a little bit better about it now that I am on T, though, because I understand some of what's going on.

Thanks Caleb  :)

I can understand that perspective too. It must be so hard growing up as the "girl" in the boys' only club, especially if you are a boy inside. It seems like after puberty everyone just took sides and girls and guys couldn't have real friendships anymore...  :-\

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eli77

Yep. I'm way less comfortable around guys. I think it's just bad experiences with being physically intimidated. Guys make me nervous because somewhere in the back of my head is the fear of getting hurt. Guys that I know or are over-60 or are visibly queer get a pass, but otherwise I can feel my body start tensing up.

I find if I'm with someone that I trust or I'm in a space that I'm used to, I'm a bit more relaxed. And if talk to the same guy a few times, I get used to them and then I'm fine. It also depends on their body language - if they are tense or nervous or aggressive that makes it so much worse.

Quote from: Connie Anne on October 13, 2012, 01:52:03 PMHell, when I see a group of young men (perhaps high school age) I still feel a little nervous.

Groups of younger guys are the worst of anything. I used to have to walk home in the evening past this group of young guys hanging out and smoking pot on the path to where I lived. They were never anything but polite to me. But seriously. So so scary.
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SarahM777

A whole lot of fear here. (But understandable) Even when I was a kid there was no way I would spend time during the holidays with the men folk. Including my father and grandfathers. I spent my time in the kitchen with the ladies. PE was a nightmare.
Answers are easy. It's asking the right questions which is hard.

Be positive in the fact that there is always one person in a worse situation then you.

The Fourth Doctor
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Ave

hmmm, not all guys intimidate me, but certain types at my school do if they're especially masculine. I just find their presence overbearing and annoying.


I can see me
I can see you
Are you me?
Or am I you?
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Kelly J. P.

 I am fearful of most people, but it's generally on an individual basis. I start out being untrusting and distant, but if they show that they are a good person, then I will be able to grow closer. And, of course, if they show that they can't be trusted, or that they're not a good person, I will remain distant, maintaining a relationship only if I need to deal with that person for work, or some personal advantage.

There are many good people, but there seem to be even more hurtful ones. That is my experience, so far.
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Alainaluvsu

Yes.. especially when they "notice" me. I'm into men and only men... but the anxiety I feel towards them now is more scary than it used to be pre transition. I just feel much more vulnerable around them now. Even when they open the door I find it hard to look them in the eye. Some of that, however, is a result of learning that if you look them in the eyes long enough they'll think you're flirting with them or something.
To dream of the person you would like to be is to waste the person you are.



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ZoeNicole

I suspect it might be normal to be wary of unknown men just from a female point of view. Not saying guys are evil or anything but just from a female point of view you would feel safer around other girls and wary of guys you don't know. Just my thoughts on this. Also if you were bullied by guys or made fun of by guys your view on this would also be skewed. As such I feel much safer coming out to other women as opposed to men.


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A

I think it's mostly related to life experiences. In my childhood, my female cousins, and some of my very first classmates, excluded me, mainly because I was a boy trying to fit in with girls, and also because I have the habit of just doing everything wrong when it comes to social contacts... They rejected me and made me feel like I was "out of their clique". To be fair, though, most of my cousins are mean to begin with.

So I stuck with boys, mostly. Girls wanted nothing of me, anyway, and my association with them was always discouraged by my father. And well, I always need to get used to things to try them. Even now, almost always, someone has to take my hand and do something with me, explaining each step, at least once, or I won't feel comfortable doing it alone.

Life hadn't taught me how to be friends with girls. Indeed, most summers, my mother was subscribing me to a summer day camp that had the weird idea of separating boys and girls at almost 100 %. Since such a place is the best occasion to socialise...

So now, even though I don't really feel like I fit with them, I'm mostly okay with boys. Boys, that is. Men, they've always repugnated me (though of course that's a strong word to describe how I feel now - even I evolve!), because they were what I absolutely did not want to become. And since I have this habit of always needing to put an absolute value on things because at some point I stopped allowing myself to have an opinion, men became evil in my mind.

So with my male classmates who still somewhat look like boys/teenagers, I'm pretty comfortable. But those who look more like men - one of them, for example, is fat, hairy and bearded - I don't like to be with them much, out of my will. I can get used to them, and for some of them, I do, but even in those cases, I feel the need to make efforts to interact with them.

Almost the same rule applies to men. The softer, the nicer they seem, the more not-so-masculine or young their voice sound, the higher their "baby face factor", the less hairy or bearded they are, the less uncomfortable or fearful I am.

And similarly, the more females still look like girls/teenagers, the more I'm uncomfortable with them, because they and I once teamed up to teach my brain not to be with them. At high school, it was roughly the same. Most of my female friends were, in appearance and mind, more like women, whilst the few girls I stayed away from were younger-looking.

The problem is much less present now since females grow to look very much like their adult selves younger, and it was already not so present in high school for the same reasons, but still: I'm always more comfortable, in terms of first impression, with girls who appear older and/or more mature than I.

And of course, I've always felt much more comfortable with women, so much that considering my average not-so-social self, it's surprising.

So uhm, yes. My life has shaped me to be with boys and women, and away from girls and men, and that's how I still am to a degree.

I think being a transsexual and thus loathing to become a man has a relatively high chance of triggering a fear of men, but it greatly depends on how you lived it. In the end, all of that is just a persistence of who we learned to fear or like in the past.
A's Transition Journal
Last update: June 11th, 2012
No more updates
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peky

Fear no one, and fear them all. (make no exceptions, this goes for man, women and children, young, adults or old, able or disable)

Everywhere, you are to maintain discreet scanning and remember: who, where, surface type, lightening, furniture, doors, windows. Brief eye contact with all, "I see you, no challenge," then ask yourself "what I am prepared to do?" 

Have fun, enjoy yourself, but keep sending the "I am not a victim, I see you" energy.

One big exception are the drunks, I put as much distance between drunks and myself, as they are unpredictable; I also avoid bars and disco places unless I go with a large crowd.

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A

Heh, I felt like adding this. It's funny how it seems to be common to be more fearful of teenagers and young men, while I have the exact contrary. I guess it really is based on experience. That, or I'm just weird.
A's Transition Journal
Last update: June 11th, 2012
No more updates
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Natkat

not for men, But I do have alot of people I feel rather phobic about.

I have bad fellings for cisgenders who is very hetronomative somethimes because im unsure how they will react to me when they know, or my friends. this is not as bad now but there had been times where I found it very hard to trust unless they already was my friends.

but mostly I got a big fear of therapist because I had alot of bad experience there, I tried to go to a therapist some years ago and no matter how friendly she was I still felt very uptight and horrible about the visit.

so no I dont have fear of men but I do understand that you with bad experience feel certain people are harder to trust than others.
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Shantel

Quote from: Alainaluvsu on October 13, 2012, 03:28:20 PM
Yes.. especially when they "notice" me. I'm into men and only men... but the anxiety I feel towards them now is more scary than it used to be pre transition. I just feel much more vulnerable around them now. Even when they open the door I find it hard to look them in the eye. Some of that, however, is a result of learning that if you look them in the eyes long enough they'll think you're flirting with them or something.

Yeah, that's how cis women initiate a flirt, and if the guy acknowledges the eyeball contact by connecting his gaze with hers, then comes the smiles both ways followed by "Hi!" Been there too many times in the past life, I could write a book on the subject.
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Joann

I had a bad experience at a gay bar once and always watch out for that strange personality gay, male, female, cis ect that says
"I can use you" >:(
♪♫ You dont look different but you have changed...
I'm looking through you,. Your not the same ♪♫ :)
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Shantel

Quote from: Joann on October 13, 2012, 08:22:20 PM
I had a bad experience at a gay bar once and always watch out for that strange personality gay, male, female, cis ect that says
"I can use you" >:(

I hate that, heard it from potential employers as an independent type, it always created a mental picture of being bent over a log out back somewhere like in the movie Deliverance.
My reply was always: "Uh - I think not!"
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V M

Like anything in life, it is all based on the situation at hand and the individuals involved  :)   I generally do my best to be polite and unassuming, but if the red flags start popping up I will distance myself

I was picked on a lot in school and at church (Gee, wonder why she's not the religious type) ::)  After awhile you begin to pick up on various basic personality traits  :)  This awareness helps you to avoid obviously bad situations without being paranoid

I also started studying martial arts and learning to defend myself, this took a lot of the fear out of the equation  :)  When a bully realizes that you are not afraid of them, they will usually move on to other things

Sure, sometimes I still get nervous or feel intimidated around some individuals but I do my best to not let it show
The main things to remember in life are Love, Kindness, Understanding and Respect - Always make forward progress

Superficial fanny kissing friends are a dime a dozen, a TRUE FRIEND however is PRICELESS


- V M
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Christine

 Caution is always advised when in unfamiliar areas or situations. For me the anxiety comes from no longer having the physical ability to seriously defend myself without hardware.  Local situations are no problem.  I have never been able to relate to men from the git go and as a result I have become wary of the younger crowd. If I believe it may be unwise to go someplace I simply avoid the area or situation.
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