Why the F* should we bother paying for this site?

[Devlyn]

Please, this thread is meant to help the site, which means continuing to help people. Let's not argue, and if you must argue, please take it private. Hugs, Devlyn

[DriftingCrow]

That's a bold statement.  You've got a lot of gaul.  I don't have a single pair of shoes that fit me.  I can't afford a bra in my size.  I DON'T HAVE $5 TO SPARE RIGHT NOW!

While Lesley may have come across as harsh, let's not get upset. I am sure the majority of people on this site have been in situations where they've not been able to spare even a dollar, and it's not something one will easily forget (I'll never forget having to pay my rent on my credit card and wondering where I'll live when I am homeless, that was a time in my life where I couldn't donate even a buck), no one here is trying to get people who can't afford to donate to donate.

Oriah (or maybe it was someone else. . . ), I know you expressed concerns on not feeling welcome if you don't donate. Everyone is welcome here, just ignore or report people you think might be making things hostile. No one (besides Susan) knows who is a subscriber, people can donate as anonymous, so none of the regular members here can tell who decided to donate and who did not.

[JessicaH]

Wow, I can't believe how defensive some people are getting. No one meant to insult anyone in asking the users to support the site. If you don't have it, it was made clear that you aren't the one being asked. Too many here are looking WAY to hard for something to get offended about which seems like a reoccurring theme I see in the trans community.

[Jamie D]

This is true. The site needs to start acting with more business sense than charity sense. It looks like it's stuck in the 90's. It needs an update.

Indeed, those are some of the updates planned for the future.

Susan wrote in another post, "I am so excited about what the future holds for the site. The new design, which will cost thousands of dollars to do right, will bring us up in terms of usability as well as being appealing to the eye. It will also give us a consistent framework and look throughout the site."

[Joanna Dark]

Wow, I can't believe how defensive some people are getting. No one meant to insult anyone in asking the users to support the site. If you don't have it, it was made clear that you aren't the one being asked. Too many here are looking WAY to hard for something to get offended about which seems like a reoccurring theme I see in the trans community.

Maybe you don't know what it is like to be poor and wonder when you're next meal is coming. I don't think Cindy's OP was offensive at all just a call to arms in strong words. But when someone says they can't afford to right now and then someone else says "I really don't think there is anyone who can't find five dollars" it is offensive. Why not just say let them eat cake. That is the mindset.

That being said perhaps to be able to send PMs you have to make a one time donation of $1. Maybe not. Another thing that can be done is to delete some of the posts pre-2008. Or to limit the size of images and avatars. If everyone uses a 5 MB image it will take about much space. I used to run a magazine and the publisher said that most of space was taken up by images. Or limit the amount of times one can post images per month without incurring a fee.

That being said let's hope this money debate ends and let's look for constructive ways to help the site limit costs.

[Sara Thomas]

Best of luck, Ms. Obrien! 

[Nero]

Another thing that can be done is to delete some of the posts pre-2008.

The history is too valuable. There are some other good ideas you have there though.

Or to limit the size of images and avatars. If everyone uses a 5 MB image it will take about much space. I used to run a magazine and the publisher said that most of space was taken up by images. Or limit the amount of times one can post images per month without incurring a fee.

That being said let's hope this money debate ends and let's look for constructive ways to help the site limit costs.

[randomroads]

I can donate the second week of August and monthly after that. Should I choose a subscription over a donation so that it's reoccurring? And what's with this private sub forum? What goes on in there?

[Dreams2014]

I can donate the second week of August and monthly after that. Should I choose a subscription over a donation so that it's reoccurring? And what's with this private sub forum? What goes on in there?

Some weird Freemason like stuff probably.

[Devlyn]

I can donate the second week of August and monthly after that. Should I choose a subscription over a donation so that it's reoccurring? And what's with this private sub forum? What goes on in there?

Some weird Freemason like stuff probably.

There was a Moderator Battle Royale between JamieD and myself on the first day! Well, I ran screaming like a little girl, but that's beside the point.

[Dreams2014]

There was a Moderator Battle Royale between JamieD and myself on the first day! Well, I ran screaming like a little girl, but that's beside the point.

You don't drink the blood of cis females do you?

[StellaB]

I see this from both sides as I run my own non-profit organization literally on a shoestring - I'm on welfare, there's currently no funding and running costs account for roughly 50% of my income, just so people know where I'm coming from. Plus I'm on welfare to work and my major source of income a small amount of funding for riot recovery work (which I've almost completed) vanished into thin air thanks to austerity and spending cuts.

I think a couple of people need to step back and seriously think about their approach here considering that you are approaching the users of the website.

Almost everyone is pretty choosy with their altruism, and this includes the kind souls who give up their time, energy, ideas, and material resources who are the lifeblood of the dot org community.

But even then people still operate out of self-interest. As this thread has shown if you lay it on heavy people are going to get their panties in a bunch. If you start guilt-tripping users who up to this point have been led to believe that they have free access to a support site you're going to start losing users, and from this traffic.

I'm going to suggest a different approach. I don't have any spare money and I don't have that much time. But there are other ways.

For example if I could find a transguy close to London interested in acting and also a musician (anywhere) to collaborate with I'm pretty sure that I could come up with a short film which could be used to make a one off donation.

You'll need to learn around a dozen or so lines of script and be available over a weekend (Saturday and Sunday) for filming, but you'll get a credit and will be able to tell people that you've been in a movie. If you're interested PM me and I will reveal all.

See how it works? I'm sure I'm not the only creative person here using this site, in fact I'm sure I'm not. This is something I spoke about a few weeks ago with some actors and I see something positive here, a chance to create a short movie to raise awareness on trans issues whilst raising a bit of dosh for this website.

I could say everybody knows somebody, but I'm not going to fall into that trap. Maybe some of you are well connected enough to arrange a screening and pass round a hat. If you're not for a one off donation to the website you get a short movie.

I'm happy to send the finished product to those who run the site and they can sell it with my blessing to raise funds.

I don't have to be the only one doing this either. How many of you are sitting in front of a computer with your own creative works sitting on your hard disk?

Just a suggestion.

[DriftingCrow]

Stella, a video sounds like an awesome idea, too bad I am on the other side of the pond. I hope you find some actors. 

[LordKAT]

I would sincerely hate to see ads on this site. I tend to quit sites with ads.

[Dreams2014]

I would sincerely hateto se eads on this site. I tend to quit sites with ads.

Unfortunately that may be the price for keeping the site alive. Websites don't pay for themselves.

[Devlyn]

No, the idea of subscriptions and donations is to avoid the ads. If you only knew how much time we spend removing spam from this site. Susan has kept it ad free all along, like LordKat, I too would hate to see that end.

[Joe.]

I'm not going to lie, when I first saw this post I was thinking woah ok then. When the idea of  subscriptions came in to see the just for us board, I was fairly upset. I had no idea how I was going to afford to donate, let alone subscribe. I felt really guilty about the whole thing. However, I've been thinking hard about this the past few days. This site has been here for me whenever I've needed it. I've made friends on here who mean a lot to me, I've contacted people in the middle of the night when I've felt like giving up. This site is my family and it has quite honestly saved my life. If it went, I don't know what I'd do. Susan has kept this running for so long off her own back. She didn't have to, she still doesn't have to now. If I have to go without something every month then that's what I'm going to have to do. This site means more to me than a lot of things.

I know not everybody can, and I completely understand where people are coming from, so I don't want people to feel guilty if they can't donate. Together as the strong family we are, we can keep this site going. There will be months where I may not be able to subscribe/donate, but somebody else can, and there will be months where some people can't donate but I can. It doesn't matter if you can't donate or subscribe all the time, nobody is asking that. But when you can, please do, and we can keep Susan's alive as a family.

[Arch]

No ads, please!!!

I go to another support site (not trans) that is ad-free, and that is one thing I like about it. It's always a jolt when I move from Susan's and that other site to, say, news sites that have ads and popups all over the place. When I'm in need--that is, when I need support--the last thing I want to see is ads.

I know that I can block popups, but I didn't know I could block any old ads...that doesn't seem possible. Is it?

[Ltl89]

You can block ads with an adblocker.  I don't want to promote any particular ones, but they have extensions available for Firefox and Chrome that will allow one to be ad free.   Of course, blocking them prevents the site from collecting revenue on that Ad.  I don't see the big deal about putting some ads on the site.  As long as it isn't intrusive, it will be a great way to collect revenue.  The subscriber and donation model (alone) may not be sustainable long term.  While there are some frequent users here, there are too many casual users.  Also, when services go premium you run the risk of losing traffic which hurts the overall long term stability of the site.  Donations and subscriptions are fine, and I hope it works out long term, but I think there needs to be a more stable business plan in motion to ensure the site remains.  Charity isn't likely to do it alone.  That doesn't work for most other sites on the web.  And this site gets decent traffic and continues to grow.  The ad revenue would likely cut many of the costs off for Susan.  It makes sense.

[Devlyn]

You can block ads with an adblocker.  I don't want to promote any particular ones, but they have extensions available for Firefox and Chrome that will allow one to be ad free.   Of course, blocking them prevents the site from collecting revenue on that Ad.  I don't see the big deal about putting some ads on the site.  As long as it isn't intrusive, it will be a great way to collect revenue.  The subscriber and donation model (alone) may not be sustainable long term.  While there are some frequent users here, there are too many casual users.  Also, when services go premium you run the risk of losing traffic which hurts the overall long term stability of the site.  Donations and subscriptions are fine, and I hope it works out long term, but I think there needs to be a more stable business plan in motion to ensure the site remains.  Charity isn't likely to do it alone.  That doesn't work for most other sites on the web.  And this site gets decent traffic and continues to grow.  The ad revenue would likely cut many of the costs off for Susan.  It makes sense.

You must be kidding! That ad in the top right corner of the page is already driving me crazy






























Wondering how many people just scrolled up.    <running away>