Quote from: Robbie on August 24, 2007, 05:19:57 PM
Why do we get so upset when our ideals and beliefs are challenged? Upset is the word I want to focus on here. I have never once sat here at my computer in its secret secure bunker somewhere in PA and said I am the end all be all of transsexuals and those who don't follow me are all fools. My teachings are the only way. I don't know anymore or less then the rest of you. All I am doing is challenging the ideals we all have. People get upset because they know their stance is shaky and then emotion overrides knowledge.
I have never attacked any of you for your views. All that is going on is a frank discussion. Please don't take you marbles and go home just because you don't like the questions. Again at the end of the day this is all just a discussion. Let's all look through the emotion and use logic to get a look at some of the issues that are real issues to us, that we just cannot walk away from. 
Have you seen yourself over these past four posts by others being attacked!? Has anyone called you a name or discounted your reality as being less than real? In fact, go back and read through this thread. Have you seen an attack from anyone? All I can find is people saying
that is not my experience in response to your dicta.
I see women telling you that we are not transsexuals anymore, perhaps never were, or at least, that we have no desire to be seen that way. I do not see any attacks. Nor do I see anyone taking their marbles and going home. (I, anyhow, don't have marbles and I have never played that game. I might take my Raggedy Anne, or My Little Pony, and go home,
that I have done!
)
I would also suggest that to use logic requires an understanding of what logic is. Logic is a way of speaking about language. Basically, whether or not certain terminology and usage has validity within the context of the argumentation. Logic is not a defining characteristic of
REALITY, just a way to use words. See?
Reality is not necessarily logical, because
Reality is not a series of words, sentences and arguments. Logic is not a view of the world or an expression of any
Reality whatesoever.
Robbie, what I continue to see is that this discussion on your part appears to demand that many of us who have experienced our lives differently agree that we
are all transsexuals. That is not my reality, just your words. My reality is that I walk through my life and the world away from boards like any other woman. I do not get "read." I do not have difficulties due to having lost male gender acculturation. (I found it not very deep and a constant hassle and just dropped it.) I interact with other women and men, not
as if I am a woman. But
as a woman, because that is who I am.
Now, your mileage may vary from mine. I understand that. If you wish to say: This is my experience of this or that, then I have no problem with what you say. What I have read though is that you think my life is somehow
shaky, and
upset.
My life and experience do not attack yours just because they appear to be different than yours. And I use
appear advisedly because I do not know how you walk through the world. The argument on your part might simply be an argument and have no basis in your day-to-day reality.
Some of us
will argue from emotion and intuition. That, my dear, is a function of how we are and how we are comfortable. You may be comfortable in a different mode. But, please understand this, I cannot deny the substance and the reality of the life I lead for the sake of
your argument! It will not occur. Nor do I see a need for either of us to give up what we live. All I see a need for is that we understand that our reality need not be everyone else's reality.
So, were I to choose to continue this with you, you would have to get used to me using emotion/intuition to make any points I would have.
Fact is, you have not attacked any ideals and beliefs of mine. Why? Because I have not placed any of those in front of you to attack. I don't come to boards with
teachings. Why would I come to a board
presuming that anyone would require my services as a teacher? For me that would be breathtakingly vain. What I attempt to do is express my experiences in living my own life. Those are experiences, but not teachings. Just one woman's existence in the world.
Yet, what I read in your posts is that you do not seem to believe that my reality is real. And my
stance, is not a stance: it is my life. If it doesn't conform to your standard of reality, then you appear to discard it from your perspective as not being real and go along with your own beliefs intact and needing no adjustment after reading how I experience reality. Instead, you simply declare that I am emotional, upset and illogical. (Hmm, there is something familiar about that.)
Unlike you, I don't have
teachings to either defend or offend with. I simply have a life, and that life does not conform with the thoughts you have
apparently expressed as your ideas previously. About my life: you do
indeed know a heck of a lot less than do I.
Thanks for your understanding,
Nichole
