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Frustrations and worries. Argh!

Started by Mr.X, July 18, 2013, 08:27:48 AM

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Mr.X

I'm sorry if this is another one of those rant posts. I think I just need to write this off, and hopefully feel better.

Right now I'm not in a good place. I'm 9 weeks on T (big yay there!) and after a few weeks of no bleeding, I was hoping I was done with the feminine torture. Wrong. This morning it showed up. It was like a punch to the gonands. Why, body, why? Most guys stop the moment they get T, so why not me? On top of that, I'm a rather lonely person. Finally, after a while of being lonely, a friend is coming over. We planned on hanging out in the park, all day long, enjoying the sun. But guess what? Due to this shark week I will be constantly worrying about soaky pads and toilets. On top of that, he's going to stay over for a night. And seeing that I have a tendency to go to the toilet at least 3 times a night when I have this horrible female condition to flush that grossness out, he'll be wondering what the eff is up with me. Yes...I hate it and I don't know what to do.

Next tot that, I'm really wondering I am one of those rare persons who is insensitive to the T. After 9 weeks on a normal dose, I have barely noticed a thing. The only thing I noticed is a teeny weeny growth down there in the first two weeks, and that's it. No hunger, no libido increase, no hair growth, my voice is pretty much the same etc. ....I'm just downright scared I'm stuck with this body forever. I don't expect miracles such as a beard, but I expected something.

So meh...Big sigh here. My apologies for the rant. I'm just wondering when my stupid body will stop letting me down for once. Wasn't it bad enough to be born in a female body, on top of that a tiny female body already? Guess not.
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Soren

I was reading on the intersex board something along the lines of 'if you're androgen insensitive, you won't identify as male because a male brain is developed from androgens' https://www.susans.org/forums/index.php/topic,105311.0.html
Maybe you should ask people on the HRT board what their time frame for changes was?
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spacerace

You do not have enough data yet to think your changes won't happen. 9 weeks is not that long. That is only 9 weeks of T fighting years of estrogen.

Are you tracking changes? Take the same picture of your face shape, record your voice, etc on a consistent schedule Also - go watch 3 month update videos guys have posted. Seeming other people not really have any changes yet at the same point might help. I think a lot of people still have to deal with the torture for a few months after starting. I have been telling myself not to expect to it gone until ~4 months in so I don't expect too much.

Good luck getting through it and finding patience for changes. Are you on shots?
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kaiju

It took me more than nine weeks to stop completely. You need your testosterone levels to reach the normal male range before the monthly issue stops, if I'm remembering correctly.
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Jack_M

9 weeks is nothing. There's no real time frame for all the changes, it changes from guy to guy. So there's no need to worry or think you're not responding. I didn't stop shark week straight away, and tbh I'm still planning for it later this month because I know it doesn't stop straight away and I'm not going to hope I'm a lucky one. Some people can be on T for a good few months before it stops, 9 weeks is not that typical, so don't worry!  'Expect nothing; enjoy what happens.' That's how I'm taking this process. Just think of any brothers you might have, or guy friends growing up. It took them a whole going through that awkward puberty stage, right? It's going to be the same for us.  Slowly but surely!

Comparison photos and videos are fantastic though; they really make you see the changes. It's like the before/after workout pics. Changes can be so gradual, but when you compare over months, you can see some amazing and drastic things! My voice has gotten a little lower, but I couldn't really tell because it was so gradual. It was in comparing 2 videos of me talking that I could actually hear it.

Keep going the way you're going and then get some blood work done, maybe around the 3 month mark (just going off what my endo suggests so not set in stone) then based on those results and what changes you've noticed, your dose can be altered.

As for going to the bathroom during the night, you could try making a show of drinking tea or water before bed and if he's actually awake and notices, say something like, "Yeah, I knew drinking that [whatever you drank] was a bad idea before going to bed!"
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Jeatyn

My shark week didn't stop until the 6 month mark but according to my endo that's very unusual. That's when I got an estrogen blocker....none since then *touch wood*
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spacerace

T turns into estrogen when there is too much of it, right?

I have no idea how this actually plays out medically, but would someone whose TOM hasn't stopped maybe benefit from asking their doctor about lowering their dose?

this is not be seen as medical advice in my post or anyone who answers my post - I am just curious about if anyone had their dose lowered and got faster changes

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Jeatyn

That was not the case for me....I think? When T aromatises...do T levels drop...or do you end up with high levels of both? When I got my bloodwork I had T barely in the male range, and my E was through the roof.

My latest bloodwork now shows I have pretty much non existent E (yay thank you blocker) but my T levels are still barely in the male range. I asked for a higher dose because of that, and my endo was like "I don't think we should, these results are very good, I'm happy with them"
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spacerace

Quote from: Jeatyn on July 18, 2013, 04:29:04 PM
My latest bloodwork now shows I have pretty much non existent E (yay thank you blocker) but my T levels are still barely in the male range. I asked for a higher dose because of that, and my endo was like "I don't think we should, these results are very good, I'm happy with them"

I am glad the blockers work for you. Your changes are in the do I pass thread are obvious.

The paperwork they gave me for informed consent had this section about how I was agreeing to never raise my dose on my own, and one of the reasons it gave was because too much T can actually work against changes.

It probably varies so much from person to person comparing doesn't matter though I guess. Also - weekly shots vs nebido vs gel vs whatever no doubt make a difference about which solution is right when changes aren't happening

good luck OP! Talking to your Dr. about your concerns is never a bad idea, but really - a lot of people are where you are at now at 3 mths from what I have seen
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Simon

Quote from: Soren on July 18, 2013, 11:15:56 AM
I was reading on the intersex board something along the lines of 'if you're androgen insensitive, you won't identify as male because a male brain is developed from androgens'

We should not question someone's identity because they have a fear that their hormones aren't giving them the effects they desire. That is presumptuous.

-------------

As others have said, don't give it too much thought this early into it. I would keep up with pictures and doing voice recordings. These changes are so subtle and build over time that without my pics/recordings I would have doubted many had taken place. Just do your best to relax and enjoy the ride. Everything will come to you in due time.
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mowdan6

Hey Buddy.  If this helps.  I am one of the guys that it took years before I saw the effects of T.  Does'nt make you any less a man.  Just a different genetic make-up.  Don't sweat it buddy.  Took me about 4 years before I saw a change, and then, it went into full gear.  Just hang in there.  This hormone stuff works differently for us all.  Some guys get quick results and some of us have to deal with the slow change. 
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lost.cowboy

Like the others have said - do make sure you keep a record of measurable changes, even if you think nothing much is happening. We see ourselves all the time plus are our own worst critics. I took face pics everyday and it surprised me looking back, as at the time I was convinced nothing was happening. Also, it can seem like a slow start and then everything happens at once and it really goes for it. But everyone is different - keep your chin up, you are on the right track  :)
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Soren

Quote from: Simon on July 18, 2013, 04:44:04 PM
We should not question someone's identity because they have a fear that their hormones aren't giving them the effects they desire. That is presumptuous.


Yes, it would be, which is why I didn't say it. I said because he's male it's unlikely that he is androgen resistant.
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spacerace

Quote from: Soren on July 18, 2013, 06:22:06 PM
Yes, it would be, which is why I didn't say it. I said because he's male it's unlikely that he is androgen resistant.

Ohh, I get what you mean. I.E. because he knows his brain is male maybe he won't be completely impervious to the effects of T.  Not sure it exactly works that way, but I don't really know anything about it one way or another, and you are no doubt right in the general sense because he's had some small changes.

I actually read your post the wrong way the first time too.
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Adam (birkin)

I have only heard of very few people who don't get any more shark weeks after starting T, so I wouldn't worry there.

And changes definitely happen slower for some people. I know it sucks...I took a really long time to have any noticeable changes at all. But it does happen. It will go by a lot faster than you think. :) You'll look back and be like "wow, that was a year ago that I started T."
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Simon

Quote from: Soren on July 18, 2013, 06:22:06 PM
Yes, it would be, which is why I didn't say it. I said because he's male it's unlikely that he is androgen resistant.

Then it might be wise to clarify your position in the future. I'm surely not the only one who didn't understand why you went that route. I gotcha now though.

Quote from: spacerace on July 18, 2013, 06:36:14 PM
Ohh, I get what you mean. I.E. because he knows his brain is male maybe he won't be completely impervious to the effects of T.  Not sure it exactly works that way

It doesn't work that way.
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Kreuzfidel

Congratulations for being on T, mate!  That's a huge thing - and I assure you that it's completely normal to feel a bit apprehensive - and to expect things to start happening right away.  Your situation sounds very similar to mine - I am now 18 months on T and I'd like to tell you about how our situations are similar and what happened with mine.

Quote from: Mr.X on July 18, 2013, 08:27:48 AMWhy, body, why? Most guys stop the moment they get T, so why not me?

Not true.  I belong to several FTM discussion groups outside of Susan's, and the number of guys who stop right away contrasted with the number of guys who stop months down the line are about even.

My situation:  my "personal time" took about 5 months to stop.  From the moment I was on T, it became irregular - I would bleed for weeks on end and then stop.  Then two weeks later, it would start again.  Then, at about 5 months, nothing - and it hasn't returned.

Quote from: Mr.X on July 18, 2013, 08:27:48 AMOn top of that, I'm a rather lonely person. Finally, after a while of being lonely, a friend is coming over. We planned on hanging out in the park, all day long, enjoying the sun. But guess what? Due to this shark week I will be constantly worrying about soaky pads and toilets.

Are you able, at all, to use tampons?  I know that they can be very triggering for some guys (myself included), but I found that using tampons helped to curb the dysphoria because I WASN'T constantly having to look at and touch pads and to feel them there.  Just an option.  You will also not have to worry as much about going to to the toilet - not nearly as often.

Quote from: Mr.X on July 18, 2013, 08:27:48 AMOn top of that, he's going to stay over for a night. And seeing that I have a tendency to go to the toilet at least 3 times a night when I have this horrible female condition to flush that grossness out, he'll be wondering what the eff is up with me. Yes...I hate it and I don't know what to do.

Mate, I go to the toilet 3 times a night and I'm not having "personal time".  People go to the toilet for a great number of reasons - and I assure you, most guys aren't thinking about "hmmm, I wonder why he's going to the toilet so much?".  If he does say anything, just joke and say something didn't sit right with you or that you have the runs - blow it off and don't make a big deal of it and it won't be one.

Quote from: Mr.X on July 18, 2013, 08:27:48 AMNext tot that, I'm really wondering I am one of those rare persons who is insensitive to the T. After 9 weeks on a normal dose, I have barely noticed a thing. The only thing I noticed is a teeny weeny growth down there in the first two weeks, and that's it. No hunger, no libido increase, no hair growth, my voice is pretty much the same etc. ....I'm just downright scared I'm stuck with this body forever. I don't expect miracles such as a beard, but I expected something.

I felt exactly the same way. 

Being on Susan's first, all I saw here were the reports of guys who A) had stopped their monthly horrors the minute they had a T injection and B) started having voice changes, beard growth, etc. within two or three weeks.

That is not typical - again, I say this as I belong to several groups and I see the number of guys who report a variety of changes at a variety of points on the transition timeline.

Let me tell you about mine.  I was 3 months on T and no changes.  Nada.  That's about 3 weeks longer than you have been on T now. 

I had made videos of myself from the time I started T every month just to have a log - at almost 4 months, I looked back at them.  I was startled.  I could hear a slight change in my voice - and yet had never experienced the first "cracking" or "sore throat" that you read so much about. 

At 6 months, my voice was completely male - passing over the phone and not a single episode of "cracking" and "sore throat".  If I hadn't been looking back at those videos I made of myself and had not been getting "sir" on the phone - I would still believe that nothing had changed at that point.

It was at about the 5 month mark that I noticed small dark hairs coming in.  Mind you, they were very few and far between, but there.  And then the fuzz (white vellus hairs) started to get thicker.  No dramatic sudden change.  Very subtle.

Looking back at photos (again, made monthly) I could see how the fat had started re-distributing over my body. 

But none of these changes were noticeable until about 5 months.  You are only 9 weeks.

DO NOT judge yourself and what is or is not happening to your body by what you read on forums.  I have also noticed that a great many guys, especially young ones, exaggerate and read into "sore throats" and "cracking" - I'm also sure that some of them are so eager to see a single change that they will almost convince themselves that there is one when there isn't.

The process is slow, gradual and it doesn't happen overnight - and it doesn't happen in 9 weeks.  It doesn't happen in 9 months.  I am 18 months and my changes are still happening.  One thing about starting T that therapists and doctors are supposed to discuss with the patient is to have realistic expectations.

Fantasy:  You start T and two weeks later have a manly voice and beard hairs sprouting.  Your period is gone forever and your biceps are already bulging.

Reality:  You start T and 6 months later you have a few fuzzy black hairs on your upper lip.  Your voice is a little deeper, but maybe not passable yet.  Your personal time comes and goes.  You still have some "chubby" distribution on your thighs and bum.

In some ways, being on forums and in support groups can be damaging to your transition.  I say that because there are sometimes so many guys exaggerating changes or perhaps the ones who really do have those rare early changes are the only ones you see and fixate on.  Don't be convinced that you are androgen insensitive - these  changes can take YEARS.  That is the reality of transition.  If you expect any less you will be sorely disappointed and I have seen guys debating going off T just because the changes they wanted weren't happening fast enough.  That isn't the point of transition.  You don't get to pick and choose what changes you get and when.  This is the one thing you have little control over - you ultimately need to sit back, wait and let the hormone work.

Don't start having these doubts so early on - don't start debating changing your dosage or anything like that until you have a legitimate reason to.  9 weeks is a drop in the ocean, mate.  9 months and no changes?  THEN perhaps you can think about whether or not there is an issue with your dosage, but androgen insensitivity is far-fetched at this point.  Be strong and stop comparing your transition with others'. 

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Mr.X

Thanks for the replies, guys! I do feel a lot better now!

Soren, you do seem to be right. When I researched androgen sensitivity, it appears that it usually comes with female bodied people who also have no uterus. I clearly still have mine because its being a jerk right now, so I should stop worrying about that.

My blood was taken a week ago. I don't know when the results are in, but I'll try to find out next week what my levels are. No clue if I have too high T levels and if things are turned into E, but I'll find out. Its an interesting theory. I have been on androgel for 8 weeks, and now on shots for 1 week.

I am doing videos and photos but there usually is very little change. The change I do see is usual due to natural variation (think of morning voice). But you guys are all right. I need more patience. A lot of it.

Kreuzfidel, maybe you are right. I must say I was influenced by Susan's, of all the quick changes reported. But also on youtube. I have watched many videos of guys on T, and all of them report at least something within two months. And their voices sound different too. Maybe they also think things are happening faster than they actually happen due to placebo effects. Who knows.

In any case, thanks for the heads up, guys! It is time to indeed just sit back and relax for the ride instead of going 'are we there yet?' all the time.
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Kreuzfidel

Yep, just sit back and let it happen.

Quote from: Mr.X on July 19, 2013, 01:59:14 AMBut also on youtube. I have watched many videos of guys on T, and all of them report at least something within two months. And their voices sound different too. Maybe they also think things are happening faster than they actually happen due to placebo effects. Who knows.

Another thing to remember is that the guys on YouTube (like the guys on Susan's or anywhere else like a public forum) are only a tiny, tiny, miniscule percentage of FTMs in the world.  Not every FTM has a YouTube channel. 

Again...yes...I liken a lot of "changes" to placebo - and possibly even a "mind-over-matter" type of effect.  But, you'll get there - just not in 2 months :)
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mm

Everyone is different of how T effects them and how fast the changes take place, so all you can do is wait and see.  You can talk with your dr about doseage, thou most do the good job of keeping track of your levels.

I found shark week much better after I discovered tampons, less dyphersia at that time of the month.  It took me a few trys to find the easiest way to put one in.  After you know how things are alot better no feeling or seeing that old pad on you, easier to get rid of the old one too.  Unless you have a flood you should be able to handle one night. 
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