Trigger. Lesbian + Transman Relationship.

[Matti]

Hello fellas.
I hope I dont trigger anyone with my post or make anyone insecure. I just would like to hear some others opinions on this subject.
Everywhere lately I read so much negative content towards the Transgender community and lately while informing myself with my partner about events at the LGBT center I notice things being more complicated.

My question at the moment: Can a lesbian be together with a transman? And it being socially acceptable?

The last 2 years have been a dream for me in finding my relationship with my partner. We both seems to fit like puzzle pieces and we have gone through hell and back (I laid on my death bed for 2 months with liver failure, and she was in a wheel chair with busted knees for half a year and so much more.) She knew going into a relationship with me that I would most likely transtion to a Man. The man I really am. She respects ever aspact of me and refers to me in all the correct manners. Just as I respect her, for saying, I'm lesbian and you are only expection.

I'm just very shocked, about the negativity she and I become by a community we spent a long time of and also by long term friends of hers. I don't understand that if we as partners can look passed all the labels/standards/etc....why do others judge?

Maybe I am missing something very important here or I am blind?
What are your opinions on the subject? Thank you for any answers you all might have! Have a decent day.
Matt.

[WorkingOnThomas]

Whether it works or not is up to you. Yeah, you're probably going to catch a lot of crap from people who don't like to see their little boxes and labels upended. Too bad for them. Life is more complicated than they know. Personally, I think they should just smile, say 'congratulations on finding each other' and close their yaps. Since starting my transition, I've had a lot of stuff hurled my way by so-called feminists, and so-called friends. They've also chosen to criticise my girlfriend (who is mtf). All I can do is ignore it.

[FTMax]

I don't see a problem with it. I think the social acceptability depends on the community you're in at the time. I think the trans community is much less likely to have an issue with you dating a lesbian than the likelihood of the lesbian community having an issue with a lesbian dating a transman. It really does depend on the individuals involved though. IME, it is a certain branch of feminism that creates a lot of negative feelings about transgender men and they have HUGE issues with it - both with us for transitioning as AFAB people being attracted to women, and to women who would identify as lesbians but still date us.

Chase Ross has a good video about this on YouTube.

[invisiblemonsters]

if you were together before you transitioned or whatever, i think it's different. however, if a trans man is still in womens spaces and actively seeks relationships with lesbians, i think that is where the problem lies. why would a trans man be in womens spaces (with the exception of safety concerns, obviously)? why would a trans man actively seek out a lesbian to date, invalidating his identity and even hers? it goes against the whole purpose of being seen as a man. i get WHY people would but i don't agree with it.

i wouldn't date a lesbian because it would make me feel really dysphoric. i am a straight man and i wanna be with a woman who likes men (whether she is bi, straight, whatever, as long as she likes men and would see me as a man). i spent too long wanting to be seen as a man and accepted as a man to deal with people thinking i'm just some lesbian. them seeing me as a lesbian is probably unlikely because i have facial hair, etc. but because of that, i also don't want people to think my lesbian partner is with a man if she is committed to her lesbian label and a proud lesbian. i think that can cause friction and make her feel as if her identity isn't being validated which causes issues in the relationship (i feel this can also happen with straight women who date trans men too). people in the LGBT community usually take awhile to accept who they are, and yes everyone else including the own community tries to invalidate them for going against the "norm" like a lesbian dating a trans man. "oh, you sure you're a man? are you sure you're a lesbian?" so idk.

[FTMDiaries]

I know several couples in your situation: where they started out in a lesbian relationship, then one transitioned to male but they kept their relationship, often with the woman still identifying as a lesbian (albeit a lesbian who is in a relationship with a man). I even know one couple where they both started out as lesbians, and then both transitioned to male and are now in a gay male relationship. There are all sorts of possibilities out there: if you love someone, who cares what the rest of the world thinks?

The truth is that the human species is bisexual in nature. Most of us lean more towards one end of the spectrum than the other - but that doesn't mean we can't dabble in the other side if someone takes our fancy. Your girlfriend may identify as lesbian but she may still be attracted to you after transition. She might also still identify as lesbian, but that is her identity - not yours - so it doesn't have to define anything about you.

Personally, I would find it problematic if a straight guy were to be interested in me, because I would feel that would invalidate me as a man. That would just be reducing me to a bunch of body parts rather than respecting me as an individual. It also gives transphobes ammunition with which they can accuse us of being 'really' of our birth sex so they can further invalidate us. For these reasons, I find the whole concept rather problematic - but that shouldn't stop anyone from living their lives as they see fit.

[Matti]

Since my pc is down I apologize for not being able to quote things like I would like to, but thanks for your replies til now!
It is interesting to hear the different opinions people have and how it comes across. In situations like this, I notice how I am again really different in trains of thought. I am a late bloomer tho....which involved alot of therapy.
I do, must admit, have a hard time understanding when people feel looked down upon when someone ends up loving your person and not the outter shell.
At the end of the day, we are souls and the outter shell is a house.
(Damn I really need to work on expressing myself.... -.- )

[Kylo]

In the end it is between you two. It's nobody else's business. Hell, people will find anything to moan about when it comes to other people's relationships. I've had plenty of that even before I came out and my relationships appeared "straight" to all intents and purposes to the outside onlooker. People still found something to roll their eyes at. Forget them.

[Contravene]

It all comes down to how comfortable you are with her referring to you as her "exception" and how comfortable you both are with certain labels. I'm sure there are lesbians who date cis men as their exceptions too so I don't see it as being disrespectful since she is correctly referring to you as male.

In most of the instances I've seen or heard the transman gets offended when his girlfriend still considers herself a lesbian despite him being male because she's deliberately disregarding his identity and misgendering him just to hang onto a stupid label. That's why that kind of situation is offensive. But your girlfriend doesn't seem to be doing that. It seems to me it's more like "I'm a lesbian and usually attracted to girls but I love this guy so much that he's the exception that." So I don't think that's offensive at all, she doesn't consider you to be a woman.

[Matti]

It all comes down to how comfortable you are with her referring to you as her "exception" and how comfortable you both are with certain labels. I'm sure there are lesbians who date cis men as their exceptions too so I don't see it as being disrespectful since she is correctly referring to you as male.

In most of the instances I've seen or heard the transman gets offended when his girlfriend still considers herself a lesbian despite him being male because she's deliberately disregarding his identity and misgendering him just to hang onto a stupid label. That's why that kind of situation is offensive. But your girlfriend doesn't seem to be doing that. It seems to me it's more like "I'm a lesbian and usually attracted to girls but I love this guy so much that he's the exception that." So I don't think that's offensive at all, she doesn't consider you to be a woman.

This! Thank you. This was a big pull up.

[Peep]

I agree - this situation only becomes an issue if she's using the label against your will. If any other trans guys are upset by it, tell them that you both know and respect how you both identify and that's what's important.

[cindianna_jones]

If you love someone does it really matter what other people think?

[Feminator]

It depends on the label and how comfortable with their sexuality they are. I identify as Queer Femme, which  technically is a 'type' of lesbian as my preference is clearly female. However, my wife is trans and non binary, and even if they chose to transition 100% male, which currently being decided upon by them, it would not change my label or identity. I don't give a ninny toot weeny what society chooses to call me, I know I am a Queer Femme, and no matter whom I love or whom I sleep with or even if I am alone in this life, I will ALWAYS be a Queer Femme. My choice of partners does not define me.

[Devlyn]

It depends on the label and how comfortable with their sexuality they are. I identify as Queer Femme, which  technically is a 'type' of lesbian as my preference is clearly female. However, my wife is trans and non binary, and even if they chose to transition 100% male, which currently being decided upon by them, it would not change my label or identity. I don't give a ninny toot weeny what society chooses to call me, I know I am a Queer Femme, and no matter whom I love or whom I sleep with or even if I am alone in this life, I will ALWAYS be a Queer Femme. My choice of partners does not define me.

DING DING DING! We have a winner in todays "Make Devlyn Smile" contest! 

Hugs, Devlyn

[Brandon]

I mean I personally wouldn't do it, I am a man so why would I date a lesbian, the definition of a lesbian is a woman who is physically, sexually and emotionally attracted to other women, I do not agree with all that sexuality is fluid nonsense its one or the other unless you are bisexual. Now its different if you were to together before transition but even then why? Most lesbians wouldn't date biological men so that comes off as offensive tbh and what's funny is when men hit on lesbians and say they can turn a women straight they will get all mad because they are offended but trans men are an exception for some reason. Makes no since to me. I mean its whatever floats your boat but I only date bisexual girls and straight girls.

[Cindy]

 

I think it is time to be very careful here and to think about what you post.

To suggest in a Forum of Gender Diverse people that you do not accept is a rather dumb point of view.

I really don't care on preferences on who you date but if you ever suggest a woman or a man or a non-binary is lesser to you then we will have words.

Warning to all.

Cindy

[Contravene]

I mean I personally wouldn't do it, I am a man so why would I date a lesbian, the definition of a lesbian is a woman who is physically, sexually and emotionally attracted to other women, I do not agree with all that sexuality is fluid nonsense its one or the other unless you are bisexual. Now its different if you gutenberg were to together before transition but even then why? Most lesbians wouldn't date biological men so that comes off as offensive tbh and what's funny is when men hit on lesbians and say they can turn a women straight they will get all mad because they are offended but trans men are an exception for some reason. Makes no since to me. I mean its whatever floats your boat but I only date bisexual girls and straight girls.

Saying that sexuality can only be "one or the other" and can't change is like saying a person can only be male or female and can't change from their birth gender. As transmen we both know (or at least should know) how ridiculous that notion is.

[Matti]

I think it is time to be very careful here and to think about what you post.

To suggest in a Forum of Gender Diverse people that you do not accept is a rather dumb point of view.

I really don't care on preferences on who you date but if you ever suggest a woman or a man or a non-binary is lesser to you then we will have words.

Warning to all.

Cindy

I hope I didnt say anything wrong! I didnt want anyone to feel harmed or lesser of....Sorry

[AnxietyDisord3r]

I am so sorry you are facing rejection in your community. I can't even pretend to say I "get" lesbian culture, but it does seem to go through these authoritarian phases. It's hateful and wrong but here we go again. People aren't trying to understand that sexuality is complicated and some people do have exceptions. (And some don't ... I'm a "gold star" in their book except for the trans thing, but, uh, ya know, that's a big thing. There are frankly very, very few exclusive lesbians who aren't closeted transmen and they're far outnumbered by every flavor of bisexual woman. It's pure hatefulness to try to hold other people in the queer women's community to some sort of impossible standard of sexual purity. What is this, a convent?)

I've seen the hate on tumblr and I'm sure it's reflected elsewhere. I would look for meatspace community where there are more bi/pan/trans people around and stay away from WYYYMYYYN ONLYYY spaces. JM2C.

[AnxietyDisord3r]

I don't think bi and mono sexual people are different species. I hear this "sexual orientation isn't fluid unless you're bi". Well, I think lifetime sexual fluidity* of the sort bi people experience probably, yeah, makes you bi, but I also think many if not most monosexual people have a degree of flexibility in their sexuality that our culture doesn't really acknowledge. There was that essay in the NYT by a guy who was lifelong hetero and fell in love with a man. Falling in love is a different set of brain functions than getting a stiffy, okay? It does happen.


*-precessing back and forth between feeling as if you're gay or straight, which can take days, weeks, months, or years

[AnxietyDisord3r]

I don't see a problem with it. I think the social acceptability depends on the community you're in at the time. I think the trans community is much less likely to have an issue with you dating a lesbian than the likelihood of the lesbian community having an issue with a lesbian dating a transman. It really does depend on the individuals involved though. IME, it is a certain branch of feminism that creates a lot of negative feelings about transgender men and they have HUGE issues with it - both with us for transitioning as AFAB people being attracted to women, and to women who would identify as lesbians but still date us.

Chase Ross has a good video about this on YouTube.

Chase usually has something insightful to say.

Let's not kid ourselves that the FTM community is as pure as the driven snow here because there is a clique on Tumblr called truscum that goes out of its way to harass lesbians who date transmen. They literally stake out certain tags and then jump on people who commit what they consider to be thoughtcrimes.