Yeson voice feminization surgery

[Jennygirl]

It's about 10K usd for the trip.

7350 for the surgery itself, 400 extra if you have a vocal tremor and need botox

[Lauren5]

It's about 10K usd for the trip.
7350 for the surgery itself, 400 extra if you have a vocal tremor and need botox

How long did you stay? Cause 10K sounds a little high. But being an airline guru, I know how to take shortcuts to cut it down a bit.
So something else to add as a possibility.

[Paige0000]

Other question how do you find your crying sounds have changed? I hate it when I really tear up my vocal sobs sound quite masculine, which really annoys me.

[Evolving Beauty]

Can someone please explain what's the botox all about related to this surgery? Still don't get it.

[Jennygirl]

How long did you stay? Cause 10K sounds a little high. But being an airline guru, I know how to take shortcuts to cut it down a bit.
So something else to add as a possibility.

Yeson asks that you stay 9-10 days

this is about how my trip ended up~
Day 0.5 arrive (Monday Seoul time)
Day 1 pre op exam & consult
Day 2 surgery
Day 3 recovery
Day 4/5+ visiting & exploring
Day 9 post op exam & consult
Day 10 depart

You might be able to shave a day or two, but I wouldn't recommend risking it. The first week of recovery is the most important of all!

Other question how do you find your crying sounds have changed? I hate it when I really tear up my vocal sobs sound quite masculine, which really annoys me.

I think the hardest thing to control during that moment is resonance. Everything seems to want to open up (larynx down from lump in the throat) and for me it's pretty hard to control it in moments like those. Luckily the pitch is quite a bit higher and overall has less low end which helps.

Can someone please explain what's the botox all about related to this surgery? Still don't get it.

Some people (myself included) have had preexisting issues with vocal cords without even knowing it. They expose these things during the pre op exam. If it is actually causing a vocal problem like a vocal tremor (which makes the voice behave erratically or stop when holding a tone), they can provide a botox injection serving to inhibit the vocal muscles from twitching or spasming (what physically causes a vocal tremor). I hope that makes sense.

I'm not a doctor so if someone has a medically appropriate explanation of laryngeal botox injection please do chime in!

[ilubfood]

Thank you ill be sure to keep you all updated as i do have many questions of recovery

Jenny: hi jenny, congrats on your progress. I was wondering if you could answer a few questions beause jessie takes a while to get back to me and i think its nice to have someone who actually went through with the procedure. Its been a week and a half since surgery for me now. 2 days after i got back to california, i had a couple of sneezes and was not able to control it. I also had botox injection and dr kim sutured 1/3 of my vocal chord as well. I was wondering if the sneezes had damaged the surgical area as i do have a bit of discomfort or is it just from the botox? Also i tried to say one word and it came out very hoarse still. When should i be able to actually produce a normal decent word?
Thank you for your time

[abbyt89]

How long did you stay? Cause 10K sounds a little high. But being an airline guru, I know how to take shortcuts to cut it down a bit.
So something else to add as a possibility.

Hey Willow,

My total cost for my trip was $12,238.31 (I'm studying accounting lol, the costs concerning my transition have been recorded meticulously)

Airfare from DC-Seoul was $1,678. I booked mine only three weeks in advance so it's likely if you book it far in advance and/or are flying out from the west coast that it would be several hundred dollars cheaper.

The hotel was $1,596 for 11 days. There are certainly cheaper options but I wanted to a suite with a kitchen since I did a lot of cooking from my hotel room.

The surgery itself, including foreign transaction fees that my credit card company charged, was $7,734. This was NOT including Botox. Actually, Jenny I meant to ask, did you get charged exactly $7,380 for the surgery? I completely forgot to follow up on this because it's like $400 more than I thought would be charged. Maybe it was due to an unfavorable exchange rate. I need to talk to Jessie.

And then I spent about $1,200 on food/entertainment/shopping during my stay.

I would say at the minimum, if you got a flight for $1,000, a hotel for $1,000, and spent $500 during your stay you would be looking at a hair under $10k. 

[abbyt89]

Other question how do you find your crying sounds have changed? I hate it when I really tear up my vocal sobs sound quite masculine, which really annoys me.

I would answer this but I haven't cried since my surgery lol. At least, not the kind where I would make any noise.

I can tell you that simple things like clearing my throat are now feminized. Laughing is difficult to control and my voice is still a bit weak in that area so I'm not really sure exactly how it sounds, gender wise. It's certainly higher pitched than it was but I don't think it will sound too feminine until my voice heals some more.

[Lauren5]

Hey Willow,

My total cost for my trip was $12,238.31 (I'm studying accounting lol, the costs concerning my transition have been recorded meticulously)

Airfare from DC-Seoul was $1,678. I booked mine only three weeks in advance so it's likely if you book it far in advance and/or are flying out from the west coast that it would be several hundred dollars cheaper.

The hotel was $1,596 for 11 days. There are certainly cheaper options but I wanted to a suite with a kitchen since I did a lot of cooking from my hotel room.

The surgery itself, including foreign transaction fees that my credit card company charged, was $7,734. This was NOT including Botox. Actually, Jenny I meant to ask, did you get charged exactly $7,380 for the surgery? I completely forgot to follow up on this because it's like $400 more than I thought would be charged. Maybe it was due to an unfavorable exchange rate. I need to talk to Jessie.

And then I spent about $1,200 on food/entertainment/shopping during my stay.

I would say at the minimum, if you got a flight for $1,000, a hotel for $1,000, and spent $500 during your stay you would be looking at a hair under $10k.

Something I've noticed, is that flying out of Lansing, which is also far closer to me, is always $100 cheaper than flying from Detroit, even though you take a plane where I hit me head on the roof all the time for 15-20 minutes to get to Detroit from Lansing!
Now, seeing all the figures laid out, 10K makes much more sense. Plus it means I can take Seoul off my round the world trip plan :p
It also all depends on how comfortable with myself I would be when I had this. If I was well into my transition, I'd be likely to overspend in clothes and maybe go to a club or two. I'd I stool felt uncomfortable, I don't think I'd get out of my room too much.
Come to think of it, 1.5k is excellent for a hotel in the Gangam district. You did say you stayed in the Gangam district, or wad that something else?

Another question for you singers out there; how has this affected your singing voice?

[abbyt89]

Speaking of kathyp, how you doing girl? I don't think we've heard from you since you had your surgery which must have been a month ago.

[barbie]

But, the area that they are in (Gangnam) probably has one of (if not the) highest concentration of plastic surgeons. It totally felt like the Beverly Hills of Korea in that regard. Excited to hear what barbie will have to say about it

Jenny,

Yes. It is, but plastic surgeries there are usually famous among East Asian girls. Due to the influence of K-pop, may young Asian women come to Gangnam, asking plastic surgeons to make their face look like K-pop idols. Their surgery skill is among the highest in the world, I am sure. I think the costs vary, but are similar to the U.S., and I heard that some westerners also visit there for cosmetic surgery. In my hometown, the skills of surgeons are not so much credible, and people recommend to go to Gangnam or Busan.

The reputations of surgeons there are critical in their business success, and the most influential group of patients is actually M2F transsexual, according to my friend, who is a doctor. Because M2F transsexual people are so much picky on the results of the surgery, word-of-mouth reputation among them is a most critical benchmark of the business success of Gangnam surgeons.

And, the problem is that many girls in Seoul look too much similar. There are several types of face I can recognize. I do not have exact statistics, but I guess a lot of young girls, probably more than 20%, undergo cosmetic surgery, especially in Seoul.

I just arrived in Nanaimo, BC. It feels like late fall, and I changed my summer clothes in Vancouver airport. I will purchase some fall clothes in a nearby shopping center. Young people here seem to like watching ice-hockey games.

barbie~~

[anjaq]

Thats interesting about the influence of MtFs on the reputation of surgeons there. I assume that there are several there doing FFS as well? I mostly hear non Korean names in that respect.

Jenny - I have another question to you. I hope you dont mind. Now recently people have told me and my experiments with praats f3 function also hint to that, that maybe a main issue for me is resonance. You did resonance training before the vfs, right? And you apply it now, so you still have to do some conscious voice changing always, is that so? What happens if you forget for a moment, e.g when tired or so. Does your voice still sound good enough or is it sounding a bit odd then? I heard some people claim that if one does not apply resonance control after vfs, one is supposedly sounding fake or falsetto, or even male. What are your experiences on how the voice sounds if you "slip" on resonance control? As you may be uncomfly with that I will say that as much as I'd like a soundbit from you about that, it is maybe too much to ask

[barbie]

Thats interesting about the influence of MtFs on the reputation of surgeons there. I assume that there are several there doing FFS as well? I mostly hear non Korean names in that respect.

anjaq,

I am unfamiliar with FFS, but there are several sites after googling: http://www.whatclinic.com/cosmetic-plastic-surgery/south-korea/seoul/ffs-facial-feminization-surgery

barbie~~

[Carlita]

It's about 10K usd for the trip.

7350 for the surgery itself, 400 extra if you have a vocal tremor and need botox

$7,350 sounds like quite a lot of money for a procedure which sells itself on being so minimal. Did you ever ask about that? And, of so, what reason did the Yeson Clinic give for the cost?

... Other than, 'All you bitches want it, so we can charge what we want!' 

[abbyt89]

$7,350 sounds like quite a lot of money for a procedure which sells itself on being so minimal. Did you ever ask about that? And, of so, what reason did the Yeson Clinic give for the cost?

... Other than, 'All you bitches want it, so we can charge what we want!' 

Well you have salaries for the 4 people that are actually in the operating room performing your surgery. The surgeon, anesthesiologist, and two nurses. Then you have the overhead related to the facility (Yeson runs out of their own surgical center rather than doing it at a hospital or somewhere else), the cost of the tests they run and the medications they provide, as well as whatever their profit margin is. Keep in mind that Yeson is a very well respected voice center in the most affluent area of Seoul, which overall is an expensive city to live in.

It's still cheaper than U.S.-based voice surgeries when you look at the cost of the operation alone. I think Dr. Thomas charges almost $10k. 

But part of it is that yes they can charge that much because they know people will pay it. Voice fem. surgery is not their main focus at Yeson, I think Jesse said Dr. Kim does 1-2 a week. They could probably still make a profit by charging say $5k for the surgery but they wouldn't have the ability to meet the demand at that price.

[Carlita]

Well you have salaries for the 4 people that are actually in the operating room performing your surgery. The surgeon, anesthesiologist, and two nurses. Then you have the overhead related to the facility (Yeson runs out of their own surgical center rather than doing it at a hospital or somewhere else), the cost of the tests they run and the medications they provide, as well as whatever their profit margin is. Keep in mind that Yeson is a very well respected voice center in the most affluent area of Seoul, which overall is an expensive city to live in.

It's still cheaper than U.S.-based voice surgeries when you look at the cost of the operation alone. I think Dr. Thomas charges almost $10k. 

But part of it is that yes they can charge that much because they know people will pay it. Voice fem. surgery is not their main focus at Yeson, I think Jesse said Dr. Kim does 1-2 a week. They could probably still make a profit by charging say $5k for the surgery but they wouldn't have the ability to meet the demand at that price.

And, let's face it, girls will pay ANYTHING  to get voices as pretty as the ones Yeson provides!

[sarahb]

And, let's face it, girls will pay ANYTHING  to get voices as pretty as the ones Yeson provides!

Hmm, I wonder how much we'd actually pay before it's just ridiculous and we boycott it. It's a hard question since the voice is so important, to me at least, that the possibility of having a voice that is so natural and feminine sounding as the ones Yeson is outputting makes any price seem worth it for a lifetime of happiness. Although, I think if it were $50k+ then it would become easier and easier to say fuggit and just practice reeeaaaaly hard on my voice.

[sarahb]

I was just thinking about all the awesome things I've heard from the ones who've done the voice surgery, but a thought popped into my head.

Is there anything you don't like about the surgery or the results? This could be not enough change, too much change, decreased vocal range, you snore more now, lol. Can you say anything bad about the surgery?

It's not going to sway me or anything, I don't think anything can at this point unless I get definitive proof that Jenny and Abby are just actresses to market for Yeson I just like to go in knowing some of the things I may be able to expect and can prepare for them if need be.

[abbyt89]

I was just thinking about all the awesome things I've heard from the ones who've done the voice surgery, but a thought popped into my head.

Is there anything you don't like about the surgery or the results? This could be not enough change, too much change, decreased vocal range, you snore more now, lol. Can you say anything bad about the surgery?

It's not going to sway me or anything, I don't think anything can at this point unless I get definitive proof that Jenny and Abby are just actresses to market for Yeson I just like to go in knowing some of the things I may be able to expect and can prepare for them if need be.

You caught us!!!

In all seriousness Jenny is probably in a better position to answer this since she is further along but neither of us are fully healed yet.

Let's play hypothetical and pretend that my voice right now is fully healed.

If that were the case the only real downside would be a limited vocal range since my highs aren't as high as I would like them.

I am happy with how much my pitch has changed. Even if it doesn't go up any more from here, I've already seen the average pitch increase and it's feminine enough that I don't worry about passing anymore. I don't think I will see that much more of an increase since I've already seen so much - if I see 10hz more I will be thrilled.

IF my pitch stays where it is now, I would still be happy with the surgery but in hindsight I would probably have asked Dr. Kim to do just a slight bit more to get me to around 215hz and comfortably in the female range. But who knows, maybe I will get to that point by the  time it's fully healed.

Edit: Although be prepared to not see a big change for a while. Jesse warned me that some patients are not happy initially because they don't notice much if any change for sometimes several months. In the end though she said that everyone sees an increase by the time its fully healed.

If you look through my posts you can see how I was a little bit impatient that after only 3 weeks post op my voice was only at 150-160hz. Even though I knew that it would take time for the pitch to rise I was frustrated because I expected too much after such a short time going into it. So be patient, and don't be disappointed if it takes a while to really see a difference.

[Lexi Belle]

I was just thinking about all the awesome things I've heard from the ones who've done the voice surgery, but a thought popped into my head.

Is there anything you don't like about the surgery or the results? This could be not enough change, too much change, decreased vocal range, you snore more now, lol. Can you say anything bad about the surgery?

It's not going to sway me or anything, I don't think anything can at this point unless I get definitive proof that Jenny and Abby are just actresses to market for Yeson I just like to go in knowing some of the things I may be able to expect and can prepare for them if need be.

Pretty faces, pretty voices.  I believe it, they're actresses.  The deceit!  They've been advertising all along! Darn media.