Body dysphoria and intimacy

[Devlyn]

You forgot "write your name in a snowbank" didn't you?

[geek]

You forgot "write your name in a snowbank" didn't you?

maybe >.>

ok so i have some stupid things i'd do if i could that just makes me cheeky! dont judge me Devlyn! 

[Nero]

Another vote here for "attracted to women, but finds it very difficult to be intimate with women".  However, this is getting easier for me.  As I come to be more comfortable with who/what I am, my sexuality definitely slides more towards heterosexual.  For me the problem is largely a kind of paranoia because

1)  I don't feel comfortable with women
2)  I don't like touching or looking at my own entertainment system, and I'm scared I'll freak out if I get up close and personal with a woman's.  It's really rude and offensive to freak out on your lover's equipment.

As to number 1, that's just because I suck at being a woman and don't fit in with women.  Knowing that I'm not supposed to fit in is gradually eroding that one, and that is the biggest problem for me.  To address problem number 2 I basically rely on getting horny enough to shut down the part of my brain that handles dysphoria.  To put it crudely but accurately, the need to shoot my load is usually strong enough to override the dysphoria, and that takes care of physical intimacy.  I also find porn really helpful in terms of getting comfortable with the fact that women's genitalia looks a lot like mine.

My two cents on surgery: even if the cock fairy magically sorted out my trouser problem right now, that wouldn't make it much easier for me to be intimate with women.  It's not really about the equipment.

Love the 'entertainment system' analogy. 
Yeah, a lot of my issues with women stem from not being able to relate to or understand them. And since I've had strong connections with guys, I do notice the 'understanding' gap probably more than straight guys would. You know, if I'm with a dude, we bond through stuff we do together.

We go through intense, daring type situations together that I just can't see happening with a woman. Or equally intense emotional stuff that simply wouldn't be the same if they were female. Mostly because while I sympathize with women, I can never empathize with them. Except in regular human situations, like of course I can empathize with losing a loved one or something. But I don't get how their mind works. I don't know if exclusively straight guys can or what.

But I'm also uncomfortable with females due to experiences like them sitting around laughing at me every day in school. 

[Devlyn]

maybe >.>

ok so i have some stupid things i'd do if i could that just makes me cheeky! dont judge me Devlyn! 

I won't judge you, hon. Not until after I see your penmanship!

[geek]

I won't judge you, hon. Not until after I see your penmanship!

note to self, buy a water pistol and learn to activate it hands free so you can marvel at my skills!

[insideontheoutside]

When someone says "I only see you as male" it doesn't mean necessarily that they think you match up 1:1 to a cisguy, or that they're just playing along to make you feel better. It probably just means, "you're you, and I am attracted to you, so stop squabbling over details and get over here"

Ha I've pretty much heard that exact line. I know other people don't have a problem with my body, it's me who does. Consciously I know what has to happen ... I have to accept what is, is what is, that sort of thing. Problem is I can say that all day long but totally resist it in my mind. I'm overly stubborn, I know, so I'm trying to find different approaches that might placate my brain and actually help me over this ... help me to accept what I can't change and help me to relax and trust in/give in to another person.

Another vote here for "attracted to women, but finds it very difficult to be intimate with women".  However, this is getting easier for me.  As I come to be more comfortable with who/what I am, my sexuality definitely slides more towards heterosexual.  For me the problem is largely a kind of paranoia because

1)  I don't feel comfortable with women
2)  I don't like touching or looking at my own entertainment system, and I'm scared I'll freak out if I get up close and personal with a woman's.  It's really rude and offensive to freak out on your lover's equipment.

As to number 1, that's just because I suck at being a woman and don't fit in with women.  Knowing that I'm not supposed to fit in is gradually eroding that one, and that is the biggest problem for me.  To address problem number 2 I basically rely on getting horny enough to shut down the part of my brain that handles dysphoria.  To put it crudely but accurately, the need to shoot my load is usually strong enough to override the dysphoria, and that takes care of physical intimacy.  I also find porn really helpful in terms of getting comfortable with the fact that women's genitalia looks a lot like mine.

My two cents on surgery: even if the cock fairy magically sorted out my trouser problem right now, that wouldn't make it much easier for me to be intimate with women.  It's not really about the equipment.

I don't think I'm really "comfortable" with anyone, but for opposite reasons. I'm okay with what everyone else has got and I know what to do with it. But here's the thing I've learned about women ... most of them feel really put off if they're not allowed to reciprocate. They also feel really put off if they sense you're not, "in the moment" with them. That is, you're just closing off your brain and trying to focus on either just getting through the ordeal or just getting off. It seems a lot of women get this huge "bonding" thing out of it and are really keen on the whole intimacy thing. And if you're not, they feel like you don't really love them/want them, etc. I imagine also that most people (male or female) do like to be able to bring their partner some satisfaction. So if you remove that from the equation (the "you can't touch me" thing) then that also leads to that party feeling bad.

You're the first one that's mentioned porn as well (at least I think). Porn has its purpose I think. Hasn't really helped me much watching it unfortunately. The only stuff I enjoy watching is stuff with either girls I find attractive (but only doing certain things) or with guys who look remotely similar to me in some way (so basically andro looking smaller dudes ... and that's tough to find them in straight porn lol).

I am in agreement that the cock fairy would be a magical thing.

[Nero]

I know other people don't have a problem with my body, it's me who does. Consciously I know what has to happen ... I have to accept what is, is what is, that sort of thing. Problem is I can say that all day long but totally resist it in my mind. I'm overly stubborn, I know, so I'm trying to find different approaches that might placate my brain and actually help me over this ... help me to accept what I can't change and help me to relax and trust in/give in to another person.

Hmm we could probably give better advice with more info.

First I'd ask what's specifically bothering you during sex? Physically and mentally?

[insideontheoutside]

Hmm we could probably give better advice with more info.

First I'd ask what's specifically bothering you during sex? Physically and mentally?

Well it's been awhile, and I'd pretty much resigned myself to a life of abstinence because previously I had what I'd imagine are the typical trans issues of just not feeling "right" when in any sexual situation. I used to have to be at least somewhat intoxicated just to do anything, and then I still had this whole set of rules I'd impose on the other person (can't touch me in certain places/ways, can't have the lights on, can't remove all my clothes, blah blah blah). The few times I'd tried completely sober engagements with people I'd nearly have a panic attack. So there's a lot of fear involved. I'd like to be one of those guys that's just cool with what I got and use what I got, but my mind goes into overdrive thinking that if I do that I'm basically having "lesbian sex" (screwed up, I know). So yeah ... lots of fun issues to try to sort though!

[Mosaic dude]

It seems a lot of women get this huge "bonding" thing out of it and are really keen on the whole intimacy thing. And if you're not, they feel like you don't really love them/want them, etc.

Yes, I've noticed that women (warning: here comes a sweeping, ignorant generalisation) like to use sex as a means of emotional bonding.  I don't - I do my emotional bonding in other ways and sex is just an itch to be scratched for me, so I have a problem there too.  I would think this would be something that you would need to discuss in a lot of depth with the right girl, and I could see where this might be really hard for someone to deal with.  I also think if she cares about you she should make an effort.

Well it's been awhile, and I'd pretty much resigned myself to a life of abstinence because previously I had what I'd imagine are the typical trans issues of just not feeling "right" when in any sexual situation. I used to have to be at least somewhat intoxicated just to do anything, and then I still had this whole set of rules I'd impose on the other person (can't touch me in certain places/ways, can't have the lights on, can't remove all my clothes, blah blah blah). The few times I'd tried completely sober engagements with people I'd nearly have a panic attack. So there's a lot of fear involved. I'd like to be one of those guys that's just cool with what I got and use what I got, but my mind goes into overdrive thinking that if I do that I'm basically having "lesbian sex" (screwed up, I know). So yeah ... lots of fun issues to try to sort though!

Fear is a terrible thing.  This, to me, kind of sounds like a phobic reaction.  When you have an autonomic reaction like a panic attack it ain't garden variety fear anymore, it's something a bit more than that.  Obviously I don't know too much about your situation, but would you be able to talk to a therapist about this stuff?

[insideontheoutside]

Fear is a terrible thing.  This, to me, kind of sounds like a phobic reaction.  When you have an autonomic reaction like a panic attack it ain't garden variety fear anymore, it's something a bit more than that.  Obviously I don't know too much about your situation, but would you be able to talk to a therapist about this stuff?

What's sad is I've been to both regular therapists and a gender therapist. The regular therapists were early on in life and I feel damaged me pretty badly by basically saying I was crazy and that I was female and should just accept that role/life/body/etc. The gender therapist wasn't much better. Because I'm not interested in transition, they basically said I'm really not trans and certainly not male so I should again just accept it and move on. Pretty crappy advice if you ask me. Granted this was like 10 years ago so I'd really hope gender therapists would have evolved past that kind of thinking by this point. There's one therapist in my town now that deals with gender issues and she actually knows me (through business, not from me having seen her in a therapy capacity). I've considered trying it again but I just feel like it will be a waste of time and money. And once you start talking about sex with a therapist it gets even more complicated. For me it's really cut and dry in my mind – I want to have sex a certain way and do certain things and I can't quite pull it off with this body (and certain things are never going to be like it would be if I had all the proper equipment from word go). I don't have enough experience in the sex department to know anything else and how I've reacted to certain things in the past. I know that if my body matched my mind (we're talking perfect male body here ...) I would not have a problem getting with someone intimately. But as it is, with the body I have, I've pretty much been like, "f**k that" (no pun intended) because it was too much frustration, I wasn't getting any pleasure out of it at all, in fact it was making me more anxious and just magnifying what wasn't "right" in my mind. So this whole thing is kind of a last ditch effort to attempt to get something out of the experience other than frustration and disgust.

I think most of us have determined that the magical cock fairy isn't going to show up for us, so now it's just down to trying to figure out things like; what CAN we be okay with/accept, what things are uncomfortable but we can learn to get around, and yes for some people, what surgeries or therapies can you have to try to make this better. I know for a fact that if I wasn't opposed to surgery and had it, it wouldn't make it better for me. In fact the more I thought about it the more I thought it would actually make it worse for me because then I'd be stuck with something else I didn't like.

[Mosaic dude]

What's sad is I've been to both regular therapists and a gender therapist. The regular therapists were early on in life and I feel damaged me pretty badly by basically saying I was crazy and that I was female and should just accept that role/life/body/etc. The gender therapist wasn't much better. Because I'm not interested in transition, they basically said I'm really not trans and certainly not male so I should again just accept it and move on. Pretty crappy advice if you ask me.

That's disgusting.  This is why I have reservations about therapy as an industry.  Some therapists are excellent, but there are also some real cowboys out there!

[insideontheoutside]

That's disgusting.  This is why I have reservations about therapy as an industry.  Some therapists are excellent, but there are also some real cowboys out there!

Yeah I know. And it's such a costly crap shoot. I've never had insurance that covered therapy so it was always like $50 - $90+ a session. If you have the misfortune of having been to a crap therapist you can at least tell pretty quickly if someone else is going to go down that road, but it's hard to judge by just a phone call to set an appointment so you usually have to commit to an appointment to tell.

I still may consider this local lady only because what I've seen of her, she's a bit of a gender bender herself so there might be a little more understanding there.