Susan's Place Logo

News:

Based on internal web log processing I show 3,417,511 Users made 5,324,115 Visits Accounting for 199,729,420 pageviews and 8.954.49 TB of data transfer for 2017, all on a little over $2,000 per month.

Help support this website by Donating or Subscribing! (Updated)

Main Menu

Fears and hopelessness.

Started by Ltl89, July 25, 2013, 03:19:51 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Ltl89

First off, this thread will be a bit of a mess and quite jumbled.   So forgive me for the disorganization of this thread.   If you make it through, I congratulate you and thank you for any feedback you may have.  Lately, I have been having a lot of fears about my transition, and I wanted to see if any one has any suggestions or tips on how overcome them or improve them.  Also, I just kind of want to get it out as I feel pent up and don't have anyone other than my therapist to unleash this upon. Some of the thoughts presented here are controversial.  Understand this is just how I think of myself, not of anyone else.  These are my own personal hangups and fears/shame about being trans and the consequences of transitioning..  This mindset is limited to how I see myself, so please don't take offense to anything in this post.  The further I go into my transition (over a month on hormones), I need to learn how to confront these fears.  Any feedback or thoughts are appreciated. 

Fear number one.  I'm afraid that I will always be alone and transitioning will only solidify this.   I really have no one in my life in the moment.  I'm not really enriched with a lot of friends, I've never had a dating life, and soon I may not even have a family.  If things are bad know, what will happen once I fully transition.  Will it really become easier for me to date or make friends?  Sure, I never dated because of my dysphoria and I've always been shy around others because of this fact. So it that sense maybe there will be improvement.  But will people really want to date or befriend someone like me?  Why would they?  I'm a spectacle.  If I pass in the future, great, but if I don't, why would someone want to date a woman who looks like a guy.  Why would they want to be friends with someone who looks like a joke.  Maybe I just have no self esteem, but I fear transitioning will make me into more of a social reject than I already am.  If I don't pass and no one believes I'm a girl, will I really have a social life when they see me as a weirdo?  And I know for a fact that transitioning is damaging my relationship at home.  They want me to leave and may not want to see me again in the future. 

Fear number two. I fee like leaving everything behind.  I don't want to face those who already know me.  I'd rather leave them all behind and never see them again.  But you can't hide from your neighbors and acquaintances.  Sooner or later they will know?  What do I do?  What if they reject me or make life difficult for me?

Fear number 3. I'm terrified of never passing in my life. I'm young and have my whole life ahead of me, yet I can't help but feel my future only has bad things to come.  Perhaps one day I will pass, but I don't know.  My family always tells me I will never look the way I hope.  I fear they might be right.   I NEED to pass. A life as a man or an unpassable woman doesn't appeal to me.  I don't know if I could deal with it.  I don't know if I'd like to even live if that's my only options.  I don't judge others who don't have the same fear, so please don't judge me either. We all have our weaknesses and fears.  I just don't know how to overcome this.  I want to pass and need to.  But will it really ever happen.

I guess I fear that my life will only get worse.  As much as I want this and feel I HAVE to do this, I don't know how to get through it or if doing so will make things better.  I already have great difficulties meeting people and have always felt like a social reject.  I can't find employment and imagine it will only become harder the more my appearance changes.   My family is increasingly distancing themselves from me and I'm being asked to leave my home since they don't have to witness my transition.    How can one feel happy or satisfied without family, friends, employment, and shelter.  Is it really worth it?  Yet, the alternative of not transitioning leaves me with no other option than going into the unknown realm.  If both paths take me into same place is it really worth fighting on.  Is there really something worth living for?  I don't plan on doing anything so don't worry, but I can't help but feel I'm doomed no matter what.  Sometimes I have a romantic fantasy of leaving everything and everyone behind and running off as female in another country.   I could leave my past behind and finally feel satisfied.  I  could live as the girl I've always hoped to be and not deal with facing a hostile society because they'd never know.  Yet, that is only a fantasy.  All my problems will exist and running away won't allow my fears to be solved.  But then what do tou do if you can't solve them?    If I don't pass, they will persist and even get worse. 

I don't mean to ramble on and on, but does anyone have any suggestions for how to improve my situation or get over these fears.  I'm lost and don't know what to do or how to get out of the defeatist mind set.  I'm just scared.  I need to do this, but I don't know how or if I can make it. 
  •  

Donna Elvira

LtL,
In response to your post I am going to stick my neck out a bit more than usual. I would love to be able to write you something really reassuring telling you all will work out alright but I think that, under the circumstances, those words would ring hollow. Almost nothing you have said over recently months allows me to say that.

However the "almost" is important as you have plenty going for you if you can a find a way to stand back frrom your situation a bit so that you can see it. You are bright, you are young, you still have a family that supports you (Under certain conditions , yes), you live in the wealthiest country in the world in quite a tolerant corner of that country etc. etc..

You have no job for now and, given the type of studies you did, finding work directly related to those studies could be tough. However you do have the opportunity to pursue your studies and get the post-grad education which might just allow you get the sort of position you are aiming for. If you are really in a hurry to become financially independent, there are plenty of other possibilities too, in areas like health care, the military etc.. where not everyone becomes a SEAL or whatever. Lot's of people use the military to get an education in specialities for which there are openings.

You also apparently have quite severe disphoria but just being aware of that, as long as you don't make an obsession of it, should make it manageable. If you read the older ladies posts here, you will have noticed that lots of us survived for years operating as guys, frustrated without any doubt, but having still lived very full lives.

If have said this to you before in a PM but will say it again here. You don't always get to do what you want to do in life, far from it and the only way forward at any point in time is to weigh up your options, make choices and live with them until other options become available.

As an example of this, between the ages of 18 and 23 I spent 5 years in an elite combat unit in the French army. At the time I was running away from myself but I knew as soon as I found myself there that I had made a really bad choice. Unfortunately, I was stuck with it so I  used every possibiity that cropped up to do things I liked, like serving in a mountain warfare unit where I learned to ski, to rock climb and generally survive in mountainous environments which I love to this day. I also put aside enough money to pay for a good higher education when I was finally finished meaning that I have been able to enjoy a good professional career.

However, even when in the army I had to live with my disphoria and I took some risks at the time which, with hindsight, were pretty crazy. That being said, I survived, learned to look after myself and, in spite of a rocky ride at times, I am still here today with far more to be happy about than the contrary. I feel all the more comfortable about saying this that I know I'm not alone. There are plenty of the older ladies here who could  tell you similar stories.

So, getting back to you, you can bemoan your present situation for forever, a victim of circumstances,  and get more and more unhappy or, you can take charge of your life, make  the best choices you can given the options available to you now and live with them.

You do have my sympathy by the way. That is actually why I have responded so often to your posts. You come across as a genuinely very nice person who could do with lots of TLC but that will not help you fly with your own wings which is what you need to do now. Maybe that will require putting your transition on hold but is that really the only thing that counts in your existance? I really hope that it is not because, no matter how important to us, life is not only about gender identity.

Really wishing you all the very best but no one is more responsible for your life than you.

Donna
  •  

Ltl89

Forgive me for typos, I suck at using my phones keypad.  Donna, you make some really great points.  I don't like to whine.  I kniw I have some advantages and realize life isn't perfect.  I like finding solutions and working with what I hqve.  The thing is, I don't see the solutions.  This isn't about my current financial problems.  Yes, it sukcs, but I will find something at some point.   the problem is everything else that I wrote.  The fear of never passing, of losing my family,  never being accepted as a female by potential friends and romantic partners, and being found out by acquaintances who may laugh and reject me.  Even if I hold off my transition until I'm 60 instead if doing it at 24 it won't solve these fears or problems.  I'll need to face it at some point.   I might as well learn how to do it now instead of putting my life on hold.

On your seconf point, dysphoria differs from person to person.  I appreciate those who were able to live happy lives prior to transitioning,  but that isn't me.  I have so many difficulties living as a male.  Sure I could try to cope, but I would live years as a miserable robot.  I find it difficult to socialize and impossible to date.  The idea of someone being attracted ti me as a male repulses me.  A life without 5he ability to talk and maintain meaningful relationships with others is not fun or pleasant.   And my body dysphoria has led me to suicidal rhoughts mor3 than once.  I sometimes cry when looking in the mirror.  Before I joined this forum and decided to fibally follow throufh my transition, I was doing a certain drug on a daily basis fir months so I wouldn't feel the pain.  The idea of transitioning has brought me immnense happiness rhatbi don't want to give up. I legitimately can't just put rhis aside for years.  I need to do this.  But I'm at a loss on how I cqn make this successful or if I can ever live a happy life due to all rhe roadblocks a trans person must face.  Getting over those fears and societal restraints aee my problem.  Its like damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Again,  I appreciate your feedback and am not trying to sound whiney.   I just want learn how to deal with this as best I can.
  •  

Joanna Dark

How hard do you think it will be for you to pass? I think a lot of times being able to pass isn't as hard as we think. I know for myself I don't think I pass most days and yet when I present male and am gendered female by most people. Yesterday, I was dressed mainly male, or andro-male, and this guy referred to me as he and his girlfriend who slightly tipsy, was trying to whisper I swear to god that is a girl there is no way she's a guy. It was SO awkward.

I think that is your main worry: passing. When you start to pass everything else will fall into place. First you will prolly go thru some hard times. But the end will be worth it. I also wouldn't put off transition. I can't and won;t put it off any longer. I barely made it to 30 and the only way I made it there was with the help of hard drugs, which were surprisingly easy to stop once I started transitioning. That's prolly because this is my main issue. If I was to stop, I would go back to doing drugs. Prolly within a day or two. It becomes that much harder now that I started because I feel like being whole is within reach and I am starting to like myself and accept myself. I hated myself before which makes relationships very hard and I am a very easdy person to love. Or at least everyone tells me so. Even if I could make it to 60, I wouldn't want to. Why would I want to live another 30 years like thislast 30 years. That sounds horrid. I'd rather be dead. I don't care about my career, my family, or anything, if I don not do this I will be compltely unhappy and I want to feel happy for once. I suspect you feel the same. In this we are like sisters, so please don't feel alone.

You should come to Philly. It's not far and I am your friend. BTW, your not being whiney. This is completely normal.
  •  

vlmitchell

Quote from: Joanna Dark on July 25, 2013, 07:21:01 PM
BTW, your not being whiney. This is completely normal.

Yeah, pretty much that. Given all your current issues, it's totally understandable.

If you think that you need to transition, then transition. Know that doing that has costs, accept them into your heart and mind and move on. Everyone I've known has had *some* part of their life ripped out by transition, even the best cases. It's not going to be easy. It's not going to feel comfortable for a long while. Work on it every day, realize that this is a chance for you to be yourself and that, fortunately enough, you get a lot of chances to do things completely differently, should you so choose.

Two cents: I transitioned about five years after you did, on the timeline. I was awkward and weird. I'm still awkward and weird but I'm honest and people respond to being genuine and sincere so, my life is pretty full of awesome friends that I do nifty things with. You'll probably find that life works out that way.

Fear is pointless, love is generally the answer, knowing where you're going takes a plan of how to get there. Three wonderfully glib clichés for you but, there you go.

Finally: If you feel that you MUST transition, then do so but if you feel that you *CAN* live life without, then maybe it's a good idea to reflect. I'm not kidding about costs. I'm an ideal case when it comes to how easy it was (partner stayed, kept job, life got way better) but in no way did I not lose things and people. I decided that this was critical and so, made peace with whatever would come to pass because of it. It didn't take the sting out when people suddenly disappeared on me or publicly screeched at me about how 'awful' or 'fake' or <whatever> it was but it did keep one foot in front of the other.
  •  

Rachel

I look at transitioning from this perspective. I will follow the journey and weigh the benefits and negatives. I will work to achieve the path I feel is right for me. Since HRT things have been better. My co-workers that know are really very supportive. My wife is tolerating it. There have been some minor changes physically and they will continue. Mentally, I feel wonderful. Just doing something has helped (really quite a lot).

Physically, eventually the changes will accumulate and I then will have more choices. I will do what feels good to me, with lots or thought.

I am introverted, married a woman who seduced me and is dominant. I hid being TG from her (did not want to lose her) and have caused her pain.

I am who I am. Most likely I will compromise in the end. One important thing, I no longer think of the 2 options while going to work (life or death). There were a few weeks in December (if I still took drugs) I would not be here. Now, I have a lot of options and none of them include death.
HRT  5-28-2013
FT   11-13-2015
FFS   9-16-2016 -Spiegel
GCS 11-15-2016 - McGinn
Hair Grafts 3-20-2017 - Cooley
Voice therapy start 3-2017 - Reene Blaker
Labiaplasty 5-15-2017 - McGinn
BA 7-12-2017 - McGinn
Hair grafts 9-25-2017 Dr.Cooley
Sataloff Cricothyroid subluxation and trachea shave12-11-2017
Dr. McGinn labiaplasty, hood repair, scar removal, graph repair and bottom of  vagina finished. urethra repositioned. 4-4-2018
Dr. Sataloff Glottoplasty 5-14-2018
Dr. McGinn vaginal in office procedure 10-22-2018
Dr. McGinn vaginal revision 2 4-3-2019 Bottom of vagina closed off, fat injected into the labia and urethra repositioned.
Dr. Thomas in 2020 FEMLAR
  • skype:Rachel?call
  •  

Misato

Hey LTL,

I do think as you, we, transition it brings out an authenticity in us that other people can gravitate toward.  I know I've lamented some bad experiences I've had of late on this forum but, just Wednesday I had a very nice chat with one of my co-workers as I drove us to the grocery store so I could pick up lunch (she's fasting for Ramadan).  Before I left I sent out an e-mail saying, "Anyone wanna tag along?" and she said yes.  I've had a chain of experiences like that going back to a time before I even started therapy which makes me think we have reason to be careful that we're not projecting our own fears onto other people. 


  • I went as me to this group at school for Trans people (this was before I started therapy) and I said, "I don't take the bus here because I might make other people uncomfortable." And the others just looked at me, dumbfounded.  So, what the heck I thought, I went for the bus and this little kid came up to me and said, "Excuse me miss, would you like to buy..." I forget what he was selling but he gendered me right! And I had an uneventful bus ride home.
  • There was a Russian Orthodox woman I befriended who studied with me and whose husband gave me lifts back to my apartment at night.  This was during my RLE so I wasn't close to being on hormones yet.  Not that I pass today... But my point is, they didn't care.

Anyway, it does seem there are a lot of cisgendered people who don't care what you look like, they care about who you are.  I think, I hope, that extends to love too.  My SO is still with me despite me looking less masculine.

As someone who doesn't pass all I can say is life remains better than before.  Hard, but still better.  Heck, I'm sober!  Even though my stress has increased, my desire for a drink continues to plummet. :)  So while not passing is not ideal, life can still be much better than before.

On the employment front, the upper, upper management at my employer has a 1980's mentality when it comes to LGBT issues, hence my insurance woes.  But!  My immediate management gave me a sentiment card to let me know they applicate my effort and a $100 gift card because they feel bad about my insurance situation and, yes, because I'm a far more talented engineer than they thought they were hiring.  Those gestures may not have solved my insurance issue, but they do tell me these people care about me.

Family.  If they're pushing you away because they don't want to see you transition, I suspect they've done enough damage to you and you'll be better off without them.

LTL, from what I've seen of you here you seem like a really nice and wonderful person.  Bet on that, grow it.  I think it's your key to finding a solution to all the problems you see or fear that are coming.
  •  

Donna Elvira

Quote from: learningtolive on July 25, 2013, 06:28:18 PM
Forgive me for typos, I suck at using my phones keypad.  Donna, you make some really great points.  I don't like to whine.  I kniw I have some advantages and realize life isn't perfect.  I like finding solutions and working with what I hqve.  The thing is, I don't see the solutions.  This isn't about my current financial problems.  Yes, it sukcs, but I will find something at some point.   the problem is everything else that I wrote.  The fear of never passing, of losing my family,  never being accepted as a female by potential friends and romantic partners, and being found out by acquaintances who may laugh and reject me.  Even if I hold off my transition until I'm 60 instead if doing it at 24 it won't solve these fears or problems.  I'll need to face it at some point.   I might as well learn how to do it now instead of putting my life on hold.

On your seconf point, dysphoria differs from person to person.  I appreciate those who were able to live happy lives prior to transitioning,  but that isn't me.  I have so many difficulties living as a male.  Sure I could try to cope, but I would live years as a miserable robot.  I find it difficult to socialize and impossible to date.  The idea of someone being attracted ti me as a male repulses me.  A life without 5he ability to talk and maintain meaningful relationships with others is not fun or pleasant.   And my body dysphoria has led me to suicidal rhoughts mor3 than once.  I sometimes cry when looking in the mirror.  Before I joined this forum and decided to fibally follow throufh my transition, I was doing a certain drug on a daily basis fir months so I wouldn't feel the pain.  The idea of transitioning has brought me immnense happiness rhatbi don't want to give up. I legitimately can't just put rhis aside for years.  I need to do this.  But I'm at a loss on how I cqn make this successful or if I can ever live a happy life due to all rhe roadblocks a trans person must face.  Getting over those fears and societal restraints aee my problem.  Its like damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Again,  I appreciate your feedback and am not trying to sound whiney.   I just want learn how to deal with this as best I can.

LtL, No matter what you want, at any particular point in time this has to be confronted with what you can actually do. Otherwise, you end out in a fantasy world. So yes, all the obstacles, roadblocks etc that you mention are real but they exist for lots of other people too.

Overall, I would suggest that if it is clear in your mind where you want to go, make a plan and start working to it. It might take a long time to get there but the extraordinary thing about actually making a plan is that the notion of time changes completely. If my objective is to get a medical degree I know from the outset that it will take x years and that it will be a really hard slog. However, since I know that to begin with, in spite of the difficulties I have a reason for sticking to it.  Actually just writing this reminds me of yet another book I read years ago called "Man's search for meaning" by a guy called Viktor Frankl: http://www.amazon.com/Mans-Search-for-Meaning-ebook/dp/B001KQZ7I8/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1374810252&sr=1-1&keywords=viktor+frankl

The basic idea that is developed is that if you if you have a good enough reason to want something you will find the means to achieve it and just knowing that you are on the road towards your goal already changes the way you perceive your day to day life. When you have no purpose, when nothing in your life has any meaning, it can just feel like an endless struggle. When you do have a purpose and there is meaning behind what you are going through, the realities on the ground are still  the same but it feels very different and far more acceptable.  You actually say as much yourself in the following phrase "The idea of transitioning has brought me immnense happiness rhatbi don't want to give up." You already know what you need to do, you just don't quite know how to get there yet.

Regarding that, I never suggested you give up by the way. I just suggested it might not be the most important thing for you to do right now but only you can work that out and, as I have said a few times before, no matter what your choice, then accept that you have to live with it, at least for a certain amount of time.

Last comment on a far more practical level. Two years ago, I had no idea whether I could pass successfully which for me was also key to transitioning.I had a really masculine face. Thanks to HRT and even more so, FFS, I now pass without any problem. I was able to do the FFS because I earn enough money to pay for it and that it because I invested seriously in my education when I was pretty much your age. At 23 years of age I went back to school for 6 years, used all my savings, worked all my vacations, weekends etc.. to get myself through but actually ended out in a pretty good  place.

So, looking at your situation, at least one of the alternatives you are facing is rushing to the finishing line now ie. transitioning immediately and damn the consequences or taking a more long term view of things, putting yourself in a position where you on more solid ground re. work, finances etc...so that you have more control over your life. That is what I am referring to when I say you need a plan.

Not making a choice is also a choice by the way but one which generally leads to other people making choices for you. At the end of the day, it's your call!
Warm regards.
Donagh

  •  

JLT1

LTL,

I am saddened by your worries.  They are normal, but they still make me sad.  Often, in my life, I have found that my worst fears do not come true but they have led me to do better planning (a silver lining!).  I hope this is the case for you.  Having said that, I'm glad you are still on-line.

There is no way that I know that would allow anyone to predict the effect of HRT.   I have seen some people go through dramatic changes.  Hey, I went though dramatic changes.  I know I will need some FFS.  But before HRT, even FFS couldn't have made me look feminine.  I know, I checked....that would have been tough (and expensive!) to even get close. Now, hey, it's possible!  My facial bone structure is one big reason I have lived a life that has mostly consisted of going through the motions, not really living it. In no way do I recommend that option...

I have also found that transitioning can boost confidence and with confidence come "like-ability".  Transitioning brings new experiences (both good and bad).  You should be the same person but there is a lot to be said for being comfortable in your own skin.  That, in turn, affects the way you interact with people.

What are you studying?  Does the University of Chicago (U of C) have a good program??? (for some reason, that one came to mind first).  How about  MIT???  Cal Tech???  UNC Chapel Hill???  University of MN???  I know people at those schools.  I don't know anyone at any school in NY.
To move forward is to leave behind that which has become dear. It is a call into the wild, into becoming someone currently unknown to us. For most, it is a call too frightening and too challenging to heed. For some, it is a call to be more than we were capable of being, both now and in the future.
  •  

Sephirah

From the tone of your posts, it sounds to me like you already have enough roadblocks in your life, brought on by your own feelings about being forced to live as someone you're not. How it makes you feel about interacting with people, and forming connections.

Short of being practical, something I'm not super well known for. I'm going to suggest a few things, perhaps of a more esoteric nature.

First of all, I'm not sure that transition is the cause of the fears you have. It's a symptom, sure, but... hmm... I wonder if it's more a twofold fear of the unknown, and of losing control. What I mean by that is... your posts give a lot of importance to how other people will treat you or what they will think. What if they do this, or think that, or say the other? That unpredictability. Uncertainty. And the second part to that is a fear that these reactions are based on something you have very little control over. And can't get away from.

Knowing you're going to have to face something, and being afraid of it, is a different sort of apprehension than not knowing what you're going to face. When you know what's going to happen, you can prepare for it, and plan accordingly, and try to minimise the risk as much as you can. Fear of the unknown is a more pervasive, and invasive apprehension. It gives your mind free reign to come up with every possible spanner that can be thrown in the works of what you want to do.

Unfortunately it's also the most common fear that nearly all of us face at one time or another. I think mainly because we try and assimilate way too many variables in one go, and it all becomes a confusing mess of interrelated "What if's" that lead to the mind thinking "Oh hell no, this is just a house of cards just waiting to topple over." Perhaps a start on the path to dealing with this fear is to concentrate your attention more in the present, than the future. Take on the issues one at a time rather than trying to deal with everything at once and predict every possible outcome.

The fears you listed in your first post. Examine them one at a time.

Fear number one. The fear of being alone. You wonder if people would want anything to do with you once you transition. Something strikes me, when reading your second post. How you feel now, about socialising and interacting. You say that you find it difficult to socialise and impossible to date. So... forgive me if I'm missing something, but what exactly would be lost if you transitioned? As far as I can see, with the way you feel even thinking about transitioning, you're giving yourself the tools to feel better about yourself, to feel more secure in yourself, and a stronger base to actually go out and socialise with people, and maybe find that special someone.

Which makes me wonder, is it more the fear that the choice won't be yours to make? Like... you feel that at the moment, you have control over who you socialise with, or date. You could if you want to, but you don't want to because you feel uncomfortable playing a role you know isn't you. And that were that choice given to other people, they may reject you and there wouldn't be anything you could do about it. And that fear of rejection, and loss of control scares you more than the thought of being alone.

If so, that fear is the one you have to deal with. It's hard, I know. But a start is the realisation that everything you want to do, you want to do for yourself. Not to please other people, or to make other people like you. The realisation, and affirmation that you are doing it to make you feel better about yourself. Believe it or not, when you feel better about yourself, and start being more confident within yourself, this actually affects the way other people respond to you. Looks are less important than charisma and attitude. That's not to say it doesn't matter. It shouldn't matter, that's for sure. But feeling good about yourself has the added benefit that you want to make more of an effort in your appearance rather than just thinking "Yeah, whatever, I hate how I look so I don't care." And it can become a positive cycle which leads to some very unexpected results. People are more likely to care about you if you care about yourself. And if they reject you, then it may hurt, that's true, but that can be tempered somewhat by thinking whether you actually want to be associated with such superficial people, or whether you actually dodged a bullet and can find someone who isn't quite so shallow.

Also, think about it this way. What if you transition, find a bunch of friends, and even someone who loves you for who you are? How would it feel to know that you weren't being someone you're not? And that you can actually be yourself, live the way you want to live with them. Isn't that preferable to finding a bunch of folks who think they know you now but really don't have a clue, and hanging out with them just for the sake of saying you have people in your life? Rather than what if the worst happens... what if the best happens?

Fear number two. The only question I have to ask about this is... how good an actress are you? See the thing is, even if you don't change your outward appearance, people pick up on stuff. Not everyone is a knuckle-dragging gorilla that wouldn't know it was raining unless they got wet. And again, going by your second post, the way you feel now is already impacting your life. Enough for people who don't know, to suspect that something is wrong? I understand your fear. And... well, I can't say it's going to be okay. Because I've been in a situation where it was very not okay. But what I will say is this. You're already hiding from them, just... in a different way.

Fear number three. Firstly, if your family are unhappy about you doing this, then they're not going to tell you that you're going to be a supermodel. So perhaps it would be wise to take comments about whether you will or won't pass with a grain of salt. As much as I don't care for the word, I don't think passing is all about looks. As I've already mentioned, feeling more confident and happy within yourself is a big step towards being who you want to be, and wanting to express that in the best way you can. And sure, maybe some of it is your physical appearance, but hell women have a thousand and one tips and tricks to seemingly work magic on every part of your body. So I'm not at all sure it will be as hard as you think, or fear it will be.

Unfortunately, short of befriending Doc Brown, and somehow being able to snag a DeLorean to take you into the future, you can't know how it will turn out. But there are loads of things you can do to give yourself the best chance at being happy. Compared to the one thing you have to do to keep feeling this way... I'd say the balance is in going for it.

You won't be able to control other people and how they see you, but you will, perhaps for the first time, be able to control yourself and how you see you.
Natura nihil frustra facit.

"You yourself, as much as anybody in the entire universe, deserve your love and affection." ~ Buddha.

If you're dealing with self esteem issues, maybe click here. There may be something you find useful. :)
Above all... remember: you are beautiful, you are valuable, and you have a shining spark of magnificence within you. Don't let anyone take that from you. Embrace who you are. <3
  •  

stavraki

Quote from: learningtolive on July 25, 2013, 03:19:51 PM
First off, this thread will be a bit of a mess and quite jumbled.   So forgive me for the disorganization of this thread.   If you make it through, I congratulate you and thank you for any feedback you may have.  Lately, I have been having a lot of fears about my transition, and I wanted to see if any one has any suggestions or tips on how overcome them or improve them.  Also, I just kind of want to get it out as I feel pent up and don't have anyone other than my therapist to unleash this upon. Some of the thoughts presented here are controversial.  Understand this is just how I think of myself, not of anyone else.  These are my own personal hangups and fears/shame about being trans and the consequences of transitioning..  This mindset is limited to how I see myself, so please don't take offense to anything in this post.  The further I go into my transition (over a month on hormones), I need to learn how to confront these fears.  Any feedback or thoughts are appreciated. 

Fear number one.  I'm afraid that I will always be alone and transitioning will only solidify this.   I really have no one in my life in the moment.  I'm not really enriched with a lot of friends, I've never had a dating life, and soon I may not even have a family.  If things are bad know, what will happen once I fully transition.  Will it really become easier for me to date or make friends?  Sure, I never dated because of my dysphoria and I've always been shy around others because of this fact. So it that sense maybe there will be improvement.  But will people really want to date or befriend someone like me?  Why would they?  I'm a spectacle.  If I pass in the future, great, but if I don't, why would someone want to date a woman who looks like a guy.  Why would they want to be friends with someone who looks like a joke.  Maybe I just have no self esteem, but I fear transitioning will make me into more of a social reject than I already am.  If I don't pass and no one believes I'm a girl, will I really have a social life when they see me as a weirdo?  And I know for a fact that transitioning is damaging my relationship at home.  They want me to leave and may not want to see me again in the future. 

Fear number two. I fee like leaving everything behind.  I don't want to face those who already know me.  I'd rather leave them all behind and never see them again.  But you can't hide from your neighbors and acquaintances.  Sooner or later they will know?  What do I do?  What if they reject me or make life difficult for me?

Fear number 3. I'm terrified of never passing in my life. I'm young and have my whole life ahead of me, yet I can't help but feel my future only has bad things to come.  Perhaps one day I will pass, but I don't know.  My family always tells me I will never look the way I hope.  I fear they might be right.   I NEED to pass. A life as a man or an unpassable woman doesn't appeal to me.  I don't know if I could deal with it.  I don't know if I'd like to even live if that's my only options.  I don't judge others who don't have the same fear, so please don't judge me either. We all have our weaknesses and fears.  I just don't know how to overcome this.  I want to pass and need to.  But will it really ever happen.

I guess I fear that my life will only get worse.  As much as I want this and feel I HAVE to do this, I don't know how to get through it or if doing so will make things better.  I already have great difficulties meeting people and have always felt like a social reject.  I can't find employment and imagine it will only become harder the more my appearance changes.   My family is increasingly distancing themselves from me and I'm being asked to leave my home since they don't have to witness my transition.    How can one feel happy or satisfied without family, friends, employment, and shelter.  Is it really worth it?  Yet, the alternative of not transitioning leaves me with no other option than going into the unknown realm.  If both paths take me into same place is it really worth fighting on.  Is there really something worth living for?  I don't plan on doing anything so don't worry, but I can't help but feel I'm doomed no matter what.  Sometimes I have a romantic fantasy of leaving everything and everyone behind and running off as female in another country.   I could leave my past behind and finally feel satisfied.  I  could live as the girl I've always hoped to be and not deal with facing a hostile society because they'd never know.  Yet, that is only a fantasy.  All my problems will exist and running away won't allow my fears to be solved.  But then what do tou do if you can't solve them?    If I don't pass, they will persist and even get worse. 

I don't mean to ramble on and on, but does anyone have any suggestions for how to improve my situation or get over these fears.  I'm lost and don't know what to do or how to get out of the defeatist mind set.  I'm just scared.  I need to do this, but I don't know how or if I can make it.

U know what I really loved as I read--ur just candid. Straight up about fear, shame, social isolation and thats so refreshing.

I can't speak for the whole world, only for myself. There are at least two transgendered men I've know in my personal world who I would be more than happy to date. Hot. And really beautiful human beings. Of course, as same sex attracted, there would need to be the mutual attraction.  The genital things is not bother for me for there is a journey with the person and all that gets worked out where love is the guiding force. Transcends genital configurations.

About friendships and family -- that's a big question. Speaking personally. I've found that where others are willing to grow and go on a journey with us -- that's the special friendships: worth the pain shame fear and feelings of threat that go with transforming a friendship. It's what to do with the unwilling that's so so hard. Goodbye forever -- grief and lost love. But when to walk and when to stay? I don't know -- the pain threshold for each of us is different. And sometimes one of us quits when the other hasn't. And right there is where much human pain emerges I relationships.
Kind regards stav
Courage is fear that hasn't said its prayers yet
You don't have to forgive others because they deserve it.  Forgive them because you deserve peace

Fear of others is reminding you that you are in danger of becoming what you hate
Fear of self ensures that you don't become what you hate
  •  

Pia Bianca

First off, I'm absolutely happy that there are others with similar fears as I have.


Quote from: learningtolive on July 25, 2013, 03:19:51 PM
Fear number one.  I'm afraid that I will always be alone and transitioning will only solidify this.   I really have no one in my life in the moment.  I'm not really enriched with a lot of friends, I've never had a dating life, and soon I may not even have a family.  If things are bad know, what will happen once I fully transition.  Will it really become easier for me to date or make friends?  Sure, I never dated because of my dysphoria and I've always been shy around others because of this fact. So it that sense maybe there will be improvement.  But will people really want to date or befriend someone like me?  Why would they?  I'm a spectacle.  If I pass in the future, great, but if I don't, why would someone want to date a woman who looks like a guy.  Why would they want to be friends with someone who looks like a joke.  Maybe I just have no self esteem, but I fear transitioning will make me into more of a social reject than I already am.  If I don't pass and no one believes I'm a girl, will I really have a social life when they see me as a weirdo?  And I know for a fact that transitioning is damaging my relationship at home.  They want me to leave and may not want to see me again in the future. 
That pretty much sounds like a fear every genetic girl knows as well (at least as far as I know). They are too tall, too little, too fat, too slim... You get the point. That said, I still understand that your case is special as you change your gender. But still, that's only a physical aspect of you, isn't it? There are genetic girls with beards. Do they get a partner? There are tomboys, do they get a partner? As you will be kinda spectacle while you transition, you won't be afterwards. You might not be Pamela Anderson, you won't be the "perfect" girl. But you will be a girl and isn't that waht you want?


Quote from: learningtolive on July 25, 2013, 03:19:51 PM
Fear number two. I fee like leaving everything behind.  I don't want to face those who already know me.  I'd rather leave them all behind and never see them again.  But you can't hide from your neighbors and acquaintances.  Sooner or later they will know?  What do I do?  What if they reject me or make life difficult for me?
Where I live there is a consulting service for transsexuals. And even if I didn't do anything else since then, I was there for mentoring. The transwomen that mentored me told me that it would be hard for family, but friends would accept it without any problems most of the time. Her rule of thumb was: The more genetically related the more problems. So if your family already knows, the major part is done. As MTF, your mother will have the hardest time.


Quote from: learningtolive on July 25, 2013, 03:19:51 PM
Fear number 3. I'm terrified of never passing in my life. I'm young and have my whole life ahead of me, yet I can't help but feel my future only has bad things to come.  Perhaps one day I will pass, but I don't know.  My family always tells me I will never look the way I hope.  I fear they might be right.   I NEED to pass. A life as a man or an unpassable woman doesn't appeal to me.  I don't know if I could deal with it.  I don't know if I'd like to even live if that's my only options.  I don't judge others who don't have the same fear, so please don't judge me either. We all have our weaknesses and fears.  I just don't know how to overcome this.  I want to pass and need to.  But will it really ever happen.
You will pass eventually. As I was told the older you are the more equally the genders look like. (You could say: the more crinkles the less differences.) So while your body will feminize more and more with each year of transitioning, nature will help you as much.


Quote from: learningtolive on July 25, 2013, 03:19:51 PM
I could live as the girl I've always hoped to be and not deal with facing a hostile society because they'd never know.
I know that you didn't mean that, but you will never be the girl of your fantasy and neither are genetic girls. You'll eventually be a girl, but it wont be that of your fantasy; that's nothing even a genetic girl can achieve.
  •  

Cindy

It is always interesting to see how common many of our fears are, and how we respond to them.
As many of you know I'm 'old' don't pass, never will, can't be in stealth.

I'm not a young chick with her life ahead.

Will I be alone?
Funny I have been lonely my entire life. When I transitioned I suddenly found heaps of friends, including a guy who liked me. We sort of started a relationship which hit me from blindside.

I couldn't leave the people who knew me. I was amazed that in fact that they joined me. I did not expect that. I have lost one colleague, who (sadly) is now being rejected by his fellow colleagues for his inability to accept me. A situation I find interesting.

I don't pass. Can't. As a young woman you will. It has not affected my life in anyway at all; to my total surprise.In fact now use it as a positive, if you want to know a celebrity I'm her.

Society is growing up. I know what it was like 50 years ago. Believe me it is growing up and more accepting by an awful lot.

And the more trans*men and trans*woman stand up and be counted the more accepting it is.

Finally it is hard. It isn't easy. But it is doable.

The alternative is misery.

Of that I can assure you.


Cindy
  •  

Dreams2014

LtL I can really relate to many parts of your first post. I have next to no friends myself, I am isolated and I worry that when I finally take the steps to begin a transition I wonder if the people who are left in my life would accept me. I often think that I'd just let them go and start again, it would be easier.

I can't offer you any encouragement or advice about coming out to your family and friends as I'm nowhere near that stage myself and there are people here who are in a much, much better position to give you advice.

So I guess what I am trying to say is, I know it must be incredibly difficult but you're not alone in your troubles.
Farewell to my friends, farewell to the life I knew. I burn what once was, and in the ashes I am born anew.
  •  

Donna Elvira

#14
Quote from: iiii on July 26, 2013, 01:30:46 AM
That only works for specific people, not everyone can set up a goal and then simply move towards it.
It's easier to repress yourself before you've ever expressed yourself or taken steps that you want, once you've started it might become next to impossible to fully repress yourself again.


Hi iiii
I never suggested you can set up a goal and "then simply move towards it". However it has been proven over and over again that individual and organisations that have clearly set goals achieve far more than those who do not. When there is clarity of purpose, when you know why you are doing what you are doing, the obstacles and hassles  of day to day existance are far easier to handle. However just having an objective is not enough, you also need to do  some planning. In LtL's case for example, if getting money to do an FFS is the biggest issue so she's feels more comfortable about passing, (as you suggest in point 3 of your post)  what's the best way of going about it given where she is now? 

Regarding your second point I agree with you, up to a point, but I never suggested LtL repress herself. LtL or any of us are who we are and most of us have been aware of who we are for quite some time before deciding to transition. Some people, as evidenced by lots of other posts on this site, decide never to transition at all, in spite of being very aware of their condition and/or put things off until there are less obstacles to overcome. It is based on an implicit trade off between the cost of a transition, at a given point in time, and the expected benefits.

I can be quite poetic at times but this is a subject which is deadly serious especially when you are 24 years old with all of your life ahead of you. I have kids that are in the same age bracket as LtL and to be frank, I would go nuts with frustration if they sacrificed their ability  to live their full potential as human beings for short term gain. Happily for me they haven't!

Personally, much later on in my life with that much less to lose than someone as young as LtL, (far more of my life behind me than in front of me)  I still took it very easy with my transition because I still did not want the cure to be worse than the disease. As it happens, from every point of view it appears to me that LtL is asking herself exactly that question ie. when all is said and done, is it worth transitioning?

I didn't get into the relationship side of things because it would have made my replies, written late in the evening and very early in the morning far too long. However I really buy into Sephirah's answer which was probably more eloquant that anything I would have come up with. Positive relationships with others start with self acceptance.  However, I think you can reach self acceptance without doing a transition, it simply means accepting that being TG is not something to feel any shame about and just feeling OK to be youself. It was certainly the case for me and a necessary first step before even considering transition. I could also add that this self acceptance opened the door for me to get into the most positive relationship in my life, my second mariage. I was honest about who I was from day 1 but that did not lead to rejection and our relationship has only grown stronger over the years.

Another thing that helps dramatically in terms of self esteem and the feeling that you have some control over your existance is financial independance.

So I focused on the practical side of things because no matter what our feelings we have regarding our identity, just surviving, being able to pay the bills, has got to come before anything else. So, if I was LtL, that is what I would focus on today, even if it means putting her transition on the backburner for a while.

End of the day though, it is all LtL's choice. All we can do is help clarify the questions that need to be asked, ideally in a level headed manner.
Warm regards.
Donna

   

  •  

Ltl89

There are a lot of great replies here.  Thank you.  I will try to respond to every one individually later tonight when I have my laptop.  I suck at using taparalk, especially when I hqve much to write.
  •  

HM

#16
0
"Life is hard." - Dr. David Hawkins

"When the power of love, overcomes the love of power,
the world will know peace." - Jimi Hendrix
  •  

Ltl89

Once again, thank you everyone for your input.

Quote from: Joanna Dark on July 25, 2013, 07:21:01 PM
How hard do you think it will be for you to pass? I think a lot of times being able to pass isn't as hard as we think. I know for myself I don't think I pass most days and yet when I present male and am gendered female by most people. Yesterday, I was dressed mainly male, or andro-male, and this guy referred to me as he and his girlfriend who slightly tipsy, was trying to whisper I swear to god that is a girl there is no way she's a guy. It was SO awkward.

I think that is your main worry: passing. When you start to pass everything else will fall into place. First you will prolly go thru some hard times. But the end will be worth it. I also wouldn't put off transition. I can't and won;t put it off any longer. I barely made it to 30 and the only way I made it there was with the help of hard drugs, which were surprisingly easy to stop once I started transitioning. That's prolly because this is my main issue. If I was to stop, I would go back to doing drugs. Prolly within a day or two. It becomes that much harder now that I started because I feel like being whole is within reach and I am starting to like myself and accept myself. I hated myself before which makes relationships very hard and I am a very easdy person to love. Or at least everyone tells me so. Even if I could make it to 60, I wouldn't want to. Why would I want to live another 30 years like thislast 30 years. That sounds horrid. I'd rather be dead. I don't care about my career, my family, or anything, if I don not do this I will be compltely unhappy and I want to feel happy for once. I suspect you feel the same. In this we are like sisters, so please don't feel alone.

You should come to Philly. It's not far and I am your friend. BTW, your not being whiney. This is completely normal.

Thank you Joanna.  I hope it will fall into place as well,  The problem is I don't have any gurantee and that scares me.  While you are passing, there are many who don't.  Perhaps I am too insecure and worrisome, but I fear I will never get there.  My family makes it a point to show how "masculine" I am.  It crushes me.  However, I have been told by other that I will pass just fine in time.  Perhaps I just need to learn to be patient and play the waiting game.  And I share a similar view that you hold on life without transitioning.

Quote from: Victoria Mitchell on July 25, 2013, 08:10:44 PM
Yeah, pretty much that. Given all your current issues, it's totally understandable.

If you think that you need to transition, then transition. Know that doing that has costs, accept them into your heart and mind and move on. Everyone I've known has had *some* part of their life ripped out by transition, even the best cases. It's not going to be easy. It's not going to feel comfortable for a long while. Work on it every day, realize that this is a chance for you to be yourself and that, fortunately enough, you get a lot of chances to do things completely differently, should you so choose.

Two cents: I transitioned about five years after you did, on the timeline. I was awkward and weird. I'm still awkward and weird but I'm honest and people respond to being genuine and sincere so, my life is pretty full of awesome friends that I do nifty things with. You'll probably find that life works out that way.

Fear is pointless, love is generally the answer, knowing where you're going takes a plan of how to get there. Three wonderfully glib clichés for you but, there you go.

Finally: If you feel that you MUST transition, then do so but if you feel that you *CAN* live life without, then maybe it's a good idea to reflect. I'm not kidding about costs. I'm an ideal case when it comes to how easy it was (partner stayed, kept job, life got way better) but in no way did I not lose things and people. I decided that this was critical and so, made peace with whatever would come to pass because of it. It didn't take the sting out when people suddenly disappeared on me or publicly screeched at me about how 'awful' or 'fake' or <whatever> it was but it did keep one foot in front of the other.

I see what you mean.  I do need to transition, but I hate the costs.  The main issue is not knowing what the costs will be or what the extent of them are.  I'm not talking financially, but emotionally.  If I transition and never pass or get acceptance, then I did something I needed to do but had a poor result.  There is no way to ensure that everything will work out and I understand that.  I just don't want a terrible outcome both physically and emotionally.  And the scary thing is we have no control over this.  This is up to how well we pass and how accepting others are.  Sure, we have some say in the passing department, but only a little.  The judgements of others, however, is entirely out of our hands.  That scares me.

Quote from: Cynthia Michelle on July 25, 2013, 08:12:00 PM
I look at transitioning from this perspective. I will follow the journey and weigh the benefits and negatives. I will work to achieve the path I feel is right for me. Since HRT things have been better. My co-workers that know are really very supportive. My wife is tolerating it. There have been some minor changes physically and they will continue. Mentally, I feel wonderful. Just doing something has helped (really quite a lot).

Physically, eventually the changes will accumulate and I then will have more choices. I will do what feels good to me, with lots or thought.

I am introverted, married a woman who seduced me and is dominant. I hid being TG from her (did not want to lose her) and have caused her pain.

I am who I am. Most likely I will compromise in the end. One important thing, I no longer think of the 2 options while going to work (life or death). There were a few weeks in December (if I still took drugs) I would not be here. Now, I have a lot of options and none of them include death.

The problem for me is that my family is NOT accepting of it.  They aren't even tolerating it.  At the end of the day, I can't make anyone else feel one way or another about my decision to transition.  But that's what makes it hard.  The prospect of losing my family is very difficult to me.  It's like I have to choose between them or myself.  Which I feel isn't really fair to be having to go through.  And the other issue is that I am young.  I have no spouse.  I can't imagine a guy would ever be able to fall in love with me as I am.  Maybe it will happen, but I fear not.  So, again it's like choosing the path that will make me happy with myself will cause others to shun me and reject me.  It's a hard fact to deal with. 
  •  

Ltl89

Quote from: Misato on July 25, 2013, 10:18:15 PM
Hey LTL,

I do think as you, we, transition it brings out an authenticity in us that other people can gravitate toward.  I know I've lamented some bad experiences I've had of late on this forum but, just Wednesday I had a very nice chat with one of my co-workers as I drove us to the grocery store so I could pick up lunch (she's fasting for Ramadan).  Before I left I sent out an e-mail saying, "Anyone wanna tag along?" and she said yes.  I've had a chain of experiences like that going back to a time before I even started therapy which makes me think we have reason to be careful that we're not projecting our own fears onto other people. 


  • I went as me to this group at school for Trans people (this was before I started therapy) and I said, "I don't take the bus here because I might make other people uncomfortable." And the others just looked at me, dumbfounded.  So, what the heck I thought, I went for the bus and this little kid came up to me and said, "Excuse me miss, would you like to buy..." I forget what he was selling but he gendered me right! And I had an uneventful bus ride home.
  • There was a Russian Orthodox woman I befriended who studied with me and whose husband gave me lifts back to my apartment at night.  This was during my RLE so I wasn't close to being on hormones yet.  Not that I pass today... But my point is, they didn't care.

Anyway, it does seem there are a lot of cisgendered people who don't care what you look like, they care about who you are.  I think, I hope, that extends to love too.  My SO is still with me despite me looking less masculine.

As someone who doesn't pass all I can say is life remains better than before.  Hard, but still better.  Heck, I'm sober!  Even though my stress has increased, my desire for a drink continues to plummet. :)  So while not passing is not ideal, life can still be much better than before.

On the employment front, the upper, upper management at my employer has a 1980's mentality when it comes to LGBT issues, hence my insurance woes.  But!  My immediate management gave me a sentiment card to let me know they applicate my effort and a $100 gift card because they feel bad about my insurance situation and, yes, because I'm a far more talented engineer than they thought they were hiring.  Those gestures may not have solved my insurance issue, but they do tell me these people care about me.

Family.  If they're pushing you away because they don't want to see you transition, I suspect they've done enough damage to you and you'll be better off without them.

LTL, from what I've seen of you here you seem like a really nice and wonderful person.  Bet on that, grow it.  I think it's your key to finding a solution to all the problems you see or fear that are coming.

Thanks Misato. I guess hindsight is 20/20 and those of us starting out will lack the proper perspective needed.  It's all the unknowns that scare me, but I suppose the only cure for that is pushing on with confidence.

Quote from: Donna Elvira on July 25, 2013, 11:22:54 PM

LtL, No matter what you want, at any particular point in time this has to be confronted with what you can actually do. Otherwise, you end out in a fantasy world. So yes, all the obstacles, roadblocks etc that you mention are real but they exist for lots of other people too.

Overall, I would suggest that if it is clear in your mind where you want to go, make a plan and start working to it. It might take a long time to get there but the extraordinary thing about actually making a plan is that the notion of time changes completely. If my objective is to get a medical degree I know from the outset that it will take x years and that it will be a really hard slog. However, since I know that to begin with, in spite of the difficulties I have a reason for sticking to it.  Actually just writing this reminds me of yet another book I read years ago called "Man's search for meaning" by a guy called Viktor Frankl: http://www.amazon.com/Mans-Search-for-Meaning-ebook/dp/B001KQZ7I8/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1374810252&sr=1-1&keywords=viktor+frankl

The basic idea that is developed is that if you if you have a good enough reason to want something you will find the means to achieve it and just knowing that you are on the road towards your goal already changes the way you perceive your day to day life. When you have no purpose, when nothing in your life has any meaning, it can just feel like an endless struggle. When you do have a purpose and there is meaning behind what you are going through, the realities on the ground are still  the same but it feels very different and far more acceptable.  You actually say as much yourself in the following phrase "The idea of transitioning has brought me immnense happiness rhatbi don't want to give up." You already know what you need to do, you just don't quite know how to get there yet.

Regarding that, I never suggested you give up by the way. I just suggested it might not be the most important thing for you to do right now but only you can work that out and, as I have said a few times before, no matter what your choice, then accept that you have to live with it, at least for a certain amount of time.

Last comment on a far more practical level. Two years ago, I had no idea whether I could pass successfully which for me was also key to transitioning.I had a really masculine face. Thanks to HRT and even more so, FFS, I now pass without any problem. I was able to do the FFS because I earn enough money to pay for it and that it because I invested seriously in my education when I was pretty much your age. At 23 years of age I went back to school for 6 years, used all my savings, worked all my vacations, weekends etc.. to get myself through but actually ended out in a pretty good  place.

So, looking at your situation, at least one of the alternatives you are facing is rushing to the finishing line now ie. transitioning immediately and damn the consequences or taking a more long term view of things, putting yourself in a position where you on more solid ground re. work, finances etc...so that you have more control over your life. That is what I am referring to when I say you need a plan.

Not making a choice is also a choice by the way but one which generally leads to other people making choices for you. At the end of the day, it's your call!
Warm regards.
Donagh




I know what you mean Donna.  I should be developing a better plan on how to accomplish this financially.  I am taking care of these things as best I can at the moment.  However, I don't think there is a way to make a plan on how to pass, to get others to accept you for who you are and to not judge you.  Most of this is out of our hands.  I know we talk about hormones this, FFS that, but that only does so much in terms of passing.  There are never any guarantees.  Having money is great and it can allow one to invest in their transition but even all the money in the world can't make you pass.  Besides I have no plan on FFS.  I have been told I don't need it, and I would never get work done on my face.  It's too frightening to me.  For the most part, passing is something that is out of our hands.  We are either lucky with the results we get or we aren't.  I'm just frightened that I won't get decent or okay results.  I don't think there is a plan we can make to pass.  That's what scares me.  What if the hormones don't work?  There isn't anything I can do about that.  That's what makes me hopeless about it.  And the same can be said about societal reactions.  I can't plan how everyone else sees me.  If they judge me or see me as a weirdo because of my trans status, then that is how they will see me.  The fear is not having control over my own future because much of these aspects are out of my hands.

Quote from: JLT1 on July 25, 2013, 11:38:54 PM
LTL,

I am saddened by your worries.  They are normal, but they still make me sad.  Often, in my life, I have found that my worst fears do not come true but they have led me to do better planning (a silver lining!).  I hope this is the case for you.  Having said that, I'm glad you are still on-line.

There is no way that I know that would allow anyone to predict the effect of HRT.   I have seen some people go through dramatic changes.  Hey, I went though dramatic changes.  I know I will need some FFS.  But before HRT, even FFS couldn't have made me look feminine.  I know, I checked....that would have been tough (and expensive!) to even get close. Now, hey, it's possible!  My facial bone structure is one big reason I have lived a life that has mostly consisted of going through the motions, not really living it. In no way do I recommend that option...

I have also found that transitioning can boost confidence and with confidence come "like-ability".  Transitioning brings new experiences (both good and bad).  You should be the same person but there is a lot to be said for being comfortable in your own skin.  That, in turn, affects the way you interact with people.

What are you studying?  Does the University of Chicago (U of C) have a good program??? (for some reason, that one came to mind first).  How about  MIT???  Cal Tech???  UNC Chapel Hill???  University of MN???  I know people at those schools.  I don't know anyone at any school in NY.

Thank you for your kind words.  I hope confidence will come with transitioning.

I was a political science major.  My goal is to study Comparative Politics in grad school, but sometimes I consider political psychology.  I have to make up my mind soon,lol.   
  •  

Ltl89

Quote from: Sephirah on July 26, 2013, 12:39:24 AM
From the tone of your posts, it sounds to me like you already have enough roadblocks in your life, brought on by your own feelings about being forced to live as someone you're not. How it makes you feel about interacting with people, and forming connections.

Short of being practical, something I'm not super well known for. I'm going to suggest a few things, perhaps of a more esoteric nature.

First of all, I'm not sure that transition is the cause of the fears you have. It's a symptom, sure, but... hmm... I wonder if it's more a twofold fear of the unknown, and of losing control. What I mean by that is... your posts give a lot of importance to how other people will treat you or what they will think. What if they do this, or think that, or say the other? That unpredictability. Uncertainty. And the second part to that is a fear that these reactions are based on something you have very little control over. And can't get away from.

Knowing you're going to have to face something, and being afraid of it, is a different sort of apprehension than not knowing what you're going to face. When you know what's going to happen, you can prepare for it, and plan accordingly, and try to minimise the risk as much as you can. Fear of the unknown is a more pervasive, and invasive apprehension. It gives your mind free reign to come up with every possible spanner that can be thrown in the works of what you want to do.

Unfortunately it's also the most common fear that nearly all of us face at one time or another. I think mainly because we try and assimilate way too many variables in one go, and it all becomes a confusing mess of interrelated "What if's" that lead to the mind thinking "Oh hell no, this is just a house of cards just waiting to topple over." Perhaps a start on the path to dealing with this fear is to concentrate your attention more in the present, than the future. Take on the issues one at a time rather than trying to deal with everything at once and predict every possible outcome.

The fears you listed in your first post. Examine them one at a time.

Fear number one. The fear of being alone. You wonder if people would want anything to do with you once you transition. Something strikes me, when reading your second post. How you feel now, about socialising and interacting. You say that you find it difficult to socialise and impossible to date. So... forgive me if I'm missing something, but what exactly would be lost if you transitioned? As far as I can see, with the way you feel even thinking about transitioning, you're giving yourself the tools to feel better about yourself, to feel more secure in yourself, and a stronger base to actually go out and socialise with people, and maybe find that special someone.

Which makes me wonder, is it more the fear that the choice won't be yours to make? Like... you feel that at the moment, you have control over who you socialise with, or date. You could if you want to, but you don't want to because you feel uncomfortable playing a role you know isn't you. And that were that choice given to other people, they may reject you and there wouldn't be anything you could do about it. And that fear of rejection, and loss of control scares you more than the thought of being alone.

If so, that fear is the one you have to deal with. It's hard, I know. But a start is the realisation that everything you want to do, you want to do for yourself. Not to please other people, or to make other people like you. The realisation, and affirmation that you are doing it to make you feel better about yourself. Believe it or not, when you feel better about yourself, and start being more confident within yourself, this actually affects the way other people respond to you. Looks are less important than charisma and attitude. That's not to say it doesn't matter. It shouldn't matter, that's for sure. But feeling good about yourself has the added benefit that you want to make more of an effort in your appearance rather than just thinking "Yeah, whatever, I hate how I look so I don't care." And it can become a positive cycle which leads to some very unexpected results. People are more likely to care about you if you care about yourself. And if they reject you, then it may hurt, that's true, but that can be tempered somewhat by thinking whether you actually want to be associated with such superficial people, or whether you actually dodged a bullet and can find someone who isn't quite so shallow.

Also, think about it this way. What if you transition, find a bunch of friends, and even someone who loves you for who you are? How would it feel to know that you weren't being someone you're not? And that you can actually be yourself, live the way you want to live with them. Isn't that preferable to finding a bunch of folks who think they know you now but really don't have a clue, and hanging out with them just for the sake of saying you have people in your life? Rather than what if the worst happens... what if the best happens?

Fear number two. The only question I have to ask about this is... how good an actress are you? See the thing is, even if you don't change your outward appearance, people pick up on stuff. Not everyone is a knuckle-dragging gorilla that wouldn't know it was raining unless they got wet. And again, going by your second post, the way you feel now is already impacting your life. Enough for people who don't know, to suspect that something is wrong? I understand your fear. And... well, I can't say it's going to be okay. Because I've been in a situation where it was very not okay. But what I will say is this. You're already hiding from them, just... in a different way.

Fear number three. Firstly, if your family are unhappy about you doing this, then they're not going to tell you that you're going to be a supermodel. So perhaps it would be wise to take comments about whether you will or won't pass with a grain of salt. As much as I don't care for the word, I don't think passing is all about looks. As I've already mentioned, feeling more confident and happy within yourself is a big step towards being who you want to be, and wanting to express that in the best way you can. And sure, maybe some of it is your physical appearance, but hell women have a thousand and one tips and tricks to seemingly work magic on every part of your body. So I'm not at all sure it will be as hard as you think, or fear it will be.

Unfortunately, short of befriending Doc Brown, and somehow being able to snag a DeLorean to take you into the future, you can't know how it will turn out. But there are loads of things you can do to give yourself the best chance at being happy. Compared to the one thing you have to do to keep feeling this way... I'd say the balance is in going for it.

You won't be able to control other people and how they see you, but you will, perhaps for the first time, be able to control yourself and how you see you.

This was a great post.  I DO care deeply about what others think of me.  I'm very self conscious and have always desired to have the approval of other people.  When I don't have it, it tortures me.  The idea that I won't have any control over that, nor do I at this moment, is very scary.  My mom was telling me today that I'm going to get assaulted and people will vandalize our house.  While that sounds like fear mongering, it does happen.  People aren't very friendly to the trans community.  If one can't blend, then they may face more rejection and societal hostility.  It sucks.  And this is what frightens me.  Constantly be the outcast and having everyone hate me for being trans.  I also get scared people will laugh at me and judge me in general if I don't pass. In that scenario, I will forever be a societal reject.  I guess I need to learn to get over this.  I just wish I knew how.

Quote from: stavraki on July 26, 2013, 12:51:24 AM
U know what I really loved as I read--ur just candid. Straight up about fear, shame, social isolation and thats so refreshing.

I can't speak for the whole world, only for myself. There are at least two transgendered men I've know in my personal world who I would be more than happy to date. Hot. And really beautiful human beings. Of course, as same sex attracted, there would need to be the mutual attraction.  The genital things is not bother for me for there is a journey with the person and all that gets worked out where love is the guiding force. Transcends genital configurations.

About friendships and family -- that's a big question. Speaking personally. I've found that where others are willing to grow and go on a journey with us -- that's the special friendships: worth the pain shame fear and feelings of threat that go with transforming a friendship. It's what to do with the unwilling that's so so hard. Goodbye forever -- grief and lost love. But when to walk and when to stay? I don't know -- the pain threshold for each of us is different. And sometimes one of us quits when the other hasn't. And right there is where much human pain emerges I relationships.
Kind regards stav

On the family front, I am pretty much in some kind of purgatory.  I have always been close with my family and to lose that relationship has been hard.  And I'm scared things won't improve. 

Quote from: iiii on July 26, 2013, 01:30:46 AM
That only works for specific people, not everyone can set up a goal and then simply move towards it.
It's easier to repress yourself before you've ever expressed yourself or taken steps that you want, once you've started it might become next to impossible to fully repress yourself again.

Well anyway...

1. I don't think you'd end up alone, that nobody would date you... but it might end up not being the way you want to. Same with friends, I'm sure you can get them, but you might not like the crowd you get.

2. Fear of rejection is fairly normal, and if you really value the people you might have to face that fear and come out to them. Personally though, I don't value the "friendships" I had, so for me it's less of a rejection of fear, and more that I don't want to deal with them. I suppose it's good to know why you want to run away from them, if it's because you fear their rejection or because you'd rather not want to be with them, changing sex/gender is a pretty big thing that will change your friendship somewhat too...
It's perfectly possible to hide btw, I've been hiding for 3 years now, and nobody knows anything.

3. Really I think this is your real fear, everything is bound to this. If you pass fear nr.1 wouldn't exist, if you pass fear nr.2 might be lessened, as you could easily fill your life with other people and have support from them instead.
Only way I see to overcome this fear is by self-defeatism, to assume you'll never pass but find reasons to be happy anyway. I really don't like that solution though, as it's compromising a big part of yourself. Otherwise, you can't know if you'll pass or not, I suppose you could form an idea about it, but it's not certain. The best you can do is to start saving up money, since surgery is almost a guaranteed way to passing. It may sound like an impossible sum of money, but you might not need full FFS from dr.speigel to pass, maybe you only need rhinoplasty or forehead work, or maybe you won't need any surgery at all to pass.
So, if you're able to, aim to set up a safety net, as in money. If you can't do that, then it becomes harder... then you'll just have to live with things and hope you end up passing, there's really nothing else to do in that case.
I suppose if you could find something else to concentrate on it could become easier, but really that could be extremely hard to find, depending on how you function.

I've been told that I won't need FFS and I have no plans with going through it.  I guess my fear of not passing comes with the fact that I'm still early in my transition. I just am afraid the hormones will have no effect and I won't appear as female to others.  But this is probably my own negative attitude defeating me.
  •