Successful technology to change one's gender identity--is it possible?

[Futurist]

Do you think that we will ever develop successful technology to change one's gender identity?

Basically, the reason that I am asking this question is this: While I certainly want to become an extremely feminine eunuch and would certainly be extremely pleased if I will be successful in regards to this, I sometimes yearn for more. To elaborate on this, I frequently cross-dream about the idea of myself be(com)ing a lesbian or strongly lesbian-leaning trans-woman. Indeed, while I am certainly not a woman and generally prefer male pronouns, I nevertheless often want to become a trans-woman (with a female brain/mind and everything). I don't know what the reason for this is; indeed, I simply like trans-women so much that I want to become one. Anyway, while I have certainly made peace with who I actually am (specifically a genderqueer person/demi-guy), my cross-dreaming certainly hasn't gone away and hasn't even become any less frequent than it was before. Thus, I am certainly extremely curious about people's thoughts and responses to this question of mine.

[Ms Grace]

I'm confused and not sure you are asking the right question - if I changed my gender identity it would mean that I identified as male, and I don't like the idea of that at all.

[Futurist]

I'm confused and not sure you are asking the right question - if I changed my gender identity it would mean that I identified as male, and I don't like the idea of that at all.

Hang on--why exactly am I not asking the right question here? After all, while most people, including yourself, would probably disagree with me in regards to this, I myself would certainly enjoy changing my gender identity if my current sexuality will be completely unchanged.

[Futurist]

Indeed, why exactly shouldn't I be able to wish that I was a trans-woman?

[Ms Grace]

I seriously have no idea what you mean - of course you can identify as a trans woman if you want to. Personally I identify as a woman, but because I'm genetically male that makes me a trans woman. I'm not sure why you need technology to change how you identify if you already want to identify that way just identify as it.

[Futurist]

I seriously have no idea what you mean - of course you can identify as a trans woman if you want to. Personally I identify as a woman, but because I'm genetically male that makes me a trans woman. I'm not sure why you need technology to change how you identify if you already want to identify that way just identify as it.

That's the thing, though--I don't currently identify as a trans-woman. Rather, I identify as an aspiring feminine eunuch/genderqueer person/demi-guy. However, I would certainly eventually like to become a trans-woman--if not now, then eventually!

Indeed, think of it as me having such a strong emotional and romantic attraction to trans-women than I myself want to become a trans-woman) in spite of the fact that I am certainly not a trans-woman (right now)).

[Futurist]

Frankly, let me try explaining it to you another way--I can imagine what my dream woman looks like, correct? Well, I am simply taking it one step further and imposing my dream woman onto myself. Indeed, think of my cross-dreaming as an autoromantic inclination on my own part.

[Deborah]

I think this question is impossible to answer right now because beyond a person's intrinsic knowledge of who they are, the meaning of gender identity is not known. Is it simply a set of instincts?  Does it include brain mapping to body parts?  Are there aspects to it we haven't determined yet? 

Secondly, the relation of the brain and its structure to gender identity remains unknown beyond general terms.

And thirdly, there is no scientific and metaphysical consensus on the relationship between the brain and the mind.

Maybe one day the answers to these questions will be discovered.  Then we can know whether or not this thing called identity can be switched back and forth with some procedure or drug.

One important issue though is the ethics of such a thing.  Identity would seem to be a key component of self.  If identity were to change then a new self is created.  But if a new self takes the place of the old then what happens to the old self?  Is that self annihilated?  I have thought a lot on this in the past and I have always felt that if I had the power to make this change of identity it would in effect kill the self that I am now.  "I" as a self-conscious being would simply cease to exist.  While the body remains animate the self is gone.  To me this idea is as instinctually repulsive as is the idea of becoming a zombie.

So maybe this question is too complex to be thought of simply in terms of a switch.  If it were to suddenly become possible though I'm pretty sure that I would not want to do it.


Sapere Aude

[Futurist]

I think this question is impossible to answer right now because beyond a person's intrinsic knowledge of who they are, the meaning of gender identity is not known. Is it simply a set of instincts?  Does it include brain mapping to body parts?  Are there aspects to it we haven't determined yet? 

Secondly, the relation of the brain and its structure to gender identity remains unknown beyond general terms.

And thirdly, there is no scientific and metaphysical consensus on the relationship between the brain and the mind.

Maybe one day the answers to these questions will be discovered.  Then we can know whether or not this thing called identity can be switched back and forth with some procedure or drug.

OK.

One important issue though is the ethics of such a thing.  Identity would seem to be a key component of self.  If identity were to change then a new self is created.  But if a new self takes the place of the old then what happens to the old self?  Is that self annihilated?  I have thought a lot on this in the past and I have always felt that if I had the power to make this change of identity it would in effect kill the self that I am now.  "I" as a self-conscious being would simply cease to exist.  While the body remains animate the self is gone.  To me this idea is as instinctually repulsive as is the idea of becoming a zombie.

So maybe this question is too complex to be thought of simply in terms of a switch.  If it were to suddenly become possible though I'm pretty sure that I would not want to do it.


Sapere Aude

Yeah, I certainly understand why exactly many people, including yourself, wouldn't want to do this. However, I myself certainly appear to be an exception to the rule in regards to this. Indeed, it's not so much that I hate my current self; rather, I simply view my current self as being inferior to the self that I want and desire.

[suzifrommd]

No one has ever found a way to change anyone's gender identity. Since it would involve rewiring your brain, I think it unlikely.

That's the thing, though--I don't currently identify as a trans-woman. Rather, I identify as an aspiring feminine eunuch/genderqueer person/demi-guy. However, I would certainly eventually like to become a trans-woman--if not now, then eventually!

Indeed, think of it as me having such a strong emotional and romantic attraction to trans-women than I myself want to become a trans-woman) in spite of the fact that I am certainly not a trans-woman (right now)).

Is it possible that your strong desire to become a trans woman is an indication that you are one? That you experience being a trans woman by feeling like a feminine eunuch/genderqueer person/demi-guy?

I'm definitely a trans woman, but I feel like part-male/part-female/part-agender genderfluid.

[Serverlan]

I can imagine what my dream woman looks like... I am simply taking it one step further and imposing my dream woman onto myself.

So you're someone who was male assigned at birth and who desires to become the woman of your dreams?

Welcome to the club.

[Futurist]

No one has ever found a way to change anyone's gender identity. Since it would involve rewiring your brain, I think it unlikely.

Can't rewiring one's brain eventually become possible, though?

Is it possible that your strong desire to become a trans woman is an indication that you are one? That you experience being a trans woman by feeling like a feminine eunuch/genderqueer person/demi-guy?

Frankly, this is probably very unlikely. After all, I really do enjoy living as a male; indeed, I simply strongly dislike and strongly detest certain aspects of my body.

I'm definitely a trans woman, but I feel like part-male/part-female/part-agender genderfluid.

OK.

[Futurist]

So you're someone who was male assigned at birth and who desires to become the woman of your dreams?

Welcome to the club.

Except I also generally prefer male pronouns. In turn, this appears to make me very different from trans-women.

[Tristyn]

I am confused by the question of this thread, also, Grace.

At first, I thought the creator of this thread meant would it ever be possible to change our biological/chromosomal sex. The very thing that is "wrong" with our bodies for many of us. To change our gender identity sounds like brainwashing. That sounds like what my family already tries or would like to do on a daily basis if I ever let them get close enough...and that ain't gonna happen, ever....

Honestly, I don't like having a gender identity that is not the one I was assigned to because its hard to be different.......and people around me, no matter how much I try to trans 101 them to death, still think I am "daring to be different" when I am really just being who I am to feel like a real human being instead of a mechanical doll.

[Tysilio]

Can't rewiring one's brain eventually become possible, though?

Our brains are "rewired," in a sense, every time we learn something or have a new experience. But tinkering directly with a brain and achieving anything useful, much less deliberately altering something as complex as gender identity, is about as likely as faster-than-light interstellar travel. Make of that what you will.

[roxie rudi]

Thank the cosmos for human social propensities and our natal communicative abilities for this fantastic website because it is beyond merely helpful to those of us born with mis-matched physically and psychologically apparent identities. I was born with a boy's body but I know I am the woman trapped inside this and RIGHT NOW I am in the process of sorting it out to the best of western humanities' popularly available technology. However while none of us on this forum are thick heads I think it perhaps most helpful to address your  question to a consulting psyche in collaboration with various emails aimed at the forefront of medical science.

Sorry Futurist, forgive me, but I am unsure what it is that you REALLY wish to ask. Am I (or our other sisters and brothers here) missing something?

Anyways, bye bye and I hope I'm not being a silly airheaded girl,
hoping you find your answer,
ciao bella,
Roxanne.

[AbbyKat]

I seriously have no idea what you mean - of course you can identify as a trans woman if you want to. Personally I identify as a woman, but because I'm genetically male that makes me a trans woman. I'm not sure why you need technology to change how you identify if you already want to identify that way just identify as it.

I'm actually more confused by what you are saying.  Are you saying you chose to identify as a woman?

Personally, as a transwoman, I would have loved to have changed my gender identity to that of a man when growing up.  It's not like I am transitioning because I don't want to identify as a male.

Does that make more sense?

[AbbyKat]

Do you think that we will ever develop successful technology to change one's gender identity?

Basically, the reason that I am asking this question is this: While I certainly want to become an extremely feminine eunuch and would certainly be extremely pleased if I will be successful in regards to this, I sometimes yearn for more. To elaborate on this, I frequently cross-dream about the idea of myself be(com)ing a lesbian or strongly lesbian-leaning trans-woman. Indeed, while I am certainly not a woman and generally prefer male pronouns, I nevertheless often want to become a trans-woman (with a female brain/mind and everything). I don't know what the reason for this is; indeed, I simply like trans-women so much that I want to become one. Anyway, while I have certainly made peace with who I actually am (specifically a genderqueer person/demi-guy), my cross-dreaming certainly hasn't gone away and hasn't even become any less frequent than it was before. Thus, I am certainly extremely curious about people's thoughts and responses to this question of mine.

I totally get what you are asking.  I don't relate to your reasons for asking it but I get the question.  The answer is "no". 

If they could, there would be anybody transitioning (or at least gender dysphoria).

[Serverlan]

I totally get what you are asking.  I don't relate to your reasons for asking it but I get the question.  The answer is "no". 

If they could, there would be anybody transitioning (or at least gender dysphoria).

Think you could explain what Futurist means, then, as I have no idea.

[AbbyKat]

Think you could explain what Futurist means, then, as I have no idea.

I'm not exactly sure what he is talking about as far as his reason for asking but his question makes sense.  He is asking if there will ever be a way to essentially change your brain's gender.

Gender dysphoria is caused, for the most part, by your brain expecting to have a body that doesn't match what you are assigned to at birth.  Everybody has gender identity, it's just that cisgender folk don't ever have to think about it.

What he is asking is if there is a way to change that.  I wish they could since that would give people who suffer from gender dysphoria another option for treatment.  The goal for treatment is to have your brain align with your body and physically transitioning is the only option for that.  If there were some neurological procedure that would make your brain "transition" instead of your body, I think many people would go for it.  I probably would have.