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Yeson voice feminization surgery 2.0

Started by anjaq, July 21, 2015, 07:05:50 AM

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Denjin

Thanks, Anja.  Guess I'll have to 'play around' with my voice next week.  Hopefully I have one, as I was surprised when nothing came out at all when accidentally trying to speak earlier.
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anjaq

It's a bit of a journey to find the voice again and to find out how to use it properly. I am not even done yet after over a year, but I am a slow learner, as it seems ;) - most get it after 6-9 months.

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Ritana

Anja

I am getting a little worried. It has been 3 months and one week since my surgery, and my voice still sounds hoarse and a bit raspy. My pitch has dropped too. 2.5 months post op I was able to reach 254 hz ( the max fundamental frequency I achieved). Now my mean frequency has dropped  to around 200 hz, and the hoarseness is still there!
A post-op woman
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anjaq

Ritana - the 3 month mark is usually where the Botox stops working and the voice gets a bit different again. So you probably are in that phase. Remember that 200 Hz are totally fine as an average pitch, even 180 Hz would be totally fine. 254 Hz is a pitch that is not really the regular average pitch after a voice surgery unless you happen to have a female pitch before the surgery already.
Breathiness/Hoarseness and lower pitch go hand in hand - same with lower volume. Its part of the process, really. I was constantly asked if I have caught a cold while people did not made any remarks about my voice sounding differently from before the surgery at month 4 and 5 even - people did not notice I had surgery, a higher pitch, a more feminine voice, but they noticed the hoarseness :(
If you decide to take the clonazepam, it will change the voice a bit again, and especially when that phase ends, the voice changes again. I had the impression that after the clonazepam, at about month 9 when the withdrawal of the drug was ending, my voice was really getting much better and less hoarse and had more volume - I lost a bit of that IMO when I had to restart clonazepam again, but there are long times when it is ok now, but occasionally I have hoarseness.
I believe the hoarseness comes when we use the new voice in a wrong way - especially when tensioning up some muscles that are supposed to relax - maybe out of old habits, old feminization techniques or some other reflex. I found that usually when I experimented a bit, also with the voice exercises and with my speech therapist, sometimes I would "find" a way to use my voice that sounded good - no hoarseness... but its hard to really stay in that place all the time for me somehow. Especially when I am stressed...

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Ritana

My pre-op relaxed pitch was around 170 hz. Around 2.5 months post op, it got in the range of 220-240 hz. On one instance I managed to reach 245 hz and a weak later, I got to 254hz. Now that my voice has started breaking, I'm down to 200 hz. I've been taking Clonazepam for the last 10 days, and my voice seems to be improving, so fingers crossed!!
A post-op woman
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anjaq

Are you sure the 170 Hz was truely the relaxed pre-transition voice? I had 134 Hz measured by Dr Kim for pre OP but I know that this is not what my pre transition voice was, it was lower. But I could not really let it drop that far anymore out of habit. Not in front of people.
Also pitch goes up and down with many things, especially average pitch - hoarseness and breathiness and it goes down, being tired and it is lower, being sad or depressed it goes down, having fear or being excited or speaking loud, it may go up. Using more voice melody and it goes up - I had to report a drive path for my last examination. Talk about what path I took with the car to the hospital. My post OP average pitch for that monotonous and boring text was at 145 Hz !! I did read my standard text afterwards and it was back up at 180 Hz...

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Ritana

My estimated statistical pitch according to Dr. Kim was 161 hz. My speech therapist regularly used to get 170- 175 hz as relaxed pitch. Dr kim reckoned i was subconsciouly straining even when producing a relaxed pitch. Therefore, he created a statistical pitch of 161 hz.
A post-op woman
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KayXo

Quote from: Ritana on April 19, 2016, 09:58:30 AMI've been taking Clonazepam for the last 10 days, and my voice seems to be improving, so fingers crossed!!

Yay! Really hopeful for you. :)
I am not a medical doctor, nor a scientist - opinions expressed by me on the subject of HRT are merely based on my own review of some of the scientific literature over the last decade or so, on anecdotal evidence from women in various discussion forums that I have come across, and my personal experience

On HRT since early 2004
Post-op since late 2005
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Ritana

A post-op woman
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Denjin

Wow, you're having good news x 2 at the moment. :)  This botox seems sort of terrible, but I guess it at least mostly prevents people from doing stupid stuff for a few weeks post surgery.  However, it still seems like it'd be of most use for rather severe tremors compared to what many here seem to have.
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Ritana

You may not get the same severe side effects as me as I had an exceptionally high dose of botox to discourage me from speaking. I certainly did feel like a dead soul since my return from Korea up until about 10 days ago!

My voice is still a bit hoarse, though!
A post-op woman
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Denjin

I'll keep my hopes up, Ritana.  I hope it doesn't get worse.

I tried my emergency words today (5 days left) and I can make sounds now, that's good.  Almost made me cry since it sounded so great, though.  Can't wait to see what it sounds like when I can actually speak properly!
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anjaq

Hey, thats great! When i tried my "emergency words" before the 4th week was over, it sounded horrible, so I did not want to repeat that... but it got better eventually ;)

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Denjin

Quote from: anjaq on April 21, 2016, 03:03:09 PM
Hey, thats great! When i tried my "emergency words" before the 4th week was over, it sounded horrible, so I did not want to repeat that... but it got better eventually ;)
Well, I was surprised how high it was considering I wasn't making any effort on pitch.  Still, it seems that speaking will be different.  You can't really play around on a few words per day, but it's not many days now!
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Denjin

Yay, I can speak now.  Although it sounds like I have terrible laryngitis and there is some sort of weird head vibration I can feel whenever I speak.  I guess this is due to swelling and/or botox?

Also, this voice progression image from Yeson has to be bollocks, doesn't it?
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anjaq

I do not really believe that image either. For most it seems more like right after surgery, or basically within the first 4 weeks, base pitch changed by a big part of what it overall changes, afterwards some pitch change can occur from swelling going down, but that is mostly due to the hoarseness also lowering pitch and the hoarseness needs time to fade. Some patients had sudden pitch increases later on, but the base pitch seems to be set right away, the changes shown in the graph seem to me rather to be the average speaking pitch levels of patients and they depend to a large degree on getting used to the new voice, using it properly and such things - only ion the first weeks I believe there is a real increase due to the swelling going down.

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Denjin

Yeah, I can see that being related to people getting use to and then using their new voice properly I suppose.  Or, just trying to keep people from freaking out at first since many probably need time to get used to the voice?

At four weeks, I can tell my voice is higher but it won't work in a full range yet.  Plus, I don't have the ability to really try out the range, either... I guess over time I'll be able to find out what works best.
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anjaq

15 month update:
today (relaxed and with some conscious prosody)
http://vocaroo.com/i/s0TDk4KlfcYX
http://vocaroo.com/i/s1I7Bx59UzZ2

pre OP:
relaxed:
http://vocaroo.com/i/s1I7Bx59UzZ2
http://vocaroo.com/i/s0u0Yz4iNw81
http://vocaroo.com/i/s0k4ym82cPEA
with a lot of effort:
http://vocaroo.com/i/s1r5atoli4uu

I think I can be happy :)

Admittely when not reading but just talking, pitch drops a bit, but not that much anymore.
Readings are: Pre OP ranging from 120-160 Hz, now 190-210 Hz.

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Denjin

Yes, it does sound better.  More natural and the 'texture' is somehow different from before, too.
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anjaq

Ok, I was told the recordings from yesterday are not good - I speak too low volume and "whisper"... So I did 2 new ones.
http://vocaroo.com/i/s0YxkdPlFPle
http://vocaroo.com/i/s0W9k8H1x5LG
Its about 180-190 Hz on average (single sentences range from 160 to 220 Hz when averaged)

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